tenyearsafter

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Posts by tenyearsafter

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  52

  Honest questions for believers.....

  by Paulapollos in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  [if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:worddocument> <w:view>normal</w:view> <w:zoom>0</w:zoom> <w:trackmoves /> <w:trackformatting /> <w:punctuationkerning /> <w:validateagainstschemas /> <w:saveifxmlinvalid>false</w:saveifxmlinvalid> <w:ignoremixedcontent>false</w:ignoremixedcontent> <w:alwaysshowplaceholdertext>false</w:alwaysshowplaceholdertext> <w:donotpromoteqf /> <w:lidthemeother>en-gb</w:lidthemeother> <w:lidthemeasian>x-none</w:lidthemeasian> <w:lidthemecomplexscript>x-none</w:lidthemecomplexscript> <w:compatibility> <w:breakwrappedtables /> <w:snaptogridincell /> <w:wraptextwithpunct /> <w:useasianbreakrules /> <w:dontgrowautofit /> <w:splitpgbreakandparamark /> <w:dontvertaligncellwithsp /> <w:dontbreakconstrainedforcedtables /> <w:dontvertalignintxbx /> <w:word11kerningpairs /> <w:cachedcolbalance /> </w:compatibility> <w:browserlevel>microsoftinternetexplorer4</w:browserlevel> <m:mathpr> <m:mathfont m:val="cambria math" /> <m:brkbin m:val="before" /> <m:brkbinsub m:val=" " /> <m:smallfrac m:val="off" /> <m:dispdef /> <m:lmargin m:val="0" /> <m:rmargin m:val="0" /> <m:defjc m:val="centergroup" /> <m:wrapindent m:val="1440" /> <m:intlim m:val="subsup" /> <m:narylim m:val="undovr" /> </m:mathpr></w:worddocument> </xml><!

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  over the last couple of years, i have done a lot of reading, and rather than answering my questions, it has made me think even more - particularly about god and the bible.. when i was kicked out of the wtbts, it was because of my personal belief in jesus.

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  tenyearsafter

  Paulapollos,

  Thanks for your questions...and I don't pretend to have answers beyond my very simplistic viewpoint that we live in an imperfect world populated by imperfect humans creating imperfect interpretations. Using that premise, I could use the same reasoning regarding science. There are absolutes such as gravity, physical laws, etc. and there are theories and hypotheses that require a certain degree of faith as part of accepting them. I cannot with a certainty tell you that the universe is infinite...or what the origin of life is...or if there is life on other planets, etc. The leap to certainty on any of these and many other subjects require a dgree of faith in accepting how they were established. I see the questions you have regarding the Bible, Jesus and his return, etc. as requiring that same type of faith. I don't think there is a black and white proof regarding any of these subjects. I can only rely on what makes sense to me and how that works with my belief system. There will always be someone with an opposing viewpoint there to de-bunk the other side's position...imperfect men create imperfect analyses, and thus will always be subject to criticism and dissection creating doubt in the mind of the hearer.

  TYA
• 
  36

  Jesus is NOT the Mediator for the Great Crowd?

  by Resistance is Futile in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  so according to the watchtower, jesus is not the mediator for the great crowd.

  evidently jesus is only mediator for the anointed.

  this means that about 99.9% of jehovahs witnesses cant say that jesus is their mediator.

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  tenyearsafter

  Joey,

  They explain it the same way that they explain Jesus being mediator for just the annointed, ie: those led by God's Spirit are the annointed who in turn lead the other sheep...
• 
  52

  Honest questions for believers.....

  by Paulapollos in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  [if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:worddocument> <w:view>normal</w:view> <w:zoom>0</w:zoom> <w:trackmoves /> <w:trackformatting /> <w:punctuationkerning /> <w:validateagainstschemas /> <w:saveifxmlinvalid>false</w:saveifxmlinvalid> <w:ignoremixedcontent>false</w:ignoremixedcontent> <w:alwaysshowplaceholdertext>false</w:alwaysshowplaceholdertext> <w:donotpromoteqf /> <w:lidthemeother>en-gb</w:lidthemeother> <w:lidthemeasian>x-none</w:lidthemeasian> <w:lidthemecomplexscript>x-none</w:lidthemecomplexscript> <w:compatibility> <w:breakwrappedtables /> <w:snaptogridincell /> <w:wraptextwithpunct /> <w:useasianbreakrules /> <w:dontgrowautofit /> <w:splitpgbreakandparamark /> <w:dontvertaligncellwithsp /> <w:dontbreakconstrainedforcedtables /> <w:dontvertalignintxbx /> <w:word11kerningpairs /> <w:cachedcolbalance /> </w:compatibility> <w:browserlevel>microsoftinternetexplorer4</w:browserlevel> <m:mathpr> <m:mathfont m:val="cambria math" /> <m:brkbin m:val="before" /> <m:brkbinsub m:val=" " /> <m:smallfrac m:val="off" /> <m:dispdef /> <m:lmargin m:val="0" /> <m:rmargin m:val="0" /> <m:defjc m:val="centergroup" /> <m:wrapindent m:val="1440" /> <m:intlim m:val="subsup" /> <m:narylim m:val="undovr" /> </m:mathpr></w:worddocument> </xml><!

