Posts by Gwendolyn

24

CO&PO came to see me

by GermanXJW in

i have been inactive for a year now.

before that i was quite active, had only an average time slip but did a lot of things you cannot count.

but i had read r.franz and the internet.

I HAD to post, because I had a similar experience to yours recently. I too was raised in the truth, even pioneered for a while, etc etc. A few weeks ago the CO and an elder came for a shepherding call because I haven't attended meetings in a while. I just moved to this area about 8 mos ago, and only went a few times because of family.

I pride myself on being honest, so when they asked me why I hadn't been to meetings (was it because of work?, they asked) I simply said that I didn't find the meetings interesting and didn't want to go. They were quite taken aback. They started into the same things you mentioned---relationship with God, happiness, etc. Now, I did not bring anything up about whether or not their doctrines are correct, I had no interest in getting into an argument. I merely pointed out that I did not see going to the KH as essential or equivalent to my having a relationship with God. They asked what was I doing, and I told them working, going to school, and I mentioned a couple of my educational goals for the future.

The CO (whom I have only met briefly once before, and who does not know me personally at all) had the nerve to say (this is an exact quote):
"So, now that you have turned your back on God, what is your purpose in life?"
One of those: "so when did you stop beating your wife?" questions
I calmly separated the parts of his question and answered, explaining that I didn't feel i had turned my back on God, and didn't think he had the authority to make such a blanket statment, especially when he doesn't even know me.
He also (at the end) sat there and told me that I wasn't happy. When I begged to differ (again pointing out that i found it amazing he could make such an assesment without knowing me at all). He just insisted that I wasn't or that at least I wouldn't be (because I didn't want to go to meetings).

While I realize that there ARE elders out there who wouldn't sit in my living room and say things like this (I have met some very thoughtful and nice ones), they are the minority.

I had been kind of wavering on what I wanted to do...was I going to try to retain my relationship with the JWs or not? And this "shepherding call" really helped me to make a decision.

Unfortunately for them, I don't think it is the decision they wanted! They really should look at revamping their methods of encouragement if they want them to work!

26

very alone..

by flower in

i know that people have been in the same boat as i am and have felt the same but i still feel very alone tonight.

and very depressed.

i dont think some people understand even here.

Gwendolyn

Flower;

I have been in that pit of depression you are describing. I am so sorry for all of the pain you are in!

You know, there is a reason that people self-injure (like cutting oneself). It is most common in women, and we do it to regain some sort of control over our bodies or lives, when we feel like we don't have control. I imagine that at this point you feel somewhat trapped. What you KNOW in your mind and heart, is not what the people around you are telling you, and you are afraid to challenge them for fear of losing them, so you are trapped.

Let me say, from experience, you NEED to go with what YOU know to be true. It will not be easy, but the rewards are immense.

One problem I see over and over is that people want to leave, but at the same time they feel guilty at reaching for anything else. Perhaps you leave, and lose family and friends, but you feel guilty about going to find new friends and family...often because you're so used to the idea of not associating with "worldly" people. This is something you really need to work through, by forcing yourself to interact. Staying alone right now is the worst thing you can do, because it will further your depression.

Here are some suggestions of things that I found very helpul:
1) Therapy...just having someone you can spill your guts to, and even curse at if you need to, who you're not afraid of losing is immensely valuable
2) Volunteer...go feed the homeless, or visit people in rest homes...this really helps you connect with other people
3) Take classes....do the first thing that pops into your head that interests you, even if it seems like a crazy idea! If money is an issue, most communities and bookstores have free classes and workshops.

Just don't be afraid to get involved! It will be difficult at first, but you CAN get through it!

Gwendolyn

35

Beggin for help

by DIAMOND in

ladies and gentlemen of the jury listen to my story then make a wise and fair decision in my case.. i'm a 42 year old male.

been in the truth for 32 years.

married to a witness.

Gwendolyn

You are in a tough place! I understand your situation from personal experience, and from seeing others go through it.

I must say I don't agree with some of the advice on here...about the importance of convincing your wife and family that the JWs are wrong. I am a firm believer in individual choice. I think the best would be to sit down and discuss your feelings with your wife without ATTACKING something that she holds very dear, that never goes over well. Explain that at this time, you feel you'd like to step back from the JWs and work on your own personal spirituality, or something like that...whatever it is you want to do. But also, make it very clear that you support HER decision to do whatever she wants...if she wants to remain a witness, you totally support her decision even if you don't think it's the right thing for you.

