Hi Maddie,
"Chalam - I know that people take the practice seriously and are sincere about it being a heavenly language. I am a bit intrigued by it I must admit, but still wary."
If you believe that God is good and He only gives good gifts to His sons and daughters then what is to fear?
Luke 11 (New International Version)
11"Which of you fathers, if your son asks for[f] a fish, will give him a snake instead? 12Or if he asks for an egg, will give him a scorpion? 13If you then, though you are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father in heaven give the Holy Spirit to those who ask him!"
In the act of speaking it is just like and other kind of speech and one can stop in an instant at will.
Once again, the JWs do not have the Gifts Of The Spirit because they do not have the Spirit.
Here are a couple of good verses to digest.
1 Corinthians 2:14
The man without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned.
John 14 (New International Version)
Jesus Promises the Holy Spirit
16And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Counselor to be with you forever— 17the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be[c] in you. 18I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you. 19Before long, the world will not see me anymore, but you will see me. Because I live, you also will live. 20On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you.
Regards,
Stephen
Posts by Chalam
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66The Gift of Speaking in Tongues?
by Maddie inwith the increase in evangelical churches there seems to be a lot more emphasis on the practise of "speaking in tongues".
i quite like the way these churches conduct services, with live music and great singing.
it is so different to the kh meetings and like fresh air.
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Chalam
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36
144 000 blasted by the MATH (WT lying again)
by hamsterbait ini just took nathan natas chart for numbers of memorial partakers since 1935.. i worked out that on average 823 new partakers have been added every year since 1936, whilst on average 716 have been dying each year.. what is especially interesting, is that when the total of new partaker numbers almost exactly matches that given in w96 15/8 p31 for 1935, is in the year 1995 - they year they began to deliberately create the fog around the "generation" teaching.
(i used actual figures, not averages here).
i am now convinced that they have been paving the way for the feb 15 noolite since then.. i disregarded the figure for 1935 itself, since the witchtower gives two figures for partakers -.
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Chalam
"LOL John 10:30 doesn't simply state Jesus is God. Read the context for pity sake."
So what is your take on the verse?
OK consider these two from the NWT
Isaiah 45
Is it not I, Jehovah, besides whom there is no other God; a righteous God and a Savior, there being none excepting me?
22 “Turn to me and be saved, all YOU [at the] ends of the earth; for I am God, and there is no one else. 23 By my own self I have sworn—out of my own mouth in righteousness the word has gone forth, so that it will not return—that to me every knee will bend down, every tongue will swear, 24 saying, ‘Surely in Jehovah there are full righteousness and strength.
Philippians 2
10 so that in the name of Jesus every knee should bend of those in heaven and those on earth and those under the ground
So there are no other Gods before Jehovah and every knee will "bend" to worship Him but the same is applicable to Jesus. Very interesting in the light of all the other verses like John 10:30.
Regards,
Stephen -
66
The Gift of Speaking in Tongues?
by Maddie inwith the increase in evangelical churches there seems to be a lot more emphasis on the practise of "speaking in tongues".
i quite like the way these churches conduct services, with live music and great singing.
it is so different to the kh meetings and like fresh air.
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Chalam
Hi,
Well my wife speaks in tongues so I suppose I am qualified to comment.
Yes it is still happening and is a gift of The Spirit.
It is normally a heavenly prayer language and in not understandable between the mind of the person speaking, only their spirit.
If it is spoken to the whole church then there should be an interpretation of the tongue so everyone can understand what God is saying.
Far less seldom I have seen people praying or ministering in a different earthly language to someone who doesn't speak the language being spoken in the meeting or grasps their own native tongue far better.
All of these three cases are spoken about by the Apostle Paul.
JWs think that 1 Corinthians 13 is a good verse to say tongues have ceased but they haven't and the verse itself says "when perfection comes" which it clearly hasn't-open any newspaper.
JWs think that those speaking in tongues or using gifts of the Spirit are doing so by satanic powers but it is an age old accusation.
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=48&chapter=3&verse=20&end_verse=30&version=31&context=context
For the good, the bad and the ugly have a look on here.
http://youtube.com/results?search_query=%22speaking+in+tongues%22&search=Search
Regards,
Stephen -
97
Own up time...
by Chalam inwell it looks like this site is a real melting pot, a broad spectrum of views and beliefs.
for sure there are many disaffected ex jws.
so in as few words as possible, preferably not more than one sentence, how would you describe yourself spiritually?
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Chalam
Hi,
Isaiah 55:9
"As the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways and my thoughts than your thoughts."
Regards,
Stephen -
32
Something that bugged me the other day.
by tnangel73 ini live in a very small town.
i hadn't been to the local mexican restaurant in quite awhile until the other day.
my mom, my son and me were .
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Chalam
Hi,
"Rule #1: Do nothing that reflects unfavorably on Jehovah's people;
Rule #2: When in doubt, leave a tip and some literature, thus doubly satisfying Rule #1."
It is interesting that the Bible talks about "Freedom In Christ" and not to live by rules (which is futile) but by the Spirit.
JWs are sunk as they don't have The Spirit to live by or understand Him at all.
Regards,
Stephen -
36
144 000 blasted by the MATH (WT lying again)
by hamsterbait ini just took nathan natas chart for numbers of memorial partakers since 1935.. i worked out that on average 823 new partakers have been added every year since 1936, whilst on average 716 have been dying each year.. what is especially interesting, is that when the total of new partaker numbers almost exactly matches that given in w96 15/8 p31 for 1935, is in the year 1995 - they year they began to deliberately create the fog around the "generation" teaching.
