Posts by still

17

One easy question to stump a JW

by drew sagan in

for quite some time i have been tossing around the idea that there has to be a question out there, a question that can cut straight to the heart of what it means to question the watchtower.

last night while doing some mindless tasks i think that question may have come to me.

the question is: .

still_in74

It should be added that this exact example (and most of the rest of the Climax book) was so outlandish that even when I was a "devout" JW, I had a hard time swallowing it. Come to think of it, I think that book was one of the reasons I had my first doubts.

I have missed more Revelation studies than I have been to this time around. I am physically ill sitting there. People ramble off "comments" that they dont even understand and the conductor just says "good, good" and moves on.
The more I read this book the more I see how scriptures are so twisted and manipulated. You start out reading a scripture, and then over 4 or 5 paragraphs all those little "quotations" are added in - you know the ones, where the WTS quotes little snippets of scriptures that may or may not have anything to do with what your talking about... ? Ya, those ones. Then the mindless hals-asleep reader thinks that real scriptures are being cited to support the line of logic but in reality you are just being walked down a path that slowly changes direction without you even realizing it.
Little interjections like "recall a similar situation with..." and: "this reminds us of ...."
By the time you are done you are no where near where you started and the whole room is nodding their heads in appreciation the revealed truths!

Sorry if I am hi-jacking but I made this comment in another post about a rev. study ---- I have not been to one since this...

THIS IS WHERE I JUST SAT THERE STUNNED... THE REALIZATION THAT THIS SCRIPTURE HAD BEEN TWISTED TO THE POINT OF COMPLETE NON-RECOGNITION.

JOHN SAID- And I saw, and, look! the Lamb standing upon the Mount Zion, and with him a hundred and forty-four thousand having his name and the name of his Father written on their foreheads.” (Revelation 14:1) AND And I heard a sound out of heaven as the sound of many waters and as the sound of loud thunder; and the sound that I heard was as of singers who accompany themselves on the harp playing on their harps. And they are singing as if a new song before the throne and before the four living creatures and the elders; and no one was able to master that song but the hundred and forty-four thousand, who have been bought from the earth.” (Revelation 14:2, 3)

YET WE ARE TO BELIEVE THATTHE 144K WERE NOT REALLY THERE, BUT THERE FIGURATIVELY IN THAT THEY WERE DEFINITELY GOING TO BE THERE IN A HUNDRED YEARS OR MORE. PLUS, THEY ARENT REALLY ALL SINGING THE SONG IN HEAVEN BUTSOME OF THEM ARE ON EARTH, SOME IN HEAVEN, SOME POSSIBLY NOT EVEN BORN YET,BUT THESE ARE OR WILL EVENTUALLY SING ON EARTH WITH AHEAVENLY LIFE IN VIEWSO...

THEREFORE THEY ARE SYMBOLICALLY ALREADY IN HEAVEN WITH JESUS SINGING BEFORE THEMSELVES (THE ELDERS) EVENTHOUGH THEY ARENT THERE YET !!!! ???

This book has helped me to appreciate how much "guess work" goes into "new light" -- but what do you expect from ego-maniacs like Rutherford and Franz??

39

..Vending Machines and JW Assemblies..

by OUTLAW in

.."out of order"..no vending machine is complete at a jw assembly,without an "out of order" sign on it.....of course it`s not true..the machine works fine..it`s just one of the many lies jw`s are willing to accept from the wbt$.....although..this lie is extremely large and visible,it`s a frigg`n vending machine!..lol!

!.............does the management that rents the facilities to the wbt$,know the wbt$ is disabling them?....does the owners of the vending machines know the wbt$ is disabling them,and interfering with their right to do business in that facility?......could the wbt$ be sued for loss of vending machine business?.......wouldn`t it be fun to let the vending machine owners know their machines are being disabled,at jehovah`s witness assemblies?......it would mean more bad publicity for the wbt$ for lying and court cases they couldn`t win...................outlaw

still_in74

I've never seen "guards" but I have seen "out of order" signs or just brown paper towel taped over them.

I once saw a condemn dispensor covered up that way but with nothing written on it......... I got a chuckle out of that!

17

Blowing "BLOODGUILT" out of the water. Logically.

by Open mind in

for any lurkers who doubt that the wt does not use guilt & fear as key motivators consider the term "bloodguilt" as used in last sunday's wt.

in the very first paragraph it was mentioned that "failure to assume the responsibility of warning people of the choice that lies before them could result in our incurring bloodguilt.".

wt: "if you don't preach, you're gonna die.".

still_in74

Now, I feel bloodguilty to a degree... Those that joined as a result of my activity had their lives ruined, some to a greater extent than others, by the doctrines.

I brought a man into the "truth", within 2 years his wife left him and took the kids in a bitter divorce. This man became a very good friend of mine, when I think now what his life would be like had I never "called" on him it makes me feel ill.

59

Fidel Castro gives up power, what will happen?

by JK666 in

jw
friends

i am shallow!

will cohiba's and montecristo's get cheaper and more available in the u.s.?.

or any other thoughts from the deeper thinkers.. jk.

still_in74

boy, not one reply from JKK? hehe, did you think you would spark such an active thread??

59

Fidel Castro gives up power, what will happen?

by JK666 in

jw
friends

i am shallow!

will cohiba's and montecristo's get cheaper and more available in the u.s.?.

or any other thoughts from the deeper thinkers.. jk.

still_in74

Cuba had the highest standard of living in Latin America, and higher than several European nations of the time

we caught a glimpse of it while we were there. Old Havana is beautiful, the architecture is second to none. I visited Hemingways room where he stayed and wrote a couple novels, he returned year after year becuase of the view from his window. I dont blame him, the view is amazing.

