Posts by StephaneLaliberte

99

Can you be a JW who does not have the GB as their leader?

by DoubtingThomas in

jw
friends

i am.. they are just fellow brothers, old and getting senile.... but enlightened, despite all the whining.....

StephaneLaliberte

but I'm to busy doing biblical research to read their endless publications...

Catholics have much more "publications" than the JWs. The number of publication is not equal to truth.

99

Can you be a JW who does not have the GB as their leader?

by DoubtingThomas in

jw
friends

i am.. they are just fellow brothers, old and getting senile.... but enlightened, despite all the whining.....

DoubtingThomas: Considering that they have been around for 50 years, examples of them admitting they are wrong on a specific instance should be easy to find. Please provide such examples to be taken seriously on this board.

99

Can you be a JW who does not have the GB as their leader?

by DoubtingThomas in

jw
friends

i am.. they are just fellow brothers, old and getting senile.... but enlightened, despite all the whining.....

StephaneLaliberte

DoubtingThomas: If you see the governing body as your fellow brothers, then you should also expect them to behave as any other brother in your congregation.

They don’t admit their sins/mistakes

Now, the governing body has admitted that it is not perfect as any other brothers. Would you accept a brother in your congregation that commits mistakes, says he’s imperfect, and never admits to any in particular? Since the Governing Body has been around for the last 50 years, plenty of mistakes must have been made, I mean, we’re all human right? So, there must also be plenty of examples where your fellow brothers admitted their mistakes, right? Afterall, isn’t confessing the first step to forgiveness?

They don’t tolerate anyone who disagrees with them

Imagine you are in a meeting where a brother gives a talk. He then says something you don’t agree with. You don’t recognize this teaching from either the bible or the governing body. So, after the meeting, you send an email to that brother asking him for clarifications. Rather than discussing the matter with you, he sends the draft of his talk back to you and says that you should find what you are looking for in there. If you don’t, then you must be too proudful to see it. You are shocked by the answer and try to pursue the conversation with him by sending another polite email. Turns out that this brother is the owner of a company that employs some of the local elders. Following Monday, the brother exerts his authority as a boss to get them to remove your privileges. The elders then contact you and tell you that as you’ve been causing division in the congregation, you can no longer be a pioneer, ministerial, etc.

How would you view that brother? Throughout the process, there has never been any candid and sincere conversation on the disagreement you had with the brother, even if it was small, perhaps even insignificant. Would that brother be good? Meek? Spiritual? Now, why should you treat the governing body (individually or collectively) any different? If they are your fellow brothers, they should also be subject to the same Christian values as everyone else in the congregation. Yet, you know full well that expressing doubts in there teaching results in similar treatment. Sometimes, even worse! They go tell your family and friends that they should cut all ties with you as you are an apostate!! And if they don't, THEY will be disfellowshipped! Again, throughout this entire process, it doesn’t matter what you disagreed on, the point is that you disagreed with them. Period. If you would not accept it from a brother, why accept it from them?

40

More cracks in the dam - WTS pleading for elders "in their early 20s"

by FFGhost in

jw
friends

i have another post here about how the wts is reeling from covid, as reflected in their abysmally catastrophic service report:.

https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/6315842470936576/annual-service-report-yet-another-analysis-big-trouble-wts.

here's another rupture showing.. in the latest "announcements and reminders" to elders, there is a paragraph with these sentences:.

StephaneLaliberte

By the way, this isn't a new thing. I know of two brothers that were named elders at 25. This was 30 and 20 years ago in Canada (Quebec and Ontario). One of them had attended Ministry School while the other was just a very nice young man.

40

More cracks in the dam - WTS pleading for elders "in their early 20s"

by FFGhost in

jw
friends

i have another post here about how the wts is reeling from covid, as reflected in their abysmally catastrophic service report:.

https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/6315842470936576/annual-service-report-yet-another-analysis-big-trouble-wts.

here's another rupture showing.. in the latest "announcements and reminders" to elders, there is a paragraph with these sentences:.

StephaneLaliberte

One of my uncles is a JW Elder, we still talk here and there. He respects my position as I respect his. One of the things he's found difficult over the years is that young people taking up the responsibilities are few and scarce.

