Posts by humbled

15

What you were TOLD vs. what Jesus SAID: getting SAVED

by humbled in

could jesus have shown us the way to healing, preservation, wholeness but we turned ministry his into a theological nightmare?.

just wondering if punkofnice and my family will be bonding in hell together 'cause they aren't "saved".. and wondering if i really am an apostate..

humbled

Right, so we listen to him when we hear him.

What if what some hear is not what Jesus says--but what others TELL them he meant/said.

What if the reason some are deaf is because they really ARE NOT HEARING WHAT JESUS SAID.

What then?

15

What you were TOLD vs. what Jesus SAID: getting SAVED

by humbled in

could jesus have shown us the way to healing, preservation, wholeness but we turned ministry his into a theological nightmare?.

just wondering if punkofnice and my family will be bonding in hell together 'cause they aren't "saved".. and wondering if i really am an apostate..

humbled

Could Jesus have shown us the way to healing, preservation, wholeness but we turned ministry his into a theological nightmare?

Just wondering if punkofnice and my family will be bonding in hell together 'cause they aren't "saved".

And wondering if I really AM an apostate.

11

Outside of the Middle East... did God just hate everyone else?

by sosoconfused in

this is one thing that i just can not seem to resolve in my mind and i want people... in particular diehard christians to please explain something to me.. we have humans on 7 continents for thousands of years before the bible was written and in many places for 2000 years after the bible was written had no concept of christianity at all.

never hearing of jesus or reading the book of revelation.

they had sophisticated religious belilefs in many cases - and venerated god or gods and no doubt these people really wanted to please these dieties.

humbled

I have been following your line of comment/inquirey and that's why I pecked out my response.

I have wondered and wandered in those no-man's-land of questions, too. Thanks for saying something back to me.

Maeve

11

Outside of the Middle East... did God just hate everyone else?

by sosoconfused in

this is one thing that i just can not seem to resolve in my mind and i want people... in particular diehard christians to please explain something to me.. we have humans on 7 continents for thousands of years before the bible was written and in many places for 2000 years after the bible was written had no concept of christianity at all.

never hearing of jesus or reading the book of revelation.

they had sophisticated religious belilefs in many cases - and venerated god or gods and no doubt these people really wanted to please these dieties.

humbled

Dear soso,

same questions made me throw out theology of any organized religion--they are always exclusive.

So I have wondered if Jesus in saying (if he said) "I have been sent to none but the lost sheep of Israel" and his attempt to remind them that claiming to be children of Abraham they needed to act like Abraham's children"through whom all the nations of the world will be blessed, because you listened to my voice". Was he doing as other prophets in other lands and cultures done---spoken to THEIR people, referencing THEIR traditions to call them to a shared brotherhood?

A story that made me wonder is that one told in Mark 9:38 to chapter's end. Jesus said to not hassle anyone who wasn't following the group with him. "anyone who is not against us is for us".

What!

Jesus you can't develop a tight cult following like that! Think of the screwed up stuff that can happen if you aren't right there--if we aren't there--to kick their ass.

Two years ago my plane was stuck in the Charlotte, NC airport on Thanksgiving evening FOR HOURS. Profiling was responsible. 7 middle eastern students had been invited by the United Arab Emirates Embassy in Washington, DC to Thanksgiving dinner, American style, in recognition of their good grades and hard work. They didn't know one another having come from all over the U.S. but , once they arrived at this last stop before DC, they saw one another(profiling, you know :)they did too) and a woman reported them to authorities as a possible terrorist threat.

I know exactly this background as I sat next to one of the "terrorists" as the drama slowly unfolded. (all of us missed our Thanksgiving dinners)

The good thing at the end, my seat-mate, named "Hadeff" talked to me and showed me the pictures on his samrt phone of his mom, family etc. He asked me about mine. I saw a young man of great peace and dignity go through a humiliating situation along with the other 6 young people. (This was not the first time this had happened to him or to sme of the others) Toward the end I told him that the good god of us all had spoken, it is said, to the old father of Jewish, Muslim and Christian faiths--Abraham. Abraham listened, though fallible, though uncertain, not to religious leaders, but to only god as HE heard him speak. Was this not what it is to be blessed as a child of Abraham?

I told Hadeff that in a world of hatreds it is well to know that we are blessed NOT to follow the hatreds of others--even religious leaders-- but the single voice of a god who loves us all.

That is what I understand of god--he doesn't hate everybody at all and he wants us to share that as best we can.