  [endif][if gte mso 10]> <style> /* style definitions */ table.msonormaltable {mso-style-name:"table normal"; mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso-style-priority:99; mso-style-qformat:yes; mso-style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt; mso-para-margin-top:0cm; mso-para-margin-right:0cm; mso-para-margin-bottom:10.0pt; mso-para-margin-left:0cm; line-height:115%; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"calibri","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-font-family:calibri; mso-ascii-theme-font:minor-latin; mso-fareast-font-family:"times new roman"; mso-fareast-theme-font:minor-fareast; mso-hansi-font-family:calibri; mso-hansi-theme-font:minor-latin;} </style> <![endif].

  over the last couple of years, i have done a lot of reading, and rather than answering my questions, it has made me think even more - particularly about god and the bible.. when i was kicked out of the wtbts, it was because of my personal belief in jesus.

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  tenyearsafter

  Paulapollos,

  I posted the following in another thread:

  I think the key to deciding on a spiritual path is to first acknowledge that there is NO PERFECT CHURCH! I know this may seem a bit simplistic, but the reality for ex-JW's is that we have always lived in a world of absolutes while in the WTS. This mindset makes it VERY difficult to even consider associating with another religion because it will automatically cause a mental conflict with the absolutes of belief that we lived under as JW's. As LWT mentions, most churches do not require absolute adherence to church dogma...there is no one policing of your thoughts or bringing you up before a judicial body for judgement. The key point taught in Christian churches, as an example, is the need for a personal relationship with Jesus and a fellowship with other believers. Beyond that, people take many other paths within the church. As Talesin points out, you may want to voluteer your time in some type of service to others...or you may want to work as lay teacher. Nothing is carved in stone.

  If we are looking for perfection in this world, we will never find it, be it in the WTS, other churches or in non-religious pursuits. Life is limited by the imperfection of man...as long as we accept that, it makes other choices both easier to make and accept.

  I too have struggled with some of the questions you are wrestling with. My wife really brought clarity to me on the subject when she pointed out that we live in an imperfect world, and as a result we will NEVER find the perfect church, organization or philosophy. Thus it becomes a search for the ideal place for you to pursue your spiritual path. If you are a believer in Jesus and the Bible, find a church that allows you to ask questions, think for yourself and avoid high control organizations. Many on this Board have embraced atheism or a form of agnosticism...I still choose to believe in God, but I can understand how others can't as a result of the intolerant and high control tactics they were subjected to while JW's.

  I wish you well in your search...the best advice I can give is to follow your heart.
• 
  88

  DEAR RICH FOLKS: Get Ready For A (Tax) Revolution...

  by darthfader in

  1. social
  2. current

  interesting point of view and graphs.

  is the us different today than it was in the 50's and 60's when tax rates were at their highest?

  a lot of people agree that raising taxes pulls money out of the economy and will hinder job creation.

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  tenyearsafter

  What is the definition of a "rich person"? Is it annual earnings of $100K?...$200K...$500K? I think everyone's answer to that would differ and be dependent on what our particular economic situation is. I would guess to a person making $40K per year, even $100K would constitute being "rich". If you asked most people earning $200K, they would tell you that they are not "rich", and have similar challenges living within their means. This is the primary challenge I see with a "Robin Hood" approach to taxation.

  We have touched on it several times before, but a flat tax is the fairest way to raise revenues and do away with loopholes. This way, there is not tax shelters for the rich or ways for corporations to defer taxes. Unfortunately, this is unlikey to happen in the U.S. as long as lawyers and accountants run Congress and other branches of the government...think about it...all three branches of the U.S. are dominated by lawyers, who have an inherent interest in keeping things complicated through legal complexity, requiring their profession's services to interpret and lead the "uneducated" public through the various legal mazes.
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  40

  Question for the Athiests/Agnostics

  by jwfacts in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  some people feel they need a religion, and need to attend a church.

  if such a person starts questioning the watchtower and they asked you "where else to go?

  ", what would you recommend?.

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  tenyearsafter

  I think the key to deciding on a spiritual path is to first acknowledge that there is NO PERFECT CHURCH! I know this may seem a bit simplistic, but the reality for ex-JW's is that we have always lived in a world of absolutes while in the WTS. This mindset makes it VERY difficult to even consider associating with another religion because it will automatically cause a mental conflict with the absolutes of belief that we lived under as JW's. As LWT mentions, most churches do not require absolute adherence to church dogma...there is no one policing of your thoughts or bringing you up before a judicial body for judgement. The key point taught in Christian churches, as an example, is the need for a personal relationship with Jesus and a fellowship with other believers. Beyond that, people take many other paths within the church. As Talesin points out, you may want to voluteer your time in some type of service to others...or you may want to work as lay teacher. Nothing is carved in stone.