59

Fidel Castro gives up power, what will happen?

by JK666 in

jw
friends

i am shallow!

will cohiba's and montecristo's get cheaper and more available in the u.s.?.

or any other thoughts from the deeper thinkers.. jk.

still_in74

Ok lets slow down here,

I am not saying Castro is good or right, I am only saying that the US isnt necessarily the answer to Cuba's problems.

For the record, when I travel to Cuba I give hundreds of dollars away directly to locals and and rural Cubans, we bring gifts for kids and give away half our clothing. We do see the downside at least to the extent that we can in the short time there.
My wife and I would love to see things change for the better in Cuba, we have friends that we keep in touch with there, but the US is in Mexico, Jamaica, DR, and other Carribean countries and these countries are still dealing with extreme levels of poverty, crime and corruption etc.

Cuba needs new governement yes, but they dont need corporate America taking over.

17

Blowing "BLOODGUILT" out of the water. Logically.

by Open mind in

for any lurkers who doubt that the wt does not use guilt & fear as key motivators consider the term "bloodguilt" as used in last sunday's wt.

in the very first paragraph it was mentioned that "failure to assume the responsibility of warning people of the choice that lies before them could result in our incurring bloodguilt.".

wt: "if you don't preach, you're gonna die.".

still_in74

They are moving into a time when their members are going to be a lot less excited and a lot more every day. Field Service is a reminder of where they used to be, not where they are going.

but we have more pioneers ! (only 50 & 70 hours now instead of 60 & 90)

we have more studies ! (door step studies count first time if read 1 paragraph from book/brochure at RV)

We have more publishers (elderly can count only 15 minutes per month to not be inactive)

Ever noticed how almost no one gets DF'd anymore? I know people that have had multiple affairs and no DF. I also know people who 15 years ago smoked 1 cigarette and got DF'd.
I guess you have to do what you can to keep the numbers looking good eh?

17

Blowing "BLOODGUILT" out of the water. Logically.

by Open mind in

for any lurkers who doubt that the wt does not use guilt & fear as key motivators consider the term "bloodguilt" as used in last sunday's wt.

in the very first paragraph it was mentioned that "failure to assume the responsibility of warning people of the choice that lies before them could result in our incurring bloodguilt.".

wt: "if you don't preach, you're gonna die.".

still_in74

I was always fascinated by this reasoning. Eventhough I bought into it. Wouldnt the stones cry out? Wouldnt "this good news be preached to the entire inhabited earth"?

I like your point about free will though, never really thought about that. Good point. How could my laziness be attached to the "wrong" free will choice of another as a punishable sin against god? Is god really going to run time indexed scenarios to determine who would have come in the "truth" if I had gone out in service last Saturday?

Well heres one: what about all those that go out and dont even try ? We all know that most go out and just kick the can for 2 hours. Take long drives to RV's and 45 min coffee breaks. Are these also bloodguilty for taking coffee breaks or not going out in the evening? In fact, if you dont pioneer wouldnt you be blood guilty? I mean lets think about it, Pioneers bring in the most studies/converts right?

Lately I have always taken any form of reasoning and applied it to various situations to expose the double standard human reasoning ALWAYS creates. If you apply this logic to this, then you must apply it to that. This will always expose the gaps and holes in the logic. Its very easy to crush any argument this way, or at least make it obvious that someone does not know what they are talking about. This is yet another case where this works.

Thanks OM! Still............

59

Fidel Castro gives up power, what will happen?

by JK666 in

jw
friends

i am shallow!

will cohiba's and montecristo's get cheaper and more available in the u.s.?.

or any other thoughts from the deeper thinkers.. jk.

still_in74

Let me add that Raul seems to be more favorable to opening relations witht he US. Perhaps with Fidel's passing the US will attempt to reach out.

I heard the opposite, that he was even more hard-line about the US

As for the US "reaching out" you must mean the US reaching out to consume all of Cuba's natural resources/Oil and to dominate the country through economic dependance of the American consumer right?
Don't take this the wrong way, but the reason Cuba is a great country to vacation is because corporate America has not been allowed to destroy/ruin it. Ask any non-american that has travelled to various islands in the Carribean and Mexico and then travelled to Cuba. They will all agree with that statement.
Maybe its just me, but I dont want to shop at Walmart and eat at McDonalds when I am in Cuba. America has a way of getting its own way, but then wasnt that the reason for the revolution in the first place?

59

Fidel Castro gives up power, what will happen?

by JK666 in

jw
friends

i am shallow!

will cohiba's and montecristo's get cheaper and more available in the u.s.?.

or any other thoughts from the deeper thinkers.. jk.

still_in74

I just got back from Cuba on Saturday. Been there 3 times !

I got a box of 25 Cohibas for $50 CDN. I could have gotten MC for $20 Pesos. Actually - just and FYI - I smoked my first cigar last week, I like the smaller cigars over the large stogeys. In fact, I loved my smaller Cohiba !! My wife doesnt know I brought a small box back for myself.... ;)

Anyway, what will happen? NOTHING. Cuba hates the US. The US has wanted Cuba for hundreds of years and they have never backed down. When you tour_havana you get to hear the Cuban side of the story. I even saw a billboard with a pic of Bush=Hitler. Very funny!

Plus I imagine if the US came back to CUBA they would want all the buildings and property Castro confiscated in 1959.
Tourism is the countries #1 industry so that wont slow down either. No way.

Viva La Revolucion !

still_in74

Posts by still_in74