i've mentioned before---i'm all "religioned" out!.
i don't have a certain set of beliefs yet i still hope there is a god and contrary to what some have assumed, i'm not an agnostic or athiest (yet)..
I think it is important to be aware, as a human, in your enviornment and the power that we as humans hold. I think religion tends to take a lot of that away because it puts the emphasis on a god figure(s), rather than allowing people to expound and grow themselves, as individuals.
To me, religion should be looked at as a philosophy. There's valuable information, but it is just that, information, and we are all capable of making our own decisions that best fit the lives we want to live.
i enjoyed reading these points.
in the second list of "real reasons", it was points #2 and #3 that first struck me, after leaving the jws.. .
why do people abandon the christian faith?.
I would have to say that primarily for me it was actually number 4 of the myth list. Being raised as a dub you never really learn, realisitically, about other thoughts, teachings, views, etc. It's all quite convenient that you learn all about these "false" religions FROM the ONE "true" religion. So obviously everything is skewed. And going along with every other fellow dub you of course think you simply know everything about all these other religions.
So for me, when I got DF'd, there was a large part of me that just couldn't quite wrap my head around why I was having such issues with my religion. *laughing to myself* "my religion." I was NEVER mine. It was something forced upon me. And I couldn't stop "sinning." So for a little while I thought pretty low of myself and figured I just couldn't hack it.
But as I lost my friends and family, and watched their behavior from a new perspective, while simultaneously watching the behavior of "wordly" people, it became quite clear that dubs in fact, in many instances, were the lesser of the moral group. Now, don't get me wrong, there are plenty of immoral people in "the world," but if one was to compare dubs to the rest of the world, say on a ratio basis, I bet dubs would definitely come out as having more immoral people. I noticed it most with how they treat people, even their own who are still in the organization.
At least though they still follow the golden rule, they just all treat other like crap
After I realized that I simply wasn't like them, I started to do my own research. And THAT is when number 1 and 3 in the real reasons category really took hold for me.
I know there a lot of Christians on this site, so this is only a statement of my opinion. Nothing more, nothing less. But to me, the teaching of Christianity has more holes than a block of swiss cheese.
That, by far, is the main reason that I will never go back to Christianity. It was always something I struggled with growing up, the very concept of it, and now that I am an adult and have had the opportunity to look at things from a new, balanced, and open perspective rather than being spoon fed "facts" I am able to see for myself.
i saw a reference to april having a "generation renewal" in the org.
i tried doing a search on this term but couldn't find anything more on it.
is this in relation to the annointed, i'm guessing?
You know, just when you think they can't get anymore outrageous. Sheesh.
Thanks guys for the info!!
i saw a reference to april having a "generation renewal" in the org.
i tried doing a search on this term but couldn't find anything more on it.
is this in relation to the annointed, i'm guessing?
I saw a reference to April having a "generation renewal" in the org. I tried doing a search on this term but couldn't find anything more on it. Is this in relation to the annointed, I'm guessing? Can someone fill me in?
Grass hat!
so on wednesday i sent a letter to my parents.
the last contact i had was with my mother, via email, in june of '08.
i am not sure when the last time i spoke to my father was.
So on Wednesday I sent a letter to my parents. The last contact I had was with my mother, via email, in June of '08. I am not sure when the last time I spoke to my father was. Perhaps sometime in '07? At any rate, there hasn't been any contact whatsoever and in my last correspondence with my mother I was specifically told there would be no contact unless in the event of an emergency. Which given that my mother had previously gone into the hospital and I was not notified and only by pure chance happened to find out, I basically took that to mean I would only hear from them in the event one of them dies.
Unfortunately leading up to this last email from her I have struggled all my life with my relationship with them. As a silent lamb at the hands of my mother's father, and my father who was emotionally unavailable and very serious about his responsibilities as an elder, things were strained as a young child. At the age of 10 when my parents gained knowledge of the abuse that had been going on, things began to change.
