Gopher

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Posts by Gopher

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  18

  Justice #20 - Getting Run Over

  by Amazing in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  justice #20 getting run over.

  jesus said, "woe unto you, scribes and pharisees, hypocrites!

  for you tithe mint and anise and cummin, and have left undone the weightier matters of the law, justice, and mercy, and faith: but these you ought to have done, and not to have left the other undone.

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  Gopher

  Amazing,

  This isn't a new policy. Same thing happened here in a nearby congregation back in 1980. The congregation was reporting 50% of its publishers inactive, and the elders were failing to "take the lead" in the door-to-door ministry.

  So the district overseer initiated the action, and one Sunday morning the congregation was presented with an announcement that all of its elders were removed, and that 4 elders from nearby congregations now comprised its brand new elder body!

  At least one sincere, active elder was swept alongside in that "massacre". He was reappointed years later, most of the others are scattered between the two congregations that now share the same hall.

  Again, the innocent suffer along with the ones who needed attention. All in the interests of making the WT Society look good and fair.

  GopherWhy shouldn't truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense.
  Mark Twain (1835-1910)
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  25

  To all who so generously sent loving thoughts

  by Mommie Dark in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  well, like the proverbial bad penny, mommie dark is back again.

  the last week has been a long drugged blur (and kent, i can hear you snickering about how that isn't a bad thing .

  to all who sent such wonderful greetings and good wishes, my sincere thanks.

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  Gopher

  Welcome back to the "zoo". Glad you're feeling better!

  GopherWhy shouldn't truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense.
  Mark Twain (1835-1910)
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  15

  "UNCONDITIONAL LOVE"-REALLY???

  by Bill Parker in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  unconditional love really?

  some today believe that all anyone has to do is believe on the lord jesus christ.

  just believe that this unconditional love is enough for us to gain this free gift.

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  Gopher

  Outlaw,

  That's another Bill. (Bowen)

  GopherWhy shouldn't truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense.
  Mark Twain (1835-1910)
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  15

  "UNCONDITIONAL LOVE"-REALLY???

  by Bill Parker in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  unconditional love really?

  some today believe that all anyone has to do is believe on the lord jesus christ.

  just believe that this unconditional love is enough for us to gain this free gift.

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  Gopher

  Bill,

  Wow! What a way to say goodbye!

  If you won't be insulted by this question, I ask, do you have the kind of love for the people on this board that is necessary to stay through the tough times? Remember 1 Cor. 13 says Love "bears, hopes, and endures" all things. Are you beyond the point of hope? You cannot endure any longer? You want to take your "love" elsewhere?

  If so fine, that's your choice.

  But as far as "unconditional" love, you are right. In the Bible its author and his Son have set down conditions, I suppose they have the right to do so.

  The question is, do humans have that same authority, seeing that they cannot read people's hearts and minds? When people on this board talk about expecting "unconditional love", I think it means a reasonable degree of tolerance from fellow humans. This is something that isn't always practiced on the board, point well taken.

  However, the love issuing forth from the JW organization is and always has been (in recent memory) very conditional and judgmental. Hence, the repulsion to anyone trying to use this board to preach and teach what should/shouldn't be done. We've all been preached at enough, and our souls are weary. Not refreshed, as Jesus said he would do for us at Matt. 11:28.

  One further comment. You said,

  There are others who only like to drag others down with their nasty comments. They do that because they have little or no knowledge of Jehovah.

  I believe it's true that there is nastiness out here. However, kindness springs from the goodness of one's own heart. Some with great knowledge of Jehovah are unfortunately, very unkind. Some who don't profess to worship Jehovah are some of the kindest people on this board.

  Wishing you well in your journeys.

  GopherWhy shouldn't truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense.
  Mark Twain (1835-1910)
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  12

  To my friends-

  by ashitaka in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i don't want to spam, but i just wanted to post one more topic tonite.

  i was reading bridgette's post, and was moved, but not just because of what she said...mommy made a comment about us being friends here, and you know what...i feel that way too.. sometimes, even though i have a wife who left the jw's with me, i feel so damn isolated and alone, that i'm the only strong one among a bunch of children, who all fight and tear at each other....this is one place i feel semi-normal again.. it's so hard to befriend people now.

  i have so much trouble talking to people and interacting socially with people, although i've been told i'm agreeable to be around.. i don't know, i'm exhausted from thinking.

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  Gopher

  Ashi,

  I totally empathize with the feeling -- hard to get going socially upon exiting the Borg. I found help with my sister and a childhood friend who happens to be an ex-JW. It doesn't take a whole bunch of people to start making a differnence in your life, only 1 or 2 can get the ball rolling.

