Black Sheep - Thanks for the tip. I'll see how I will introduce it in our conversations somehow.
VLV
vivalavida
JoinedPosts by vivalavida
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26
My 16 year old son is starting to see the light
by vivalavida inon march this year (2009) i dad myself from the jws.
of course, it was nice to finally feel free, real free, after over 40 years of mind control.
i don't write much here but i feel this is worth sharing.. one measure i took before leaving was to take my then 15 year old son for a walk and explain to him that things would be different from the jws standpoint, but that i would always love him and that he could come to me at any time.. one thing that was very hard for me, is the fact that i separated from my wife, with which i was having problems for a long time already.
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26
My 16 year old son is starting to see the light
by vivalavida inon march this year (2009) i dad myself from the jws.
of course, it was nice to finally feel free, real free, after over 40 years of mind control.
i don't write much here but i feel this is worth sharing.. one measure i took before leaving was to take my then 15 year old son for a walk and explain to him that things would be different from the jws standpoint, but that i would always love him and that he could come to me at any time.. one thing that was very hard for me, is the fact that i separated from my wife, with which i was having problems for a long time already.
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vivalavida
My girlfriends says exactly the same thing. He's a minor and they trying to walk all over my rights, the good thing though, is that he's very assertive. I just wanted to clarify that this situation was caused mainly by the elders, not by my ex. She actually does not have a problem with me seeing him as long as I don't go all 'apostate preaching' on him. However, I do mention Bible texts sometimes and show him how illogical some of the WTS application of texts are.
On the other hand, I always stress the fact that he has the right to know, not only one side of the story, but both.
Aussie, make sure you stress that you HAVE to be notified BEFORE he's getting baptized as long as he's a minor. In my case, they did all that behind my back thinking I'd oppose. I told my wife that I should have been told because that is supposed to be THE MOST important thing in his life (from her standpoint) and I wanted somehow to be part of it, that I felt betrayed and that it was worse than having him get married behind my back. She actually understood that point but it was already too late, he was already baptized and he has already told me that it was too soon, that he did it under pressure, pressure of getting privileges and so on.
Well anyway, I'll keep you all posted about what happens next.
Vivalivada
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26
My 16 year old son is starting to see the light
by vivalavida inon march this year (2009) i dad myself from the jws.
of course, it was nice to finally feel free, real free, after over 40 years of mind control.
i don't write much here but i feel this is worth sharing.. one measure i took before leaving was to take my then 15 year old son for a walk and explain to him that things would be different from the jws standpoint, but that i would always love him and that he could come to me at any time.. one thing that was very hard for me, is the fact that i separated from my wife, with which i was having problems for a long time already.
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vivalavida
Well, what really got to them was that it came out that he came to me for permission in 'disobedience' to his mother. That's when they told him, he should stop all contact with me.
Of course, after that, obviously they have their eyes on him now, and have talked to him because he has a 'worldly' girlfriend (his first real girlfriend btw). So reports are that he was seen with her downtown, and pictures of him and the girl together were seen on that social network for school kids.
The good thing though, is that in both occasions, when told to shun me and when told to stop seeing the girl, he politely but firmly refused to do it. Of course, he's just 16 and i'm pretty sure this kind of pressure on him is just starting. Therefore it is very important to me to let him know and show him with facts that the world doesn't end if the elders are not happy with him. Of course, anything I do, is tried to be undone by the mother.
My goal is to give him as much tools as possible, the right kind of tools, and then let him make his decision. Of course, a 16 year old not necessarily can make the best decisions, but that's were my help is offered to him.
Hopefully it will all work out...
VLV
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26
My 16 year old son is starting to see the light
by vivalavida inon march this year (2009) i dad myself from the jws.
of course, it was nice to finally feel free, real free, after over 40 years of mind control.
i don't write much here but i feel this is worth sharing.. one measure i took before leaving was to take my then 15 year old son for a walk and explain to him that things would be different from the jws standpoint, but that i would always love him and that he could come to me at any time.. one thing that was very hard for me, is the fact that i separated from my wife, with which i was having problems for a long time already.
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vivalavida
That's interesting Lisa what you mention as the reason for her to get baptized. In the case of my son, being already 15 at the time was the desire to have privileges like passing the microphone. Other young kids who were already baptized were having the 'privileges', so he wanted too and got baptized. Sad, isn't it?
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26
My 16 year old son is starting to see the light
by vivalavida inon march this year (2009) i dad myself from the jws.
of course, it was nice to finally feel free, real free, after over 40 years of mind control.
i don't write much here but i feel this is worth sharing.. one measure i took before leaving was to take my then 15 year old son for a walk and explain to him that things would be different from the jws standpoint, but that i would always love him and that he could come to me at any time.. one thing that was very hard for me, is the fact that i separated from my wife, with which i was having problems for a long time already.
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vivalavida
I think you're right because that's the time when they start anyway to question stuff. They question their parents authority, or any authority for that matter. It's just a matter of channeling it the right way. Providing guidance and the right tools. That's where books like De Bono's come into the picture.
VLV
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26
My 16 year old son is starting to see the light
by vivalavida inon march this year (2009) i dad myself from the jws.
of course, it was nice to finally feel free, real free, after over 40 years of mind control.
i don't write much here but i feel this is worth sharing.. one measure i took before leaving was to take my then 15 year old son for a walk and explain to him that things would be different from the jws standpoint, but that i would always love him and that he could come to me at any time.. one thing that was very hard for me, is the fact that i separated from my wife, with which i was having problems for a long time already.