(i used actual figures, not averages here).
i am now convinced that they have been paving the way for the feb 15 noolite since then.. i disregarded the figure for 1935 itself, since the witchtower gives two figures for partakers -.
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Chalam
Hi greendawn,
"One wonders if the hundreds of thousands or perhaps even millions that surrendered themselves to be martyred for the Christian cause throughout the centuries from 100AD until now, have done so in vain."
Matthew 7:21-23 (New International Version)
"Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?' Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'
Well expect there are many. Hitler sent many JWs to their death and my belief is that they died in vain. I expect there will be other false beliefs we can include in similar circumstances.
"Not to mention those that led chaste and saintly lives though never martyred."
Well our best efforts don't amount to much in God's eyes. Only God's grace will save us.
"It shows the fiendish arrogance of the JWs, to write off so easily with one stroke the labours of so many fine people, everything they accomplished was in vain!"
See what God has to say.
Isaiah 64:6 (New International Version)
All of us have become like one who is unclean, and all our righteous acts are like filthy rags; we all shrivel up like a leaf, and like the wind our sins sweep us away.
"This reveals so clearly that they are a ruthless vicious enemy of the Christian church. Not surprising given their masonic occultic connections at least during the first half of their existence."
I agree but I do not count them as the enemy, only the 'father of lies' behind their organisation. My biggest problem with the JWs is their point of view regarding Jesus. My Bible has these nuggets regarding Him.
Philippians 2:9
Therefore God exalted him to the highest place and gave him the name that is above every name.
Acts 4:12
Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved.
Romans 10:13
Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.
Revelation 19:16
On his robe and on his thigh he has this name written: KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS.
John 14:8-9
Philip said, "Lord, show us the Father and that will be enough for us."
Jesus answered: "Don't you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father.
John 10:30
I and the Father are one.
I could go on but you get the gist. Yes, Jesus is the most important name in history and He is the one who forgives sins. Make sure you call upon His name and not the name of Jehovah. Yes He is God as John 10:30 simply states.
Regards,
Stephen -
13
Could the widespread belief in God be evidence that he doesn't exist?
by DT infirst of all, i'm an agnostic and don't know if there is a god or not.
however, i do think it possible to intelligently review the evidence and come to some reasonable conclusions, even if we can't have absolute certainty.
it's a big topic, so i'll just discuss the main reason that many people believe in god.
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Chalam
Hi,
Good statement about faith "Must Obey!". That is why God seeming 'hasn't been around much'. He requires faith and for those who have faith He is not distant but near.
On the subject of making creation in seven days then surely, if He is who He says He is, then seven seconds who be plenty long enough?
Anyhow, time is immaterial to God as He exists outside of it (space too).
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=23&chapter=90&verse=4&version=31&context=verse
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=68&chapter=3&verse=8&version=31&context=verse
So you could read from these verses that God did not take literally seven days, but seven thousand years, conclude it was a very long time indeed, or say that the actual time was not important.
My own belief is that it is most likely seven days, but my second choice would be seven thousand years.
Regards,
Stephen -
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Chalam
Cool video-plenty of real truths in there! "Produced by an active member"-nice touch.
I have watched quite a few JW related videos on YouTube, this user has some of the best IMHO.
http://youtube.com/profile?user=araretreat -
13
Could the widespread belief in God be evidence that he doesn't exist?
by DT infirst of all, i'm an agnostic and don't know if there is a god or not.
however, i do think it possible to intelligently review the evidence and come to some reasonable conclusions, even if we can't have absolute certainty.
it's a big topic, so i'll just discuss the main reason that many people believe in god.
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Chalam
Hi,
"If there is a God. I would expect that he would not only give convincing evidence of his existence"
Yes I believe we have it. See here
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=23&chapter=19&version=31&context=chapter
"but would also design us with the ability to properly understand and visualise the nature of the universe."
Well in many ways we can't do that because we aren't God and do not have His abilities. How can you understand the limits of time and space until you have existed outside them? That said, we can appreciate its God-like design because we are made in the image of God.
Genesis 1:25-27 (New International Version)
25 God made the wild animals according to their kinds, the livestock according to their kinds, and all the creatures that move along the ground according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good.
26 Then God said, "Let us make man in our image, in our likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, [a] and over all the creatures that move along the ground."
27 So God created man in his own image,
in the image of God he created him;
male and female he created them.
Notice the first reference in the Bible to God being plural but singular too ;) I am sure the WTO has a perfectly rational explanation for that as well!
"(at least of a loving and wise God)"
Well, although it is hard for most ex-JWs or non-Christians, I believe the Bible is true when it says God is love. On the second point, the Bible has much to say on the wisdom of God if you check it out, but logically speaking, if God created us and the whole universe, He must be far wiser than anything in it.
My own feeling is that deep down we do not misunderstand the universe or the existence of God. Most polls still point to the majority of people believing that God exists. However, that alone will not get you into His Kingdom.
Regards,
Stephen -
32
Something that bugged me the other day.
by tnangel73 ini live in a very small town.
i hadn't been to the local mexican restaurant in quite awhile until the other day.
my mom, my son and me were .
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Chalam
OK these should do it, no mention of WT tracts here!
Proverbs 22:9
A generous man will himself be blessed, for he shares his food with the poor.
Psalm 37:21
The wicked borrow and do not repay, but the righteous give generously
Romans 12:8
if it is contributing to the needs of others, let him give generously
Regards,
Stephen