this is my official liberation-opting to miss a memorial and joining the community here on this day.
i've been to the memorial maybe twice in 12 years but was "this close" to checking it out again for curiousness sake to see if i would feel differently as so much time has passed and beacuse i've changed so much.
anyone here ever wonder if you just imagined the horrorness of being a jw?
Welcome to the board ART!
I did went to the memorial for a reality check. It was dreadful. It made me realize how much I have grown mentally since I stopped going. How silly it all is, having an outside observer's view instead of a member's view. It was mentally tormenting. So safe to say you didn't miss much.
Greven
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years ago, when the cover of the new world translation was green coloured, mormon missionaries referred to it as the "green devil".
anyone knows of similar or other expressions?
No, never heard of that expression. Then again I don't know any mormon either.
Greven
?the bible ?
is quite a publishing phenomenon.
its initial release was during the reign of king james, a noted historical figure who would not be allowed into most western homes today, as he was known for not taking baths more than once a month.
That was fun SYN
I think it should carry an age restriction advise, in the form of: Parental advisory: explicit, incestuous, vile content. Don't try this at home kids!
Greven
according to this, jesus is not just the mediator of the 144,000 -- he's the mediator of mankind!!
and apparently "dear jesus" prayers are okay!
the watch tower says i can say, "dear jesus, you are my mediator as you are for all mankind..." "the bible clearly says that jesus christ is mankind's redeemer, so he is mankind's mediator.
Jehovah is the "main frame/server" and Jesus is the "router". Got it
LOL@xjw_b12!
Greven
whew*....i finally registered, and guess what?!
it wasnt as hard as i thought it would be lol.
i've been lurking here, quietly and observing the board for about 2 years now.
Are you babtised BTW? If not, they cannot DF you.
As to advise: I second Little Toe.
And welcome to the board girl!
Greven
i seriously forgot many of the teachings of jw's.
the more i read your posts and do research on my own the more i realize how little i really know about the bible and jw teachings.. .
my question is this: if able and even enoch proved to be true followers of god even though imperfect why was it necessary for god to send his son to die for us?
Realist,
Logical contradictions are not a fair 'test' IMHO. It is about definitions not power. He can not make square circles or dark light, not because of lack of might but because one definition excludes the other. We are the ones that create the definitions. Basically you ask: can God do something he cannot do? You have in advance defined something as impossible, and then ask if it is possible.
Greven
according to this, jesus is not just the mediator of the 144,000 -- he's the mediator of mankind!!
and apparently "dear jesus" prayers are okay!
the watch tower says i can say, "dear jesus, you are my mediator as you are for all mankind..." "the bible clearly says that jesus christ is mankind's redeemer, so he is mankind's mediator.
"If Jehovah's Witnesses really have the truth, it should be able to stand up to scrutiny." (I don't know how to do the copy where you can tell that I'm doing a quote. Scoozi.)Haven't they? I mean no other religion gets more scrutiny. And yet they still stand. Steadily increasing.
Your reasoning goes well for the Islam:
The islam has been through the centuries (and even more now) under severe scrutiny and they are still standing and rapidly increasing their members. So they must have the truth? C'mon!
Scrutiny doesn't kill a religion because it is mostly irrational (ie based on faith rather than evidence).
There are people that believe in alien abduction, the lochness monster and even fairies!
Do some research and you'll see that their logic is flawed and their reasoning full of holes. Sure you can still believe but supported by fact and evidence it is not.
Greven
Greven
i seriously forgot many of the teachings of jw's.
the more i read your posts and do research on my own the more i realize how little i really know about the bible and jw teachings.. .
my question is this: if able and even enoch proved to be true followers of god even though imperfect why was it necessary for god to send his son to die for us?
I do not get the logic of the ransome sacrifice
Oh, it's simple really! The logic goes as follows:
1)Your great great great great great etc, ancestor made the fatal mistake of eating a piece of yet undertermined fruit. Let's assume it was a banana.
2) Naturally you and I carry part of the blame. Eventhough you and me weren't even born yet. Somehow this causes us to die. Animals die too, but what sin their ancestors practised is not clear. They could be designed that way, but who would design something that breaks down on purpose?
3) To release you of this terrible curse, God again mercifully punishes or allows to be punished someone else. This happens to be his son, who had also nothing to do with the original sin. As everybody knows two wrongs makes one right.
4)Voila! This releases you of the blame for something you never did in the first place. Oh, you still die though. That's not part of the bargain.
It all makes perfect sense!
Greven
a certain jw doesn't believe in the 1914 doctrine any longer.
this, of course, naturally gives rise to certain serious problems.
for example, how can this person now continue to participate in field service activities and make use of the publications produced by the wts?
It seems that some people tend to think of an inacuracy as always being "a lie" ... instead of an error. Yes, although something that isn't "true" can be a "lie," there is such a thing as someone sincerely believing that something is true and accurate, yet is not ... which of course is then NOT "a lie".
Schizm, you have a valid point there. Something is either true or false. An error is not per definition a lie. However, it does when one knows it to be an error yet teach it as truth. The society got that date and the chronology leading to it from an Adventist named Nelson Barbour in 1876. It was based on the assumption that Jerusalem fell in the year 606 (later changed to 607). Be that as it may, one has only to open up an encyclopedia, any one will do and look up the date for the fall of Jerusalem: all evidence, both biblical and secular points to the year 586/7 for that event. The society knows this. They have admitted that there are thousands of clay tablets that point to this consensus (I can look up the publication if you want). No-one uses this date other then JW's.
Well, if a date is so much in conflict with all evidence and you are willing to cling to it, don't you think you have a moral obligation to inform your readers that you are using a date not recognized by all archeologists, historians etc, and reasons why? But instead, the society hushes it up. When one deliberately acts in such a manner (covering up evidence, not presenting all facts) it could be classified as lying or at least deception.
Some claim you should not atack articles of faith. However this doctrine is not brought to you as pure something you have to accept on faith. No, they claim that it is backed up with prophecy, biblical and secular evidence. This date 607 is preached as were it an established, accepted fact. It is not. This could also be classified as lying.
I would recommend looking into this so more. There are many articles to be found on this very subject just type in 607 at any search and you should have enough to go on. Also history books, encyclopedia etc. And the subject has come up on this board numerous times. We even have someone vigorously defending 607 among our members: scholar. It might be usefull to follow some of the debates between him and some other members, so you can see both sides of the issue.
Good luck in your search for truth!
Greven
a certain jw doesn't believe in the 1914 doctrine any longer.
this, of course, naturally gives rise to certain serious problems.
for example, how can this person now continue to participate in field service activities and make use of the publications produced by the wts?
Indeed, the 1914 doctrine is the backbone of this religion. On this doctrine alone rests the entire authority of the GB. Disbelieving this doctrine will disqualify one as a JW. There was a watchtower about this in 1986, I believe. That stated that one was considered a JW not only by believing in the bible but also in all the beliefs unique to JW's. 1914 was stated as a prime example.
Greven