That’s a sore sight when you’ve worked the majority of your life building up something that people don’t recognize as the same value you did. He had the truth in such high regard that he was willing to volunteer the equivalent of a part time job for years on end making significant sacrifices along the way. And now that he’s in retirement, he realizes that not that many want to pursue his work, somewhat invalidating all that time he spent working for the organization.

When you’re older, you want to look back to everything you’ve done in your life and feel validated by your close ones or community. However, that feeling isn’t there when the next generation doesn’t deem it worthy of their time.

I didn’t tell him that, but he does have a great example of why in front of him: Me. I’m the next generation but didn’t take on responsibilities as I could not agree with fundamental teachings. Primarily the disfellowshipping for petty “sins” (smoking/gambling) and the practice of shunning. Had they done away with these, chances are I’d still be in taking the lead.

Still I love my uncle and find it difficult to see him in that position.

7

I'm happy about the increase

by StephaneLaliberte in

i know its weird to say something like this on this forum, but its how i feel about it.

i feel that way cause i see that covid has taken a tole on my dad who's growing older.

knowing that this will come as good news to him is somewhat comforting to me.

StephaneLaliberte

I know its weird to say something like this on this forum, but its how I feel about it. I feel that way cause I see that COVID has taken a tole on my dad who's growing older. Knowing that this will come as good news to him is somewhat comforting to me. The last two years were difficult for him. He stopped making talks and didn't get much out the "truth". So I hope this little thing will give him some encouragement to keep moving forward in his life.

Of course, I'd be happy for the numbers to go down, out of spite for a group of man reigning over other's lives in the name of God. I'd like these numbers to cut down by half to "teach them a lesson". That people are wising up to their bullshit and their lies and heartlessness. But then, when I think of my Dad, it could destroy him. Other JWs I care about would pull through with much more ease, but not my dad. I know he gets depressed. I believe that deep down, he knows it's all BS, but he keeps trying to convince himself that he's in the wrong. The longer he waits to confront reality, the more of his life is passing by and the more an epiphany would hurt thinking of how much of his life has been waisted in that group rather then pursuing things that truly mattered to him.

Anyways... its really weird to feel this way.

20

Love one another intensely...avoid partiality

by RULES & REGULATIONS in

the watchtower—study edition | march 2020. study article 13. love one another intensely.

if we have intense “love for the whole association of brothers,” we will avoid being partial.

7 jesus urged us to keep treating others the way we want to be treated.

StephaneLaliberte

Such articles honorably try to foster friendship and good relationships across cultures and ages. However, the actual outcome is largely not what these articles aim for. This issue applies to all religions where members gather based on their shared faith.

Through the years, I noticed that after such articles would come out, people (including me), would reach out to people they normally didn’t hang out with. These attempts would often fail and result in shallow conversation. Both participants understood the conversation was a result of such articles about “Christian love” and felt a bit forced. Some would give up on these attempts while others would keep trying, appearing phony with many members of the congregations. This whole social endeavor generally ended right back to what people were doing before the articles, except that people judged each other a bit more.

I came to understand this social dilemma years back when I had a conversation with an elder. I confronted him on how the elders basically ignored me for over a year since I had joined their congregation. He started by asking for my forgiveness as he had failed his role as a “Shepard”, but then, provided a bit of a context so that I wouldn’t judge other brothers too harshly. He explained that his life was made up of a wife, children, job, elderly parents, being an elder and hunting. We had none of these things in common. Its easier to make friends with people when we have such things in common. Its just human nature.” In the following months, he invited me in service, gave me parts at the kingdom hall, talked with me after the meetings, etc. I always respected him for that. Yet, I understood that it didn’t come easy for him. He made the effort as he was an elder, it was his “responsibility”. Still, should such expectations apply to everyone in a congregation? Of course not!

Articles like these teach that having faith in common is sufficient for a great friendship. While this might be true for very active members, it will not be the case for most rank and files. Additional shared experiences and interests are needed and people will not become great friends simply because they believe in the same God. You can’t force friendship no more than you can force love and articles such as these don’t seem to set proper expectations.

