Blondie: I wondered about that myself (unbaptized publishers). The difference is that an unbaptized publisher is already known to the local elders while a person who hasn't been in the same congregation since baptism might not be known, thus require outside evidence in the form of testimonials.
Posts by AnneB
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28Make Them Prove That You Were Baptized!
by VM44 inthis might not work for everyone, but it might for some.. if a person faces disfellowshipping, the person should make the elders prove that they are baptized!.
as far as i know, baptism records are not sent to bethel.. without two witnesses to the event (and the witnesses have to remember seeing the person immersed), and no photos, there would be no proof.. if someone did this, the elders would of course contact bethel for instructions, but what could they do?.
it would put a stop to the elders proceeding with any action..
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28
Make Them Prove That You Were Baptized!
by VM44 inthis might not work for everyone, but it might for some.. if a person faces disfellowshipping, the person should make the elders prove that they are baptized!.
as far as i know, baptism records are not sent to bethel.. without two witnesses to the event (and the witnesses have to remember seeing the person immersed), and no photos, there would be no proof.. if someone did this, the elders would of course contact bethel for instructions, but what could they do?.
it would put a stop to the elders proceeding with any action..
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AnneB
There's another part to the story...
If the elders can't find two witnesses to your actual baptism they can fall back on "proof" that two people have heard you identify yourself as a JW and are living as a JW (going out in field service, "making disciples").
I got this info from the Bethel Service Desk about 6 years ago. During the same phone call the brother/elder told me that baptism records are kept only at the local level.
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weird "shepherding" phone call
by snakeface inas many of you know, i recently wrote a letter to the elders telling them to make sure the congregation stays off my property.
in the letter i mentioned that i "left the organization several years ago.
" i have not had any contact with any witneses for about 5 years even though i was not disfellowshipped and not even counseled; i just stopped showing up.. well last night a brother called me (not an elder, just a publisher) but i let the call go to voice mail.
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AnneB
Be careful. Sometimes these "random" calls actually have more than one brother on the line so that they have "two witnesses", thus trapping you.
If you do get a call from a JW, my suggestion is to disconnect without saying a word.
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Does it look like a fraud to you?
by Iamallcool inthanks for the mail...as they say, punctuality is the soul of business.
i believe promptness is key if any business is to thrive.
i want to thank you for your prompt response.
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AnneB
Google "Reshipping scam". Never mind. Saved you the trouble. Click on the link:
Edited to add: Make that paste in the link....can't find the little link-y icon to make the thing clickable.
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One smart householder!
by man oh man inyou might enjoy this lady's experience with a jw visit.
she is too nice but also more smart!.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vgug6sbppy.
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AnneB
When they asked her if they could read her a Bible verse, she should have responded "Why?" instead of saying yes. "Why?" asks "What's in it for you?" and that's what needs to be understood to make a sound decision on whether to continue in a transaction (or relationship!)...not, "What's in it for me?" but "What's in it for you?" That simple "Why?" could have exposed the fact that JW's are there for their own benefit (saving their necks at Armageddon, not yours).
She also gave them 'wayyyyy too much personal information. What right do total strangers have to ask about someone's life and lifestyle? She lets two strangers in her house, then tells them exactly what she believes, how she lives, and how she is training her children? Why???
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Why would you make an 83 yr old woman go out in service????
by loosie ini am trying to contact my mothers elders in riverside ca, because my mother doesn't talk to her family.
since that means at least 12 phone calls to various kh's i thought i'd start with my aunt to see what the name of the congegation is.
unfortunatly she didn't know.
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AnneB
You can call WT HQ and tell them you're making vacation plans and need to know what KH serves <your mother's address>. They'll even give you meeting times and contact info.
Aside from that, if your mother is in the shape you say she is (not doubting you!), she isn't setting up the field service arrangements. She could stay at home and write one letter a month or make phone calls as she is able; even 15 minutes keeps an infirm publisher "active". It seems to me that someone is trying to climb the congregational ladder at your mother's expense, showing how much care they have for the congregation members.
Be careful: it may be that these "helpful" folk are siphoning off your mother's resources.
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Judah Ben Schroeder - where is he now????
by dreamgolfer indid he ever get his law degree (old thread) does he practice law?.
or did he take over his in-laws sell cars to the wtbts dealership?.
what happened to the book ?.
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AnneB
Is his name a patronymic, or is Ben short for Benjamin?
Ben, as in "Son of". Judah Ben Schroeder = Judah, son of Schroeder.
Nothing prideful there, eh?
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607 and 1914
by snowbird inthose are just symbols that indicate a numerical value, but to me, they mean much more than that.. my clock showed 6:07 as the time a few minutes ago, and i immediately thought of 607 bce.. a friend's address is 1914 neighbor road - guess what comes to mind.. crazy, isn't it?.
lol..
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AnneB
I recently addressed a letter to PO Box 1915. Guess what I thought of?
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The Good Food Thread
by MrsCedars inmy inspiration comes from the ingredients i have at hand, very often leftovers, and also home grown produce, herbs and spices.
i still have a lot to learn, but i have come a long way since i first started cooking for mr cedars.. i think the first recipe on this thread should by the one that oodad has posted on other thread.... .
shrimp scampi.
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AnneB
There are cooking boards for this kind of thing.
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Help for a father of two young JW's
by never a jw ini have never been a jw, but my wife, two brothers and their wives and children are.
also, most of my wife's brothers and sisters are jw's.
since i have a close relationship with both my family and my wife's family you can deduce that most of my friends and associations are with jw's.
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AnneB
Make your daughter independent of the Witnesses: encourage her to go to college or university, to train for a career, to make life choices for herself that do not involve WT. I realize this may be difficult now that she has decided to join the organization, but she's young, and being part of a "divided" family may be a saving grace, she can "blame" you if any JW objects! :)
Desensitize: find ways to speak about disfellowshipping as though it were a "normal" part of living, teach her that at some point individuals will clash, and the result may be that those with power (not authority!) try to cause unbearable shame in efforts to control the life of another. Remind her that no human is her judge, that when (not if, but when) it happens to her, that she should stand firm (a WT expression), never relinquish control of her life to another human, and that you will support her no matter what anyone thinks, says, or does to mar her reputation. If you start now, while she is only 16, your daughter may not feel as alone as Elders will want her to feel if she should happen to be scrutinized in the future.
Additionally, if you have the wherewithal, make it clear to her and to any others that under no circumstances will you allow your daughter to be "counseled" without you being present, and that includes judicial matters. This is your legal right since she is not of age to be considered a legal adult. If you've been reading this board for any length of time you may already know of the horror stories, the intimidation, the extremely intimate and personal questions that are often and inappropriately asked during these sessions. Make no mistake; there is no such thing as an unintentional session; if a JW gets called in to talk with the brothers there will be intimidation and manipulation, no matter what the issue or how removed from it she may be. Train your daughter to say that she must get permission from her father before she is allowed to meet in closed session. (That one makes sense in a non-JW situation as well.)
If possible, slowly build the notion that being involved with JW's is an open-exit choice, that just as she made the choice to join, she can make the choice to leave whenever she finds that her views and theirs are no longer compatible. Don't let WT be the only one "indoctrinating" her on that point! The main message here is that she directs her life, that you are there to assist her until she reaches full maturity, and that there is no shame in trying out various options then letting them go when she finds they no longer fit.
The best hope you have is that she is still young and has lots of changes left to go through. The goal here is to let her know, in advance, that you are there to love and support her as she learns to stand on her own two feet. If she has that fixed in the back of her mind I doubt that she will put up with WT for the long haul.
Best wishes,
AnneB