Maeve

26

God will forgive me....apparently

by punkofnice in

i left the jws and went to a baptist church which was far better than anything i'd known before having been born into the dangerous cult of the watchtower corporation.. having travelled a path of spirituallity i have concluded that there is no god evident to me.

evolution?

i have no idea...i just live my life knowing that when i die there is nothing after it.

humbled

How would god have anything but love for persons that persist in doing good without faith in a loving god? To have no hope of help in doing right --is more than I can do. When I am overwhelmed I ask for god's help.

My children, who are adults, and my husband run the gamut from agnostics to atheist. It is not possible that they are condemned for a lack of belief. My years as a JW certainly were no help as a model for relating to God--It nearly poisoned my own faith out of existence.

I enjoy your spirit, punkofnice. I think you should forgive god his tresspasses as he forgives yours ;-)

Maeve

122

Theists - Why does Morality require the existence of God?

by cantleave in

"without god in your life, you cannot have a moral compass",,,, please explain to me why you think that should be so?

.

humbled

Good morning, sunshine.

Maeve

7

For those who still beleive in a God

by Kool Jo in

jw
friends

for those who still beleive in a god...does he answer prayers or does he choose who to answer?.

humbled

I believe in the one who is Good, as Jesus said once. I believe there is that Good One because I have had very difficult problems resolved in answer to prayer.

The first time I really prayed with intention,I was 24 tears old. I kinda believed in God but without any fervor at all. But I needed help so I began to ask for him to help me. Eventually I realized that my biggest problem was to be spiritually healed. But I had conditions to be met.I didn't get answers from God during that time.

In a few years I was more desperate. So I began what became a campaign. Later I told my kids I was hammering on God's toes. Intensely for weeks.

I could never have imagined nor engineered the events that broke me apart and healed my soul or spirit (pick what you like).

As a result I have struggled on from that time wanting to live in a good relationship to that Goodness. Unfortunately I kept going to Church and getting in trouble along the way.

I don't pray so formally. Yet I have had some wonderful answers to prayer that again let me know the power and presence of that One. But also--I have had HORRENDOUS thing go on for which I cannot even frame a request, even an idea of a remedy.

I ask for the capacity to love and the ability to act, to DO when I need to. And to wait when I should do that.

My husband doesn't pray and frankly is impatient with all things to do with "God-talk".Because God did NOT answer his prayers for proof of His existence at a critical time in my husband's life, he believes no longer that there is a God.

So what should I make of that? I do not know--yet.

34

"Do not be called teachers"--Doesn't Jesus OUTLAW all organized religion?

by humbled in

jw's and other churches all set up housekeeping in different theological areas.

some one person can't believe any more what their church is saying, gets a different "take" on god, and......starts trying to convince others to follow them and everything they teach.. nothing new about that.

but why are so many of us blind to this scenario: we allow that some people get to contemplate other thoughts and others are not allowed.only some lead and everyone else must follow or be thrown out.

humbled

Isadore---I pm'd you.

34

"Do not be called teachers"--Doesn't Jesus OUTLAW all organized religion?

by humbled in

jw's and other churches all set up housekeeping in different theological areas.

some one person can't believe any more what their church is saying, gets a different "take" on god, and......starts trying to convince others to follow them and everything they teach.. nothing new about that.

but why are so many of us blind to this scenario: we allow that some people get to contemplate other thoughts and others are not allowed.only some lead and everyone else must follow or be thrown out.

humbled

Tylinbrando,

That's a good question:

Put everyone that believed in Christ alone without the control of religion on an island. Would it work?

Tec made an early observation-- organized religion has been operating institutional christianity for 2000 years and what we have now is big "C"Chaos for big "C"Church.

Before official orthodoxy and creed was thrashed out 300 or so years after Jesus died (not that this meant certain teachings were "right" just because the Roman government backed certain churchmen) there were Jesus stories and Jesus followers existing without authoritarian rule and without as much craziness as you might run into in any run-of-the-mill country church today. The religious dogma hadn't developed for at least the earliest decades after Jesus. After all "by this all will know you are my disciples, if you have love among yourselves."

There is an interesting description of Christian meetings around 110 C.E. by a Roman administrator who prosecuted Christians. Google Pliny and the Christians if you don't already know about his letters to Emperor Trajan about what to do with Christians.

I suspect the early christians were doing okay without the soul-crushing dogma that was going to descend from on high a little later.

Then they would find torture and death again. Only it would be because they just hadn't been able to swallow the "New Light" that the theologians kept cooking up for them.

82

Why is God speaking in riddles?

by sosoconfused in

it seems for most of the bible that god spoke directly to people and told them what to do.

he wrote things on rocks.

he gave them laws.

humbled

I love Jesus' parables. No body messed with them, it seems--that is, to change them. And he made them so easy to remember. And they were never made into math problems for an elite few to solve for all the dumb bunnies.