Posts by Gopher

43

an elder will be at my house in one hour HELP!

by Julia Orwell in

jw
friends

we've missed some meetings due to work and thinking it's bs and also one night my husband got drunk n fessed up n had a shepherding call n now the e is coming to see 'how we're doing'.

help me please i dunno what to do..

Gopher

Hi Julia.

Data is my favorite character from Star Trek - ever. I'm glad you held your ground.

As to their speculation about your depression - that actually might be a good "explanation" you can use for missing meetings and field service. They will buy that, because they've seen a LOT of clinical depression in their midst. When I was a ministerial servant in the 1980's, our circuit overseer met with the elders and us, and one thing he said was that each congregation in the circuit (about 20 congregations) had at least one clinically depressed individual. They couldn't figure it out.

They can't determine (or won't admit) that the religion's expectations beats people down.

And they don't know what the hell they're saying when comparing you to Korah. In the Bible account, Korah tried to set up a resistance movement to Moses and Aaron. I seriously doubt you're trying to establish yourself as a spiritual leader to take congregation members away. Like I said, as they are beating you up they are using incindiary language. You could tell them that when they compared you to Korah, it put you into a depressed state - because you aren't interested in leading people away from the congregation!

Best wishes however this all turns out.

140

WT Society holds EXTREME Responsibility for 1975 and False Expectations

by flipper in

jw
friends

however- many jw's who have come into the jw organization from like 1985 forward virtually may have no knowledge of the wt society's 1975 debacle and false predictions of the end times or armageddon predictions.

just like in in the book 1984 by george orwell the wt society has a way of not only erasing it's history so no newer witnesses will be aware of their false predictions, but also they are re-writing their history as if those false predictions never happened.. so for those of you here who may have never read or heard of how whipped up into an emotional frenzy witnesses were in the years just before 1975 by the wt society claiming the end was any day now- this threads for you.

to see the pressure that was put on jw's by the wt society to get rid of everything before " armageddon " .

Gopher

Mostly because it was an orchestrated out right lie.

They deliberately ginned up excitement to increase their membership numbers, their sales and the loyalty of their followers. All of this, without regard to what would happen after the end wouldn't come in 1975.

They were temporarily buoyed by the "1914 generation not passing away" prophecy, but then they changed even that in 1995.

Now they will deny they ever did it. But anyone who was around the organization at that time knows the real deal, and they are disingenous if they try to deny it or say there wasn't huge excitement based around the year of 1975. This is no "apostate lie". Many of us saw it with our own eyes.

41

It is Saturday morning. How many are thrilled that they are Not going d2d today?

by LoisLane looking for Superman in

.

me - me - me!!!.

just lois.

Gopher

I never miss a Saturday morning of field service. I mean, I really don't miss it any more! (It's been 2000 since I went out.)

It's so far in my past, that the only time I think about it is when I visit pages like this one or occasionally see a JW lugging around their literature in the neighborhood.

140

WT Society holds EXTREME Responsibility for 1975 and False Expectations

by flipper in

jw
friends

however- many jw's who have come into the jw organization from like 1985 forward virtually may have no knowledge of the wt society's 1975 debacle and false predictions of the end times or armageddon predictions.

just like in in the book 1984 by george orwell the wt society has a way of not only erasing it's history so no newer witnesses will be aware of their false predictions, but also they are re-writing their history as if those false predictions never happened.. so for those of you here who may have never read or heard of how whipped up into an emotional frenzy witnesses were in the years just before 1975 by the wt society claiming the end was any day now- this threads for you.

to see the pressure that was put on jw's by the wt society to get rid of everything before " armageddon " .

Gopher

I experienced the 1975 thing very personally, and could not agree more. Below is a further sampling of quotes showing the enthusiasm / pressure about the 1975 idea that the Watchtower later blamed on some of its followers being too enthusiastic [about listening to their 1975 spiel]. They can deny it all they want, but the year 1975 was featured in their publications like no other year was (except for 1914).

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"...there are only about ninety months left before 6000 years of man's existence on earth is completed.... The majority of people living today will probably be alive when Armageddon breaks out, and there are no resurrection hopes for those who are destroyed then." Kingdom Ministry, 3/68, p. 4.

"In view of the short time left, a decision to pursue a career in this system of things is not only unwise but extremely dangerous." Kingdom Ministry, 6/69, p. 3.

"Reports are heard of brothers selling their homes and property and planning to finish out the rest of their days in this old system in the pioneer service. Certainly this is a fine way to spend the short time remaining before the wicked world's end." Kingdom Ministry, 5/74, p. 3.

"Are we to assume from this study that the battle of Armageddon will be all over by the autumn of 1975, and the long-looked-for thousand-year reign of Christ will begin by then? Possibly, but we wait to see how closely the seventh thousand-year period of man's existence coincides with the sabbathlike thousand-year reign of Christ. If these two periods run parallel with each other as to the calendar year, it will not be by mere chance or accident but will be according to Jehovah's loving and timely purposes. Our chronology, however, which is reasonably accurate (but admittedly not infallible), at the best only points to the autumn of 1975 as the end of 6,000 years of man's existence on earth. It does not necessarily mean that 1975 marks the end of the first 6,000 years of Jehovah's seventh creative 'day.' Why not? Because after his creation Adam lived some time during the 'sixth day,' which unknown amount of time would need to be subtracted from Adam's 930 years, to determine when the sixth seven-thousand-year period or 'day' ended, and how long Adam lived into the 'seventh day.' And yet the end of that sixth creative 'day' could end within the same Gregorian calendar year of Adam's creation. It may involve only a difference of weeks or months, not years." (Watchtower, August 15, 1968, p. 499, "Why Are You Looking Forward to 1975?")