I think if you approach it this way, she won't feel so threatened, and when she sees how much you respect HER choices, she will likely respond in kind to your choices. Not that it will be easy!

Too often, people that leave the JWs turn around and do the same thing to those who are still JWs that THEY didn't like (you know, they didn't like getting hit over the head with the watchtower, but now they hit people over the head with COC and websites...it's the same thing!)

People have to make their own decisions, and will come to their own "truth" in their own time...there's no forcing it. And your wife's "truth" may never agree with yours...so what if you love each other!

I know that it is hard to restrain yourself from talking about something you feel so strongly about...when we decide to leave there is often a lot of anger, hurt, and frustration tied in with that decision...and we want to be able to get it out! Unfortunately, often we spew it on those closest to us who HAVEN'T made the same decision....and they feel attacked. If you need to spew, I really encourage you to go talk to a counselor. It can be really helpfull just to have someone to talk to about it where talking about it doesn't jeopardize your relationship.

Hope this helps
Gwendolyn

19

Sunday's Radio Show with the Dub's

by Unclepenn1 in

jw
friends

well, we had our radio show on sunday with the jehovah's witnesses and i don't think it went all that well, namely because it turned into a game of rhetoric.

(if you listened, i would love to hear your thoughts).. .

2 tim 2 :14 says- keep reminding them of these things.

Gwendolyn

Unclepenn;

There are several points which you are missing:

1) Greg never said that “true” was an inaccurate translation of the word alethinos. Therefore, demonstrating that you can look up 12 bible translations that use the word “true” proves nothing. He acknowledged that alethinos means “true” but was asking the question “IN WHAT SENSE TRUE?” This necessitates clarifying the meaning of the Greek word by going to a GREEK lexicon, and/or comparing it to other examples in the bible of its usage which clarify what the meaning is in this context. (For examples, see accuracy’s post).

2) You asked Alf if he reads the bible in English, and if so how does he know he is not just reading a bunch of 21st century words? Of course, it is not practical for the average Bible reader to look up every word in the Bible, locate the original Greek, and examine the meaning using a Greek lexicon. Nor is it necessary. HOWEVER, when passages or words are encountered that raise questions that may not be explicitly clear, or one simply wants a deeper understanding, then you go to the original language. Obviously in this case, it was necessary because Clay was contending that the phrase “only true” in John 17:3 meant that there are no other gods IN EXISTENCE besides Jehovah (actually the verse doesn’t even say “Jehovah”, but simply says “you” referring (see verse 1) to the Father). Clay was implying a meaning for false of “absolutely doesn’t exist” which necessitated a clarifying of terms. He did not seem to understand the qualitative usage of the term which was illuminated by Greg’s illustration of the Mona Lisa. Yes, there is the genuine Mona Lisa, and there are COUNTERFEITS (BTW ingenuine isn’t a word, check it out in your beloved Websters). The counterfeits have all the qualities and attributes of the Mona Lisa, and theoretically could be exactly like the Mona Lisa down to the brush-stroke and artist (assuming Da Vinci made copies). However they are not the “only true Mona Lisa” in that they are not the FIRST Mona Lisa ever painted, therefore they do not have the value of the original, nor should they be put on display in the museum as the original. Just as you would not want to put any other god (no matter who or what it is) in the place reserved for Jehovah. This does not seem very complicated at all.

3) You accuse Greg of wasting time with semanitcs. I hardly see how the wasting of time on the show was his fault. Clay was the host, and started out the show by expressing what he thought to be Greg’s position. Greg obviously needed to clarify so that his position was not misstated. As a host, Clay would have done better to just ask Greg to state his position in the first place, rather than setting up a situation that required clarification. Also, when it became obvious (I would say at least sometime before the second break) that Clay and Greg had differing positions about the meaning of the term alethinos in John 17:3, and that neither of them was likely to change their position, a good host would have acknowledged the difference and moved on to another subject. Greg answered Clay’s questions, but Clay did not answer Greg’s (even though he promised he would at some point in the discussion), therefore the pace and direction of the show became a function of where Clay led it (or stalled it, as the case may be).

4) It was obvious that Clay was unprepared for who his guest would be. Unclepenn needs to take responsibility for setting up the host of the show in a situation where he didn’t know who was coming, and thus didn’t know what the caliber of the discussion would be. Also, I find it rather arrogant that the host assumed that since a witness was coming he didn’t need to prepare...obvious from how he reacted when he found out who was sitting in front of him. At the very least, I hope that you have learned to research your guests more thoroughly and prepare your host for future shows...and avoid “radio death”.

Gwen