  If we are looking for perfection in this world, we will never find it, be it in the WTS, other churches or in non-religious pursuits. Life is limited by the imperfection of man...as long as we accept that, it makes other choices both easier to make and accept.
• 
  10

  District Crapvention - Immense Image in Daniel

  by outsmartthesystem in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  since my exodus is yet incomplete.....i was there.

  and it was indeed awful.

  according to the talk.....the iron and clay feet of the immense image is the anglo-american world power.

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  tenyearsafter

  That is what I remember from when I was a kid...
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  23

  I decided not to go to the IFB church I been attending

  by andys in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i have been going to an ifb baptist type church for about past 3 months, i started going in march and have decided to quit going, need advice on how to send them a letter i don't want to go anymore, its a soulwinning, king james onlyism type church, wow are they ever putting pressure on me to be in church every time the doors are open, i explain to them that i work alot of overtime, have my own home to take care of, also i have my ham radio hobby that i am involved in and also like to do volunteer type work, since i been missing alot of church every sunday i get a phone call from the pastor on why i wasn't in church, now i am to the point where i don't even answer my phone anymore when they call, but wow the pressure, its very irritating how legalistic church attendance for certain churches has gotten.. .

  on the other hand i have decided that i still want to go to some sort of church, for a very short time in februiary i was going to a communicty type church where everyone is wearing something different, i noticed that alot of people wear blue jeans, even the pastor wears blue jeans, also its a non denominational type church that has alot of volunteer opportunities which i love doing, i have decided to go back to the non denomminational type church since i don't feel no pressure there.. .

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  tenyearsafter

  Tell them you have become a JW!
• 
  17

  Signs From My Brother

  by DarioKehl in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  signs: (really amped up in the last year).

  claims to "spend hours on the internet.".

  recently became an ms after 3 yrs of reproof.. after a few months, stepped down and relocated.. expresses no interest in becoming ms again, calling me saying "count me in for paintball again.".

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  tenyearsafter

  I agree...don't push too hard. He obviously has let some doubts creep in to his thinking. If anything, you might innocently ask what about the flood account doesn't ring true for him. Let him lead the discussion...you can learn a lot by being a good listener.
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  29

  Was there a clique in your congregation?

  by Chemical Emotions in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  there is in mine.

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  tenyearsafter

  I think every congregation has them...In the hall I attended in the 80's, we had the celebrity cliques (Michael Jackson syncophants) and holy roller cliques (if you weren't a high hour pioneer, no need to apply). One of my close friends was a pioneer and well accepted...until he made the fatal error of getting married (to an "older" woman!) and his friendships started to unwind. He received pressure to keep his hours up and also be a good husband and provide for his family. Of course, he never could do either to the satisfaction of the "clique"...long story short, he ended up killing himself. Very tragic, and so unecessary...I lay a portion of the blame at the feet of the holy roller clique...peer pressure can be a very compelling and dangerous thing. I still get sick to my stomach when I think back about that "loving" congregation and how a very kind and sincere man was hounded to his death.
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  32

  My Letter I'm Out of the Synagogue of Satan

  by discreetslave in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  todays text is matthew 18:17 ...speak to the congregation.

  so i'm giving everyone i can a copy of after the meeting.

  i put the elders copy in the snail mail.. [if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:worddocument> <w:view>normal</w:view> <w:zoom>0</w:zoom> <w:trackmoves /> <w:trackformatting /> <w:punctuationkerning /> <w:validateagainstschemas /> <w:saveifxmlinvalid>false</w:saveifxmlinvalid> <w:ignoremixedcontent>false</w:ignoremixedcontent> <w:alwaysshowplaceholdertext>false</w:alwaysshowplaceholdertext> <w:donotpromoteqf /> <w:lidthemeother>en-us</w:lidthemeother> <w:lidthemeasian>x-none</w:lidthemeasian> <w:lidthemecomplexscript>x-none</w:lidthemecomplexscript> <w:compatibility> <w:breakwrappedtables /> <w:snaptogridincell /> <w:wraptextwithpunct /> <w:useasianbreakrules /> <w:dontgrowautofit /> <w:splitpgbreakandparamark /> <w:dontvertaligncellwithsp /> <w:dontbreakconstrainedforcedtables /> <w:dontvertalignintxbx /> <w:word11kerningpairs /> <w:cachedcolbalance /> </w:compatibility> <m:mathpr> <m:mathfont m:val="cambria math" /> <m:brkbin m:val="before" /> <m:brkbinsub m:val="&#45;-" /> <m:smallfrac m:val="off" /> <m:dispdef /> <m:lmargin m:val="0" /> <m:rmargin m:val="0" /> <m:defjc m:val="centergroup" /> <m:wrapindent m:val="1440" /> <m:intlim m:val="subsup" /> <m:narylim m:val="undovr" /> </m:mathpr></w:worddocument> </xml><!

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  tenyearsafter

  Very well written letter...unfortuntely, I think LWT is correct that the letter will fall on deaf ears, and be considered an apostate attack orchestrated by Satan himself.

  I noticed you mention Richard and the kids...I assume Richard is your husband? If so, is he still a JW?...how does he feel about your letter? Good luck as you move forward with your life...I hope you nejoy your new freedom with the minimum of pain.