I will be ETERNALLY greatful that even in their deep indoctrination in the organization they had the clarity of mind to get me into therapy. Had they not done that, I would not have the life I do now. In fact I have cousins who have never dealt with our childhood and sad to say they are not in the greatest shape as adults.
In addition to my own issues, my mother began to notice her own. In fact my childhood therapist, based on things I told him about family life, and conversations held with my parents, noticed some intriguing characteristics about my mother. She was soon diagnosed with multiple personalities, or MPD. (That was back in the day, now it's called D.I.D. = Dissociative Identiy Disorder).
My father too with all these realizations coming out about his family began to realize his own issues and began the long journey of turning himself back on emotionally. He always told me that as a teen he consciously decided there was no point to emotion and simply shut himself off, like turning off a faucet of running water. The moment he began to try and turn that faucet back on he realized just how major of a bout of depression he had been in for some time.
Needless to say between dealing my trauma, watching my mother lose the little bit of containment she had maintained up to this point and my father trying to not only regain what he had lost while also taking care of his family AND the congregation, things were quite interesting at home. Ironically even though his emotions were in a sad state, he always seemed to be able to empathize with others emotions, which is probably why he was involved in many personal matters aiding those of the flock as an elder. He was the one people went to when they were upset. And being that we lived in the basement apartment of the kingdom hall, he was always easy to access.
Looking back, my teen years are a whirlwind of my mothers multiple suicide attempts and self mutilation, mental hospitals, my father attending to her or being in countless elders meetings, my struggle with them as parents and authority, my anger and resentment and butting heads with both of them.
In 2002 I was DF'd for fornication. I had previously been publicly reproved, when I was 18, and spent the next couple years vigorously trying to walk the straight and narrow as my guilt over my actions and my fear of the world compelled me. However my issues from childhood, while certainly much better with the therapy I had gotten, were still showing their ugly and painful head and I simply couldn't keep up anymore.
In a single JC meeting that, including deliberation, took less than time than the school and service meeting going on above, the decision for disfellowshipping was made (the night before halloween ironically) and I thought my world had just ended.
Thankfully I didn't react out of fear and go running back. I took my time deciding what I wanted to do, and as time went on it bacame quite clear I didn't want to go back. Once I let myself accept that it was a long journey of self discovery, research, and a hurricane of emotions. I eventually got myself back in therapy.
After I was DF'd contact was cut off for about six months before my father called to say they would be available to help with anything I needed as far as recovery from the abuse because that was his duty as handed down by Jehovah. It was made clear that anything past that, in terms of a normal relationship with them, would not occur or be very sporadic at best. My new therapist upon getting to know me and my virtually life long struggle with my parents suggested two options. 1. That I accept things as they were and come to a place where the state of my family would truly not bother me because I knew what I would, and would not, get from my parents. Or 2. That I mourn them, as in death, and from then on consider myself an orphan.
I was struggling with option 1., and have been ever since really. At the time I felt number 2 was too drastic, and I simply wasn't ready. Since that time I have grown exponentially and now have come into a healthy adult life. I still struggle with things, sometimes more than others, but overall I have healed tremendously and live a stable and happy life. I recently got engaged and have started to seriously pursue my dreams in life.
With this, I still struggle with the loss of my parents. Moving forward starting a family of my own I have decided it's either time for us to make peace and truly accept our differences and move on as a family (I am an only child) or to officially and openly cut ties, for good. I feel as though I've been walking a tight rope this entire time. On the one hand there's the wishful thinking. That voice inside my head that has always said at some point in life there would be an event that would be significant enough to slap us upside the head and get on track. I realize they're not going to be at birthday parties or holidays and that's fine. But what about a phone call every couple weeks? Perhaps an occasional dinner or other outing? How about just taking an active interest in each others lives? As I stated in my letter, I can't think of a better reason to connect than me finding my mate, best friend and partner in life.