Hence, in the picture seen above, the elderly brother should not look at the kids thinking: “They’re ignoring me”. He needs to think of what else he can do to have their attention; outside of “spiritual” stuff. Does he have a pool? A chalet? Can he run errands with a car? Does he offer any jobs? Does he offer his house as a place for service and offer coffee when they come in? Does he play chess? Does he have a cool basement with a big tv and mini bar? Does he know a lot about forestry? History? Science? Anything they don’t normally read about in the Watchtower and Awake? People need to understand that they need more than their faith to attract attention.

Ok, sure, the kids could go and great him, but that will generally be a somewhat forced and phony experience for all the reasons I mentioned above. Is this really any better than not saying hi at all?

13

Baldwiin, I did not pull the trigger or point the gun at anyone. LMFAO

by mickbobcat in

ya right because we all know if you let a gun sit on a table long enough it will get up and kill people on its own.

lmao what a total idiot douche nozzle liberal but i repeat myself.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/12/01/entertainment/alec-baldwin-interview/index.html.

StephaneLaliberte

"I let go of the hammer" on a gun you didn't personally verify if it was loaded. Criminal negligence.

To me, that's the same as driving 300 km/h and blaming someone else for changing in your lane at the last minute. You drive recklessly and cause death? You go to jail. You manipulate a deadly firearm recklessly and cause death? You go to jail.

9

Now question all these people disfellowshipped for adulteres marriage

by Yomama in

jw
friends

do they get apology for getting the boot?.

StephaneLaliberte

The act of getting remarried without scriptural grounds is still considered adultery and you'd likely be disfellowshipped as getting married is obviously a premediated act. However, the change lies in this:

Old spouses can no longer invalidate the new marriages by forgiving their spouse for "cheating" on them. The old marriage is broken and the new one is valid regardless of what they think. That does not change the fact that the person who got married again without scriptural grounds will face a Judicial Committee. Nice weeding gift. :)

16

Did you at one time Believe-that you were not going to die. Does your still in JW spouse still believe?

by pistolpete in

this magazine says it all!.

and many of the older jws believed at one point in their life that they would make it through the great tribulation and into the 1000 year reign of christ without dying.

which is why so many jws stayed in so long.. is the main reason why jws ignore all the child abuse, the end of door to door service, and the closing of kingdom hall for almost two years----because they still believe they will not die?.

StephaneLaliberte

Of course I believed I'd never die. That was one of the reasons I was so arrogant as a kid. I thought everyone around me would die and so, they were unimportant and I was dismissive of their input in my life. There is a saying that kids are raised by villages. However, as I believed most of the village would suffer the wrath of God, their opinion didn't matter any more than the rocks I kicked away as I walked to school.

The result was that I was completely disconnected from everyone even though I lived with everyone. I was the perfect product of JW's indoctrination.

I felt that way until I was about 18/19. I started studying other religions and while I still believed in my religion being the correct one, my view of God changed. It did not make any sense for me that a God of love would kill everyone solely on the fact that they were born into the wrong religion or wrong part of the world. At the same time, I realized that I would very much likely grow old and die in this world.

It was around that time that I started to have a sort of a death whish, driving like a crazy ass hole, hoping that I would inadvertently die in some big car accidents. There were other factors at play in my life at the time, but I can honestly say that the thought that I die and instantly wake up in paradise was very appeasing to me. I thought, if Armagedon doesn't come to the whole world, it could come tomorrow for me. I viewed death as some sort of time machine where my death would bring me into a future earthly paradise in the snap of a finger.

However, life didn't turn out that way. I had a very big accident and amazingly, got out without a scratch. Not so with my sister, she died in another car accident of her own making. When I saw the pain and suffering that caused to everyone around her, I felt I could no longer be careless with my life.

Years later, I came to the realization that the JWs were utterly wrong. Once I left, I also realized that the concept of God and life after death didn't make much sense either. So, here I am, in my 40s, married with children, enjoying life, understanding that all the struggles I go through are worth it for these small miracle moments in my life. Like watching my wife walk down the isle to get married. My kids giving me hugs. Heck, even enjoying the warmth of the sun in the summer while floating in a pool. Small perfect moments.