Well, a full moon could, on it's own, do just that. Take it that when the moon is full and visible where you don't get to see the moon, strange things, different things, happen. That's recipe for getting mushy.
Posts by Gozz
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34Do FULL MOONS....make men horny?
by gumby inyes ,yes, this is an odd topic for me i know but i just gotta ask!
it seems a full moon does somthin......i mean really does somthin!.
whats the deal?
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27
What is an Apostate?
by happy man in"this is not a posting to point the finger at any particular individual, but to hopefully share some relevant findings concerning apostate operation with this board.
the question of what constitutes apostasy, or rather what doesnt constitute apostasy does not proffer the obscure indeterminate answer that some opponents have assumed.
instead, it is a keenly documented scriptural truth that pries into the heart and emotional inclination of all people whether mindful of it or not.
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Gozz
Apostasy is a standing away from, a falling away, defection, rebellion, abandonment; it involves teaching false doctrines, supporting or promoting false religion and its holidays or interfaith activities. (Deut. 13:13, 15; Josh.22:22, ftn.; Acts 21:21, ftn.; 2 Cor. 6:14, 15, 17, 18;
2. John 7, 9, 10; Rev. 18:4)This definition, I suppose, allows the Society to apply the Apostate label to anyone who may not be overtly, or actively promoting teachings other than what they preach. It would mean getting into the mind, and probably finding something, anything, to support that claim. If someone stops attending meetings, say, that could be abandonment, and can be taken as proof of having deserted Jehovah. A Watchtower issue had defined a true Witness as one who believes everything being taught by Jehovah's Witnesses, including teaching peculiar to the organization.
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Christianity and Enforced Unity
by Gozz infrequently, jws will argue that the unity of the congregation is inviolable.
that has been the case in the ongoing child molestation cases, where a number of those involved have been expelled based ont he allegation of "sowing discord".
my correspondences with jws on several levels have shown that this is the current, and most attractive explanation to justify the expulsion/disfellowshipping of those championing the child molestation cases.
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Gozz
Robyn, thanks.
We were almost all engulfed by that kind of fear. So where did it go? Many Witnesses have left the Organization. Is there a common thread or common threads to why they left? We can blow hot all we want about Witnesses not listening, but it's probably because there's not system to the way we've gone about doing it. Witnesses themselves have a system; they've won converts; the number are dropping, fine, but some total outsiders are still joining the organization. Other than observations and exposure to outside information, if Witnesses can see examples that going against God's Divine Messenger has not always resulted in overt actions of disapproval on the part of God, might be a way to start making them use their own mind, no?
I'm happy some for your dad. But you'll probably agree that there were days when he wasn't exactly like this. There's something lurking behind the JW conscience, or what is displayed of it. How can one get to it?
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27
What is an Apostate?
by happy man in"this is not a posting to point the finger at any particular individual, but to hopefully share some relevant findings concerning apostate operation with this board.
the question of what constitutes apostasy, or rather what doesnt constitute apostasy does not proffer the obscure indeterminate answer that some opponents have assumed.
instead, it is a keenly documented scriptural truth that pries into the heart and emotional inclination of all people whether mindful of it or not.
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Gozz
Rather, it is the motivation behind such questioning of some people that apparently needs to be given greater attention than the question itself. This becomes evident when a person believes they have no other recourse than to turn to opposers and/or defectors for clarification of troubling matters – thus laying the groundwork for the potentiality of further exploitation.
****One problem with Watchtower apologists, and Jehovah's Witnesses in general, is to make an assumption about the state of mind, or motivation of anyone beginning to question. What makes the determination of the person's motivation more important than the question being asked? A fear that the question may not be answered sufficiently well to satisfy the questioner? Or a fear that beneath such questioning lies what the Society hates the most, to answer to their own and admit some wrong? And as the Governing Body wishes that Witnesses not talk to those on the other side (even while engaging in the sacred work of preaching to everyone), just what mechanism is in place to hear the arguments from all sides? None. Again, there's the assumption that opposers and defectors will always want to exploit!
Hence, sometimes more important than ‘why’ certain individuals are dissatisfied with the role the WTS plays in their spiritual lives is ‘what’ leads these ones to a course of dissatisfaction (and perhaps eventually to opposition) in the first place? This is a long and often difficult study in itself, due mostly to the complexity of situations that lend a person to search for rationality or respite from foreign sources while being in the midst of a personal dilemma. Be that as it may however, it is an important concept that those seeking Jehovah’s friendship do well to consider…
****Oh! It's a long and often difficult study? Ever tried doing the simpler thing, answering the questions asked, rather than getting into the mind of the questioner? Isn't Jehovah the one searching hearts? Why don't let Jehovah do that, and you, face up to what Paul wrote about being ready to defend the faith before anyone requiring such? It's a strange concept, one fraught with pain.
It is my hope that all of us will think candidly about the processes driving disaffection and apostasy despite the fact that they entail a great deal of self-analysis and disclosure; and are often not easily observed, since the “heart is more treacherous than anything else and is desperate.” (Jeremiah 17:9) Yet honesty concerning one’s motivations is an integral factor in determining whether an individual will accept or repudiate refining counsel or understanding that comes from the engine room of Jehovah’s earthly organisation. If not, a person may silently become disaffected and subsequently turn to apostate information due to seemingly rational, faith based judgements. In truth however, this is no more than the foundering of decision justified by scrutiny.