There's also the more realistic side of me that knows their stance and how they don't see it as I do. They don't see their decision as anything but a tough choice to make, but unquestionably the right one. In fact, I'm sure they place blame on me, that I am reaping what I've sown in my own life. They most likely do not view it as abandonment of their only child, as it feels to me.
So, my fiance and I both wrote a letter. She asked them to be a part of our lives. I too kept things very nice, positive, I used "I" statments, never blaming them for anything but simply imploring them to let us be a family. I also stated that if they choose not to be a part of my life, I respect their decision, but that this was it. From here on out they will be dead to me so that I can grieve and move on. I sent the letter certified and asked for a reply within 30 days, after which time with no reply I will assume their position remains the same.
I told them that I am at a point in life now where I really want and need my parents. I am embarking on a whole new life and will soon be starting a family of my own. Do they really want to miss that?
Since that letter was written I've had a hard time, knowing it will be a hard letter for them to receive, knowing that no matter what choice they make it will be a tough road ahead for me. Even if they do want to have SOME kind of relationship, it will be hard, and a struggle. I guess a part of me is a bit resentful that I have to push through these things simply to have a typical father/son or mother/son conversation.
But, as I explained in the letter, I refuse to start a family with this hanging on my mind and my heart. That's not fair to anyone, them or me, not to mention MY family.
So right now...I'm really hoping they don't take 30 days to reply. Lets get this emotional train rollin!
morning everyone :).
so on friday night a friend of ours came over and we did an exercise in writing down a few personal items and discussing them, personal things like fears that are holding you back in life, things you hate about yourself, etc.
all in an effort to realize changes we need to make and as a cleansing tool.
I guess sometimes I do, but not too often. It's more of feeling like I can't fully enjoy my life because they dont approve of it.
morning everyone :).
so on friday night a friend of ours came over and we did an exercise in writing down a few personal items and discussing them, personal things like fears that are holding you back in life, things you hate about yourself, etc.
all in an effort to realize changes we need to make and as a cleansing tool.
Morning everyone :)
So on Friday night a friend of ours came over and we did an exercise in writing down a few personal items and discussing them, personal things like fears that are holding you back in life, things you hate about yourself, etc. etc. All in an effort to realize changes we need to make and as a cleansing tool. I realized through these exercises that I still harbor guilt over how I was raised versus how I live my life now. Oddly enough, nothing really as concerned with Jehovah or religion, but more the familial aspect of things, based on their JW beliefs. Like I never feel bad or anything like that about what the elders think of me, or my official status. Nothing like that. More that my parents don't approve of my life, I'm spiritually dead in their eyes, I'm going against everything they ever taught me, etc. etc.
I'm sure to a degree this guilt has been there for a while and I just haven't realized it. Lately though I think I've been unknowingly feeling it more. My life has changed so much recently, all in positive ways, but it is definitely new situations for me, situations that previously I didn't have the opportunity to process through my JW filter and then correct myself because I've never encountered this before. E.g. I am now engaged, I am starting to make progress with my screenwriting, I have a family that loves me which is made up of my friends, and we openly call ourselves family. ALL very wonderful things. And I think as a reflex I feel guilt, but because I'm so used to it I unconsciously ignore it. Now in the past because I was in the midst of dealing with many things from my childhood and other larger issues stemming from that, it was manageable.
NOW I am embarking on adult life in much more of a real sense than ever before. I am getting closer to my potential and have nothing but opportunities before me, and I think this guilt has been an anchor on me that I really just haven't realized. My fiance and I were talking about it the other night, and even in small ways it creeps in, but it still affects me. I noticed that after we got engaged, and I started thinking of her in terms of my wife, I felt better about having sex. How messed up is that??
I think that my questioning, rationalizing and correction, usually all done subconsciously, is really wearing on me. Now that I see it, it feels like it's holding me back. And I think in addition to the JW aspect of things, my silent lamb background adds to it, and it turns into this sensation of not feeling worthy of attaining my dreams, which doesn't really matter anyway because my dreams are "bad".....and even though my conscious mind can logically tell me none of that is real or makes sense, it's all ingrained SO deeply within me that I feel I'm battling myself a lot more than I realize.
