Chalam

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Posts by Chalam

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  156

  When we die...

  by Finallyfree12 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  do you beleive our spirit lives on in other dimensions or are we really just dead?

  ?.

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  Chalam

  Finallyfree12 "my brother saw that movie and said it was really good. i'll look into this. Thanks"

  All good :)

  I read the book and if the film does it in any way justice it will be excellent!

  Stephen
• 
  156

  When we die...

  by Finallyfree12 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  do you beleive our spirit lives on in other dimensions or are we really just dead?

  ?.

  1. 
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  3. 
• 

  Chalam

  For those who do not like definitions from the dictionary, here's a perfect one from the bible :)

  1 Corinthians 2:11

  English Standard Version Anglicised (ESVUK)

  11 For who knows a person's thoughts except the spirit of that person, which is in him? So also no one comprehends the thoughts of God except the Spirit of God.

  Stephen
• 
  156

  When we die...

  by Finallyfree12 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  do you beleive our spirit lives on in other dimensions or are we really just dead?

  ?.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Chalam

  spirit | ˈspirit |

  noun

  1 the nonphysical part of a person that is the seat of emotions and character; the soul : we seek a harmony between body and spirit .

  • the nonphysical part of a person regarded as a person's true self and as capable of surviving physical death or separation : a year after he left, his spirit is still present .

  • the nonphysical part of a person manifested as an apparition after their death; a ghost .
• 
  156

  When we die...

  by Finallyfree12 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  do you beleive our spirit lives on in other dimensions or are we really just dead?

  ?.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Chalam

  Finallyfree12 there are a huge number of credible testimonies to those who have seen there is more beyond this physical life we have.

  Here's just one http://www.amazon.com/Heaven-Real-Little-Astounding-Story/dp/0849946158

  Stephen
• 
  48

  Strike 3 for the elderette and me! (???) I never heard a JW talk SO much about Jesus!

  by Faithful Witness in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  miss k and her friend miss w arrived promptly today.

  our scheduled topic of discussion: jesus' claim to be "the way, the truth and the life..." john 14:6 since she was basing this topic choice on the fact that i had quoted that verse, i'm not sure why... she spent what seemed like a very long time, hopping through scriptures that all said that jesus was the truth, the way, or the life.

  ok, so we agreed... i kept waiting for her to get to a point, or sway from this principle.. of course, she summed up with scriptures that show how jesus submits to the father, and what does that mean we should do?

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  Chalam

  "Chalam: That is a great reference! I am taking a good look at that, and will definitely bring it up with her."

  Glad to be of assistance :)

  Of course, the well trained JW will have a good reason to not actualy follow what is clearly written! I have come to the conclusion that they do not actualy believe a single word of the new testament. Take for example these verses which I read to the last two JWs at the door who had come to tell me about 'the Memorial'.

  John 6:52-54

  English Standard Version Anglicised (ESVUK)

  52 The Jews then disputed among themselves, saying, “How can this man give us his flesh to eat?” 53 So Jesus said to them,“Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you. 54 Whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.

  So I asked them if they had life in them and Jesus would raise them up on the last day? They said this was for the 144, 000 only. However, Jesus clearly is stating that those who don't partake of His body and blood spiritually or physicallly have no life in them, and will not be raised up at the resurrection to eternal life. I remarked they believe what the WT say rather than contrary to what Jesus stated. They said they are happy with the WT explanations rather than taking on Jesus' directive. JWs have exalted the WT above Jesus, and indeed the WT have set themselves up in the place of Jesus.

  Stephen
• 
  199

  Trinitarians! Who is Jesus Christ's father the Holy Spirit or the Father?

  by booker-t in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  this is one question that trinitarians try to avoid because they have created a very embarrassing problem.

  the bible is very clear when the angel tells mary that holy spirit will overshadow her and she will become pregnant.

  the angel does not say the father will overshadow her but the holy spirit will and if the holy spirit is a person that would make him the father of jesus.

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  Chalam

  Jesus is not a "natural man" in the sense as the same limitations as us on earth because He now has a new type of body. This is the same form as His old body (i.e. He looks the same) but as I mentioned the "glorified" body is in every way superior to the "natural" one. Our currently bodies decay and will die. All those who believe will receive as body like Jesus.

  Jesus confirmed He is indeed a man with a physical body, eating physical food in Luke 24:39-43 etc. Some might say this was illusion but the same type of flasehood exits in the WT with regards to Jesus' resurection body. In similar ways, other heresies exists amongst other groups which claim Jesus death and/or resurrection were were just an illusion. It is clear that the disciples thought Jesus was appearing only in spirit, not physically but He showed them otherwise.

  I think these verses speak clearly enought regarding the nature of Jesus.

  Hebrews 13:8

  English Standard Version Anglicised (ESVUK)

  8 Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and for ever.

  Stephen
• 
  48

  Strike 3 for the elderette and me! (???) I never heard a JW talk SO much about Jesus!

  by Faithful Witness in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  miss k and her friend miss w arrived promptly today.

  our scheduled topic of discussion: jesus' claim to be "the way, the truth and the life..." john 14:6 since she was basing this topic choice on the fact that i had quoted that verse, i'm not sure why... she spent what seemed like a very long time, hopping through scriptures that all said that jesus was the truth, the way, or the life.

  ok, so we agreed... i kept waiting for her to get to a point, or sway from this principle.. of course, she summed up with scriptures that show how jesus submits to the father, and what does that mean we should do?