  Best wishes, thanks for your friendship too and hope to see you out here for a long time to come.

  GopherWhy shouldn't truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense.
  Mark Twain (1835-1910)
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  13

  The Bible teaches Jesus is Jehovah?

  by Rev BII in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  john 8:58 is a bit lame to use as trinitarian argument.

  jesus was before adam and he tells the pharisees that he's god's son.. that's what makes them mad *lol* .

  you must face that they exist together too;.

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  Gopher

  I don't ever want to be a JW again. But I DO think that the JW's are correct in pointing out the fallacy and illogic of the Trinity teaching.

  Trinitarians often jump to another verse, another proof text to bolster their claims. Note here that Neon Madman completely ignored Rev Bill's citations and went to a pet one of his own!

  OK, I'll jump in with the one text, from the Greek Scriptures (or New Testament if you prefer) that really seems to throw the monkey wrench into Trinitarian reasoning, 1 Timothy 2:5.

  For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, a man, Christ Jesus.

  In human experience, a mediator is called to settle a dispute between two sides that have differences.

  So how can a mediator (Jesus) be equal to either of the two parties (i.e., God)?

  Jesus as a mediator, a go-between, separate from God, makes more sense to the logical mind. Unless one really has a pre-conceived notion to which one chooses to cling.

  My dos centavos

  [edited for spelling]

  GopherWhy shouldn't truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense.
  Mark Twain (1835-1910)
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  7

  The Stimulus Debate in USA

  by Julie in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  with all the talk of politics on the board lately i thought i would share with you some information on an important debate going on right now in the us.

  that would be the economic stimulus package.. http://216.33.240.250/cgi-bin/linkrd?_lang=en&lah=28bb2a04d1720e2779197658f7ba7d97&lat=1006869672&hm___action=http%3a%2f%2fwww%2emotherjones%2ecom%2fweb_exclusives%2fcommentary%2fopinion%2fstimulus%2ehtml.

  the meat of the article reads:.

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  Gopher

  I'm not very politically outspoken. However, the so-called "stimulus" package does seem like opportunism on the part of the wealthy corporations. I'm not against such corporations, it's just that they always seem to have the strength to unfairly tilt things in their direction whenever they please.

  Additionally, the economy seems to be slowly recovering on its own, despite the fact that a recession was just declared. I read reports of a large upswing in the American economy in October. And 40 million people DID travel over this past holiday weekend. The Thanksgiving weekend is traditionally the busiest travel weekend of the year. And despite the events of 9/11, that was true this year to a good extent.

  So I don't understand the point of pushing a stimulus package any further. It seems like political opportunism, and the American public ought to see it for what it is.

  GopherWhy shouldn't truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense.
  Mark Twain (1835-1910)
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  27

  Harmony is going to get Hammered

  by Julie in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hard core storms coming your way harmony, better batton down the hatches!

  hope you get through it ok. proceed with caution, eh?.

  take care,.

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  Gopher

  Harmony,

  Since I'm only a short ways away from you, can I pretend to be your brother? I'm hiding behind "that tree" over there, snowball in hand.....!

  (This is the good, wet, sloppy kind of snow... hoo boy!)

  GopherWhy shouldn't truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense.
  Mark Twain (1835-1910)
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  71

  Baby is here! Photos attached!

  by LDH in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  11-19 3:30 pm 7 lbs 13 oz, 21 in.. i don't how how to add the photos, but if you want to see pictures, go to http://www.webphotos.com/list_albums.asp?mi=1&smi=1.

  i think this is right (mommy help me!

  lisa

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  Gopher

  Hey great news Lisa! Julius looks like a wonderful baby!

  My only daughter is also inter-racial. Her skin was SO dark, people (being as they are) wondered whether I was the dad.

  All I could tell such idiots is, ask my daughter! She'll tell you who her daddy is!! (AND... she loves her daddy very much! She turns 3 next month.)

  Again, congrats!!

  GopherWhy shouldn't truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense.
  Mark Twain (1835-1910)
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  5

  How to be a loyal JW 101

  by Jigrigger in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  saw this on greatcrowd.net.

  this is it in a nutshell.... http://www.greatcrowd.net/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=1&t=000061

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  Gopher

  Jrig,

  I don't know whether greatcrowd.net will allow me to become a member. I'm a member of this dangerous site (jw.com) after all!

  So please do quote to us what you found to be interesting over on that site.

  Thanks.

  GopherWhy shouldn't truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense.
  Mark Twain (1835-1910)