****Interesting! So why don't offer refining cousel first? Why bother to strangle the messenger? Witnesses are happy to meet religious people who ask sensible questions when they go out to preach. do they expect these same "thinking" people to stop thinking once they become baptized? How could Jeremiah 17:) be applied to someone honestly asking a question? What desperate hearts?
Examining this point, I would like to cheat (sorry) and paste a quotation from a paper that I am working on concerning this issue.
“When under the influence of apostate ideology, the person affected by this thinking experiences an often difficult and sometimes confusing array of emotions. For one to have their life so drastically altered that there arises open repudiation against ones former associates there first has to occur what could be termed a deconversion – reconversion process. This process, which happens prior to their renouncement and subsequent hostility, is the culmination of many long hours spent pondering various discrepancies, spiritual or scriptural, that have hijacked the individuals disposition and absorbed it into one of brooding, fascination and speculation concerning the congregation and its convictions.”*****So what exactly is wrong with this picture? First off, not all apostates are hostile to the congregation. To link apostace with subsequent hostility is a tactic the Society employs all the time. It's a false option. Besides, your quote takes off from a wrong location; not all who begin to question are already under the influence of "apostate ideology", rather, it is the inconsistency in teachings, and a conflict between what is preached and what is actually done, and indepth study, up from the state of knowing nothing, and thing like that, that make people begin to question. Your quote mentions, but ignores discrepancies, say.
Needless to say, I hope that any who may be inclined to engage a known apostate in dialogue will reconsider – not only for the hitherto reasons, but more importantly because of the biblical mandate against such an act. (Romans 16:17)
***Even Satan was allowed time in God's court.
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With This One Thought, You Become An XJW
by metatron inthere is one thought, which if spoken , even privately to yourself, instantly.
transforms you into an ex-witness.. it is:.
"what the hell was i thinking?".
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Gozz
There were many instances. They went ignored. But this one event I recall... The CO had come. He's a happy little man with a warm smile. And he liked to tell stories. We were sitting in the KH and he was telling this story about a man who'd wanted to sue someone (his spouse, or the Society or the congregation.. I don't clearly recall...something about blood...) and when the man heard that the Society was getting involved, he withdrew the case; CO added it was because of the reputation the Society had for winning such cases in defence of Jehovah's people....and people were laughed. This wasn't funny. And I thought to me: what am I doing here? Do I really belong here?everyone seemed different after that meeting. How could they be laughing to stuff like that?
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40
Fw: As Bro Sydlick was saying the closing prayer
by NikL ini just had to pass this on to you.. it is an e mail that is making the rounds.. what do you think of this.... (beware!
gagging may be expected).
the 41,000 friends at the international convention in michigan .
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Gozz
Bro. Dan is a man with some conscience, what's remaining of it. He's praying for all those other sheep and thinking: see how mucht they believe, see how much we've messed them all up, will God forgive us...?", he's praying and thinking, and because he can't tell the hapless other sheep his thoughts, and is afraid God won't just let him go, he can't contain anymore and bursts into tears of pain... the duds are rationalizing... how much he loves us.. everyone's tearing at the grounds... on the way home everyone talks about how blessed they are with such annointed... Bro Dan returns to Brooklyn and it's business as usual... the duds talk about it forever.. forever... and someday, it amkes it to the Watchtower, and lo! it was actually the fulfillment of some scripture... Amen
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87
Men: Honest answers, please, to an honest question
by berylblue infrom another thread:where else does the media so vividly show females as equal .
when i read this, i had to wonder: is there something wrong with doing so?
portraying women as equals?
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Gozz
Robyn! <gasps>
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Will the Watchtower take down their website?
by integ inwhat can the watchtower do to stop the influx of their flock from going to apostate web sites that expose their false doctrines?
one way would be to take down their website so no one would even have a reason to get on line.
too severe right?
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Gozz
I don't think they'll take it down. There's too much temptation in trying to explain their own part of disputes. Taking the site down will be a form of defeat. They could still tell their own to visit the internet and espouse how it could be put to good use. It's a mistake they made and can't take back. They're toast. Sooner than later, any JW using the iNet is tepmted to visit some other sites, the curious ones may want to know what others are saying about their religions. Some others may want to meet other brothers and sisters, and get directed to a site like this. Of course, the first reaction is to shut down, but there are other sites where the information is solid, straight from the JW books. Ingofrmationa ny honest hearted (uh!) person cannot ignore.
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Christianity and Enforced Unity
by Gozz infrequently, jws will argue that the unity of the congregation is inviolable.
that has been the case in the ongoing child molestation cases, where a number of those involved have been expelled based ont he allegation of "sowing discord".
my correspondences with jws on several levels have shown that this is the current, and most attractive explanation to justify the expulsion/disfellowshipping of those championing the child molestation cases.
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Gozz
So no on eresponded to this thread?
Gozz, returning from some form of exile.
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Gozz
A heart-rending picture, that head in a box. Grim. Horrible. Have they been duped? Yes. And it cost their lives too. Blood on the hands of those whot aught them to preach even when their safety was not guaranteed. Blood on the hands of those who've pushed the families to grief. Blood on the hands of Abu Sayyaf and the governing body of Jehovah's Wittnesses.
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