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vivalavida
Thanks mate, I just found it in german: Wie Kinder richtig denken lernen.
I'll definitely be getting it soon.
Cheers,
VLV
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26
My 16 year old son is starting to see the light
by vivalavida inon march this year (2009) i dad myself from the jws.
of course, it was nice to finally feel free, real free, after over 40 years of mind control.
i don't write much here but i feel this is worth sharing.. one measure i took before leaving was to take my then 15 year old son for a walk and explain to him that things would be different from the jws standpoint, but that i would always love him and that he could come to me at any time.. one thing that was very hard for me, is the fact that i separated from my wife, with which i was having problems for a long time already.
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vivalavida
Well, it seems that the elders are increasing the pressure on him, since he's now a baptized male, but it does look like it's backfiring on them.
The whole thing with the 'worldly' family came about because there is a girl with whom, as he told me lastnight, he's in love with. Well, the thing is that he was again called by the elders because of this. They even had pictures of him and the girl in a social network similar to Facebook but only for school kids that is very popular in germany. His answer was, well, I love her.
Of course, he's just 16 and this is his first love, so I have to play my cards very carefully. But the way things are going, I do see an opened door of opportunity, to borrow a JW expression...
We'll see how the thing develops.
Black Sheep - Yes I myself love also the De Bono thinking out of the box techniques. But I never thought about passing it to him, great idea. Thanks
alanv - Sorry about your son. I'll try to do my best, but as stated, I have to be careful and not get overexcited.
VLV
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26
My 16 year old son is starting to see the light
by vivalavida inon march this year (2009) i dad myself from the jws.
of course, it was nice to finally feel free, real free, after over 40 years of mind control.
i don't write much here but i feel this is worth sharing.. one measure i took before leaving was to take my then 15 year old son for a walk and explain to him that things would be different from the jws standpoint, but that i would always love him and that he could come to me at any time.. one thing that was very hard for me, is the fact that i separated from my wife, with which i was having problems for a long time already.
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vivalavida
Yes, that's something I was thinking about. Not too much, too fast.
One thing I told him was that in every situation there are two sides. I used the example of a courtroom, there is an accusing lawyer and a defending lawyer and that for the truth to come out, BOTH sides have to be listened to. Apparently that is also on the back of his mind.
On the other side, they managed to have him baptized in the last international convention here in germany. I found out 'after' the fact and now he understands why I was so mad. So I do need to find the point of balance.
The good thing is that he's very assertive. He actually told the elders flat out that he could not do what they were asking from him (to shun me)
Vivalavida
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26
My 16 year old son is starting to see the light
by vivalavida inon march this year (2009) i dad myself from the jws.
of course, it was nice to finally feel free, real free, after over 40 years of mind control.
i don't write much here but i feel this is worth sharing.. one measure i took before leaving was to take my then 15 year old son for a walk and explain to him that things would be different from the jws standpoint, but that i would always love him and that he could come to me at any time.. one thing that was very hard for me, is the fact that i separated from my wife, with which i was having problems for a long time already.
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vivalavida
On March this year (2009) I DAd myself from the JWs. Of course, it was nice to finally feel free, real free, after over 40 years of mind control. I don't write much here but I feel this is worth sharing.
One measure I took before leaving was to take my then 15 year old son for a walk and explain to him that things would be different from the JWs standpoint, but that I would always love him and that he could come to me at any time.
One thing that was very hard for me, is the fact that I separated from my wife, with which I was having problems for a long time already. Of course, the belief that everything would be fixed in the New Order, when we were brought up to perfection, kept us together, but when that belief vanished in thin air there was absolutely no point of staying together. This, of course, caused a lot of grief and stress for my son. For almost 3 or 4 months after I separated from my wife, he wouldn't talk or call me. All the time I kept calling and texting him confirming my unconditional love to him.
One of the things I mentioned on that walk was that it would come a point when the elders would tell him that he should not talk to me or have anything to do with me. That turned out to be a very good idea.
Fast forward to october. He calls me and asks me for permission to go to a get together with a 'worldly' family with which he has a very good relationship. His mom wouldn't allow it. That was something he found wrong. He's allowed to go practically anywhere with witness families, but in this one case, just because it was a worldly family the answer was NO. So he came to me and I said YES, of course.
So he went and in the end it came out and he was approached by the elders who, among other things, told him DO NOT TALK TO YOUR DAD, it is not wise and showed him a couple of Bible texts.
That made him click and remember that conversation we had and he told me about it. After that we have had very interesting conversations about shunning and disfellowshipping. I'm really happy and hope that he's willing to open his mind and starts opening his mind and questioning things...
Vivalavida
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vivalavida
I once read a very interesting and highly well written book called "The airmen who wouldn't die".
It concerns itself with the afterlife of UK Pilots after the great war. Although it is, in my view, not the definitive answer to your question, it does provide with food for thought.
Take a look at this link, it is a small synopsis of the book http://paranormal.suite101.com/article.cfm/the_airmen_who_would_not_die. BTW, before it gets debunked without actually reading it, let me just assert that the book was written from the perspective of someone who did not believe but consider the facts so overwhelming that he had to present them.
vivalavida