At all assembly points where it was released, the book was received enthusiastically. Crowds gathered around stands and soon supplies of the book were depleted. Immediately its contents were examined. It did not take the brothers very long to find the chart beginning on page 31, showing that 6,000 years of man's existence end in 1975. Discussion of 1975 overshadowed about everything else. "The new book compels us to realize that Armageddon is, in fact, very close indeed," said a conventioner. Surely it was one of the outstanding blessings to be carried home!
Watchtower 10/15/66 pg.628-9

[Note: I think the book they were talking about in the next quote was the WT Society's 1966 release "Life Everlasting In Freedom Of The Sons of God"]

But, without a doubt, nothing has created more interest in this textbook than the first chapter with its chart and fine information regarding the 7,000 years of God's rest day. The observation that 1975 may well mark the beginning of mankind's great Jubilee has intrigued many.
Watchtower 1/1/67 pg.29

'What about the year 1975? What is it going to mean, dear friends?' asked Brother Franz. 'Does it mean that Armageddon is going to be finished, with Satan bound, by 1975? It could! It could! All things are possible with God. Does it mean that Babylon the Great is going to go down by 1975? It could.
Watchtower 10/15/66 pg.631

In their new book, Famine—1975!, two noted food experts, William and Paul Paddock, make this forecast for the future, on page 61:"By 1975 civil disorder, anarchy, military dictatorships, runaway inflation, transportation breakdowns and chaotic unrest will be the order of the day in many of the hungry nations.
Watchtower 4/15/68 pg.227

38

TV Show, 'The Bible'

by LV101 in

jw
friends

anyone planning to watch 'the bible' tv show march 3 on the history channel.

five episodes focusing on o/t and five about the n/t.

any thoughts?

Gopher

For people who like this genre, it looks passable but won't be a classic along the lines of "The Ten Commandments" or "The Passion of the Christ".

From a critical perspective, most critics are not enthused. http://www.metacritic.com/tv/the-bible

It looks like the new show "The Vikings" on the History Channel is a better production. http://www.metacritic.com/tv/vikings

75

A Lesson Fom OUTLAW..

by OUTLAW in

so i`m sitting at my desk... finding new ways to laugh at the wbt$ on jwn and... i hear a knock on the door... *knock..knock..knock*...... who could that possibly be?...

i`m in the middle of friggin nowhere!..

it`s 2 young jw girls 12 or 13... with an invitation to the memorial... .

Gopher

Well by the time they reached your place, it was obviously the two girls' turn to go to the door. They needed to follow theocratic order and take their turn, otherwise Jehovah might not be happy with them!!

27

Why did the organization stop providing food during conventions?

by redvip2000 in

i'm sure many of us still remember these times when the organization used to sell food at conventions.. i also remember that when this was stopped, the official reason was that the "brothers" were missing some of the program because of all the preparations.

typical watchtower "pretend we care" excuse.. i've wondered if there is another reason behind it, tied to perhaps finances or logistics that was the real deciding factor.

history and typical "modus operandi" of the society tells me that if there was some money to be made that way, they would not have stopped.. wonder if anybody has more info on this..

Gopher

I posted this on the "favorite convention foods thread" too. I think you might enjoy it.

http://www.facebook.com/pages/I-miss-the-cheese-danishes-at-the-conventions/320158803526

On this FB page, several loyal JW's had posted - seemingly complaining about the WTS taking away the food service. What, isn't the fine spiritual food reason enough to gather at the assemblies and conventions?

63

What were your favorite assembly foods?

by NoRegrets in

so i'm young enough to not remember having hot prepared meals at assemblies, but heard all about it from my parents and the like.

but what i do remember were all of the cold sandwiches and institutional snacks and soda.

remember the food tickets we started to use?

Gopher

Why did the organization stop providing food during conventions?

by redvip2000 in

i'm sure many of us still remember these times when the organization used to sell food at conventions.. i also remember that when this was stopped, the official reason was that the "brothers" were missing some of the program because of all the preparations.

typical watchtower "pretend we care" excuse.. i've wondered if there is another reason behind it, tied to perhaps finances or logistics that was the real deciding factor.

history and typical "modus operandi" of the society tells me that if there was some money to be made that way, they would not have stopped.. wonder if anybody has more info on this..

Gopher

I remember when they stopped. The reason they provided (as I remember it) is that they wanted to simplify things, that too much time was being spent preparing the food and dealing with handling the finances involved. They wanted everyone to spend more time "enjoying the convention".

Maybe they were having problems with convention sites insisting that if any food would be served, it would be by THEIR vendors rather than the WT's food service arrangement. So the WT decided it was easier to make their conventioneers drag coolers into the arenas than it would be to deal with the onsite non-JW food vendors.

33

RELIGULOUS...Please watch it.

by Fed-up in

i know it's been commented on before here.

if you haven't seen it (i'm sure it's on netflix) please take a look.

it's the other side of the coin, presented in a funny way that really makes you think about religion and worship.

Gopher

While it's true that Maher did some ranting in the movie (as he often does in performing and on TV), and that he was preaching a bit to his choir, still most critics I read said that the movie actually was funny and that made it watchable. It got a "Fresh" rating of 70 on Rotten Tomatoes and a mixed positive review on Metacritic.

I understand his style isn't for everyone, and whether it was funny and watchable (or not) is purely in the eye of the beholder.