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  Chalam

  Never noticed this before but according to the text the "other sheep" should be listening to Jesus.

  John 10:14-16

  English Standard Version Anglicised (ESVUK)

  14 I am the good shepherd. I know my own and my own know me, 15 just as the Father knows me and I know the Father; and I lay down my life for the sheep. 16 And I have other sheep that are not of this fold. I must bring them also, and they will listen to my voice. So there will be one flock, one shepherd.

  All the best,

  Stephen
• 
  199

  Trinitarians! Who is Jesus Christ's father the Holy Spirit or the Father?

  by booker-t in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  this is one question that trinitarians try to avoid because they have created a very embarrassing problem.

  the bible is very clear when the angel tells mary that holy spirit will overshadow her and she will become pregnant.

  the angel does not say the father will overshadow her but the holy spirit will and if the holy spirit is a person that would make him the father of jesus.

  1. 
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  Chalam

  Luke 24:36-43

  English Standard Version (ESV)

  Jesus Appears to His Disciples

  36 As they were talking about these things, Jesus himself stood among them, and said to them, “Peace to you!” 37 But they were startled and frightened and thought they saw a spirit. 38 And he said to them, “Why are you troubled, and why do doubts arise in your hearts? 39 See my hands and my feet, that it is I myself. Touch me, and see. For a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see that I have.” 40 And when he had said this, he showed them his hands and his feet. 41 And while they still disbelieved for joy and were marveling, he said to them, “Have you anything here to eat?” 42 They gave him a piece of broiled fish, 43 and he took it and ate before them.

  Acts 1:9-11

  English Standard Version (ESV)

  9 And when he had said these things, as they were looking on, he was lifted up, and a cloud took him out of their sight. 10 And while they were gazing into heaven as he went, behold, two men stood by them in white robes, 11 and said, “Men of Galilee, why do you stand looking into heaven? This Jesus, who was taken up from you into heaven, will come in the same way as you saw him go into heaven.”

  John 3:13

  English Standard Version (ESV)

  13 No one has ascended into heaven except he who descended from heaven, the Son of Man.

  1 Timothy 2:5

  English Standard Version (ESV)

  5 For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus

  1 Corinthians 15:44-49

  English Standard Version (ESV)

  44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body. 45 Thus it is written, “The first man Adam became a living being”; the last Adam became a life-giving spirit. 46 But it is not the spiritual that is first but the natural, and then the spiritual. 47 The first man was from the earth, a man of dust; the second man is from heaven.48 As was the man of dust, so also are those who are of the dust, and as is the man of heaven,so also are those who are of heaven. 49 Just as we have borne the image of the man of dust, we shall also bear the image of the man of heaven.

  Simples :)

  Stephen
• 
  199

  Trinitarians! Who is Jesus Christ's father the Holy Spirit or the Father?

  by booker-t in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  this is one question that trinitarians try to avoid because they have created a very embarrassing problem.

  the bible is very clear when the angel tells mary that holy spirit will overshadow her and she will become pregnant.

  the angel does not say the father will overshadow her but the holy spirit will and if the holy spirit is a person that would make him the father of jesus.

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  Chalam

  "I have always found it difficult to understand the trinitarian belief that Jesus is/was fully God and fully man. Indeed, trinitarians themselves could not agree whether he had one nature or two. Nor could they agree whether the Holy Spirit proceeded from the Father only or both the Father and the Son. In fact just about every Church Father was declared heretical and/or anathema by a later Council."

  Jesus was and is fully God but became a man. It is clear He did not rely on His Divinity but rather the power of the Spirit to do only what He saw the Father doing. The Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father and the Son, as the Spirit is synonymous with both of them i.e the Holy Spiriy is the Spirit of God and the Spirit of Jesus. To state Jesus became man and not God or the other way round is what was declared heretical no doubt?

  "But what caught my attention in the current thread was that not only was Jesus fully God and fully man when he was on earth, but that he is still fully God and fully man. I am unclear whether this is "orthodox" belief but would appreciate clarification. Is the belief that the human Jesus is now in heaven? Does he still need to eat and breath? Is he affected by cold and heat as humans are? It seems such an extraordinary claim I think I must have misunderstood and would appreciate any constructive thoughts on this."

  Yes, Jesus is now and forever a man. Yes, He eats for sure. However, not everything about the "gloryfied" or "spiritual" body is the same as the natural one or indeed has it limitations. If you need verses for any of this stuff then gimme a shout or otherwise happy digging. Also, there are numerous excellent accounts of heaven which are well worth checking out.

  All the best,

  Stephen
• 
  199

  Trinitarians! Who is Jesus Christ's father the Holy Spirit or the Father?

  by booker-t in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  this is one question that trinitarians try to avoid because they have created a very embarrassing problem.

  the bible is very clear when the angel tells mary that holy spirit will overshadow her and she will become pregnant.

  the angel does not say the father will overshadow her but the holy spirit will and if the holy spirit is a person that would make him the father of jesus.

  1. 
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  Chalam

  factfinder, you have missed this.

  Philippians 2:5-7

  English Standard Version Anglicised (ESVUK)

  5 Have this mind among yourselves, which is yours in Christ Jesus, 6 who, though he was in the form of God, did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped, 7 but made himself nothing, taking the form of a servant, being born in the likeness of men.

  Blessings,

  Stephen