any list members going to burning man (burningman.com) the week of august 26th?
i will be camping at the vw bus camp, which this year is real close to center camp!.
next year, we should apply for our own apostate camp and offer cult de-programming!.
My son goes every year. Look for a wiry young man in claw-gloves on stilts; it's either him or someone who knows him. Ask around for Ungtartog and tell him his mommy says hello. Now, let's see if I can post a Burning Man pic of my boy:
Yep, there it goes at last. Funny that a bare URL acts like an "img source" link.
gently feral
Edited by - GentlyFeral on 13 August 2002 23:28:34
of course you might think the watchtower society is going to be around for a long time and harming peoples lives by their doctrines on blood use, toleration of pedophiles in their midst, and their big stick of shunning.
have you ever considered the possibility though that some behavioral studies of chickens and chimps can give us clues about what is happening now and what is in store for the borg a few years down the road?
i dont have a long intricate and far-fetched plot to share with you here, only some general but perhaps useable guidelines that you can use for understanding the politics that is happening in the society.
I can't see a volteface in the WT leadership unless it happens as a palace coup, like Rutherford's. And I don't think anyone who's both well-placed enough and ruthless enough to do that will have the R&F's best interests at heart.
gently feral
is goal setting good or bad?
sounds like the title of an awake!
goal setting can be very good in that it gives direction, purpose and accomplishment in a person's life.
The funeral stories are shocking. When I was a jaydub I had a Theocratic Husband (tm) and didn't lose any jaydub relatives in death, so I didn't have a clue it could be like this.
But I'll tell a UU story as an instructive contrast.
When I was first attending a UU church, before I knew who anybody was, I heard some women talking about one of the pregnant ladies. Turns out she wasn't married, this was her second unmarried pregnancy, and the father was also a church member.
The church ladies' primary concern: what kind of presents do you bring to a baby shower for someone who's giving the child up for adoption? They ended up deciding on soothing and stress-relieving things for the mother...and the father.
That's love, and not particularly sappy, either.
GentlyFeral
.......certainly never got me anywhere, did not even help my wife to survive cancer, in spite of jesus' admonition to "ask anything in my name.
" there are opinions among some students and researchers of the bible to the effect that the god and father jesus prayed to was not jehovah.
just try to find "jehovah" in the sermon on the mount, even in the nwt.
Now that you remind me, Bhagavad, I spent about 20 years praying to Jehovah and never personally experienced him as a "Hearer of Prayer."
In the past few years, though, I've encountered gods who do grant my prayers -- because they can, and because they like to. When things are beyond their power, they either warn me in advance or apologize after the fact.
One of my gods, an ex-human, occasionally promises more than he can deliver. Once I called him on it. He smiled and said, "I'm your god now; you said so; that means I can make false promises." We both laughed.
I agree with Sirona that LittleToe seems to be recommending Christ as a god who has been good to him, and might be a friend to you. Or not. Jesus and I aren't speaking.
I don't think it's gods with personalities that we need to beware of, as a category. The most dangerous ones claim to be all-powerful, or the Only God, and hedge your life around with stupid warnings. That's pure shuck-n-jive.
GentlyFeral
Do we have enough italics yet?
if...... you had to choose just one to have for the rest of your life, which would it be?
affection or sex?
by affection here i mean snuggling, kissing, hand holding, all the little things.
I'd weigh in with affection, too: nobody ever died of celibacy; plenty of people have died of loneliness (at their own hands, if necessary).
And I disagree with JanH: when "the partner's imitating an inflatable," that's sex without good manners or interest, not without affection. Or sex with fear, sex with embarrassment, you get the idea. You can be courteous, kind, and have a wonderful time with sex, with someone you've only known for a few minutes, or only know by sight.
But this is a false dichotomy, anyway. In real life, one often leads to the other. Life is untidy that way, thank the Powers.
And I recall an instructive story from the life of Victor Anderson: In a vision, he was once ordered to choose between love and magical power. "If you seek power, you will never have a lasting love relationship for the rest of your life."