Does/has anyone else struggled with this? Especially after so much time away? I was DF'd 7 years ago and this is still affecting my life...
your thoughts on the elders that made up the 'comittee' that disfellowshipped you.
did you want to get even somehow or?.
I was pretty angry with mine for a while. I'd known all three of them since childhood. And they really did a bang up job with my JC hearing. Yes, singular. No multiple sessions or anything like that. The entire process from initial meeting to their decision took less than the time for a school and service meeting. I know this because we met in the basement of the hall when the other congregation was having their meeting, and start to finish I was done and outta there before the congregation upstairs was done.
I was told later, by my mother, who had heard herself through the never ending grape vine of information (my father is also an elder and was told by a JC member), that after I left they all cried. Well boo hoo for them. They didn't even want to get into anything other than the surface things, the action itself. I tried explaining my motivations and what state of mind I was in, and they just didn't want to hear it. A couple years later my grandfather died and I relucantly attended his memorial service. Two of them stayed on the complete opposite end of the hall from me, couldn't even look me in the eye. ESPECIALLY the main guy on the JC, which I personally find (now looking back) offensive because he was extremely close with my grandparents and my family. And I am the only grandson. He couldn't even muster a look in my direction. Another member of the JC came up to speak with my father, who I was standing right by, and he would glance over in my direction, and then say something to my father, almost like he was saying it to me through my father. My mother seemed to think they all felt guilty because they know they just did a wham bam thank you maam job on my JC issue. So I was bitter for a while.
But in all reality, they obviously saw something that I didn't at the time. Yeah, I had a lot of motivation that led me to committ fornication, well besides the obvious ;) At the time I saw that motivation as something different than it was. There was a big part of me that I was too afraid to acknowledge that abhorently hated being a JW. And my life is so much better now than it ever could've been inside the WTBS. I've grown exponentially since then and am actually truly happy now.
I now see them simply as people. We all respond to life in different ways. They respond to life by living it in a way I don't agree with, and in their position they were doing what they thought they had to, to preserve their own place in what they felt was the right organization and teachings to be a part of.
I am still angry in the sense of disrespect and lack of compassion they are supposed to have dedicated themselves to show to everyone. But we all know that is nothing but a farse.
So they are what they are, and I am what I am.
I am proud to say I've been DF'd for 7 years now.
ahhh what a wonderful time to get together with family and share presents and food.. how was your first christmas?.
.
Mine was pretty dang cool!! Fiance loved the things I gave her, and vice versa. Shared it with great friends, as well as family, relaxed, ate WAAAAAAY too much, lots of lost sleep with the new 6 wk old puppy. All in all, a fantastic 4 days :)
sometimes it just hits you how cold and unfeeling this religious corporation is.. last night there was a part in the kingdom ministry about helping new bible studies.
in one paragraph it mentioned how the new student might cut ties with former associates because they are not living by bible principles.
it says that their families might disown them.
<!-- /* Style Definitions */ p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal {mso-style-parent:""; margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";} p {mso-margin-top-alt:auto; margin-right:0in; mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto; margin-left:0in; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";} @page Section1 {size:8.5in 11.0in; margin:1.0in 1.25in 1.0in 1.25in; mso-header-margin:.5in; mso-footer-margin:.5in; mso-paper-source:0;} div.Section1 {page:Section1;} -->
Also, I would like to point out that a CRYSTAL CLEAR indicator that there is nothing genuine in any of their actions would be the flip side, in that when they disfellowship someone they propagate the very circumstance they're encouraging the herd to help their bible studies with. They disown, shun and render family and friends dead to them and rejoice in how holy they are, that they "true christians"......"Hello, kettle? This is the WTBS, you're black!"
F**K that makes me bitter.