Victor's reply: "Get thee behind me, evil spirit." He reasoned that no one who would make him give up love could have anything else he wanted...
Well, it seemed relevant to me when I thought of it :)
GentlyFeral
life's complexity defies demand for a designer
by tom siegfried / the dallas morning news
life is complicated, and explaining it is more complicated still or so it would seem.
Maybe Darwinian natural selection chose some simple programs over others early in life's history.
I think it goes deeper than that. I think natural selection is one of those "simple programs."
I'd love to read this book. Post-jaydub, I believe that there's really no such thing as simplicity, and that "god is an improviser" or even an amateur -- but I came to this conclusion via religious experiences and layman's observations, rather than rigorous scientific study, at which I suck.
gently feral
ok, so my apostate daily text thread simply lay there and died.
it's still a good idea, ain't it?
hah?.
OK, so my Apostate Daily Text thread simply lay there and died. It's still a good idea, ain't it? Hah?
Today's text:
Beloved [Apostle] Paul,
...I find that if I just shun someone, my shunning them does not have the effect that shunning seems to have for you. Maybe it worked well in your Greek boarding school, where as a Jewish boy you were under perpetual risk of exclusion. For me as a Corinthian, uncircumcised Christian, shunning would not be as effective. More importantly, as a Christian, I don't want to be petty or vindicative. At my best -- at our best as a community -- we are not God; we do not fully know the human heart. Christianity will have some horrendous periods if through the centuries ahead we promote witch trials and public scaffolds. Some might even miss our defining priority, which you have already named so poignantly.
...Meanwhile, although they [the couple mentioned in 1 Cor. 5] may have to leave our congregation, may even have to go to jail, I want to treat them with the love that God has for them. So do you, I realize, for you said that real love holds them accountable. I believe that real love shows that God is accountable, and God has already paid in full the price of their sin, just has he has paid in full the price of yours and mine. O that they might hear the good news in that!
I think this is pretty self-explanatory, don't you?
gently feral
ok so my parents big deal has always been while i may not go to meetings they are free to ask about my religious status, and invite me to meetings (i do not have to accept the invitation) as long as i live under their roof.
my parents other big deal is to go out to lunch after the sunday meeting.
in fact, they usually say "say, wanna come to the meeting tomorrow?
Nobody has yet proposed the simplest, most integrity-ful solution:
Buy your own lobster dinner.
Gently Feral
who really really understands the temptation, but possibly hates meetings even worse than you do
ill tell you my best experience in my belief was being totally drunk at my mates wedding surrounded by jehovahs witnesses who were trying to talk to me even though i didnt want to talk to them (and they were the ones who ignored me at meetings lol)and all i could do is smile at them because i couldnt understand what the hell they were speaking about,and i was so happy and they were so offended because i was pis~@d.
| Best | Worst | |
| Jaydub | Believe it or not -- assemblies and CO visits, until the last year or two. | 1. Almost any day in service. 2. Gradually becoming more and more judgmental. |
| UU | Years of beautiful and brain-stretching sermons by a minister who wrote two free-verse poem/prayers every Sunday. | The slow fading of refreshment and inspiration over the past few months. The church didn't change nearly as much as I did. |
| Pagan | Building my altar and meeting my gods. | Reading way too much lightweight stuff in search of something useful. Fortunately, I've found some useful sources of instruction. |
ently feral
Edited to uncheck the "Automatic Cr/Lf" Box, whatever that is...
Edited by - GentlyFeral on 18 July 2002 5:56:37
there will be coffee in the back.
the format for thursday night will rotate, and will include slides, videos, improv talks about subjects speakers choose.
women will be elders and ms's......if they can be kings and priests with jesus, that's good enough for me; paul might not like it but he will get used to it.
Guys...check out the nearest Unitarian church. It's already happening.
Gently Feral
ex-Unitarian, actually. I mutated.
