i saw one up close and personal because the jw annointed sister who was studying with me, told me that if i looked up every scripture in her (illegally gotten before the school started) pioneer school book and cut it out of old green nwts and pasted them in the margins, it would make her a stronger pioneer and jehovah would reward me.
and in the process i would learn where things were in the bible.. gosh what an incredible honor i was blessed with!
you know i did it..i didnt know a damn thing.
"
winstonchurchill,
If you were really devious,"
Sir82, As i mentioned in a previous post, I kept some Flock books when I stepped down as a CO, and have them at home (like 5 or 6). I guess that make sme potentially devious.
In any case, that book is on the internet, so no big deal. Only 'they' think it's secret
i saw one up close and personal because the jw annointed sister who was studying with me, told me that if i looked up every scripture in her (illegally gotten before the school started) pioneer school book and cut it out of old green nwts and pasted them in the margins, it would make her a stronger pioneer and jehovah would reward me.
and in the process i would learn where things were in the bible.. gosh what an incredible honor i was blessed with!
you know i did it..i didnt know a damn thing.
"Now when an elder steps down or is removed, then they demand the elder manual back immediately."
That's right. 'Turning in the book' has become symbolic of stepping down as an elder. If removed, they demand it on the spot.
That's why I carry mine in my briefcase all the time, and I have reached for it a couple of times offering to resign if they keep giving me a hard time. Last time I did it it was to the CO, which really made him take a dump; he wasn't expecting it!
The "Pioneer" book ha snot made it's way to the internet simply beacuse is 200+ pages Our Kingdom Ministry... really boring!
i have been asked about a situation in which a former witnesses ladies now ex-husband has been caught exposing himself, and this has gone on for at least 15 years.
he has also exposed himself to some close family members.
the question relates to the wt explaination of "porniea".
They just don't take it very seriously, and they do not see it as grounds for divorce.
Because as per WTS rules it is not. I'm not saying I agree; but that's how it is.
They diffinately do not see it as harming anyone, even if he is exposing himself to young children.
Elders are supposed to defend justice and righteousness... Most don't. They can't distinguish what's just and fair, as they are too worried about sticking to the letter of the rules. Take it from me (I'm an elder, and I serve among elders): MOST DON'T CARE about anything other that their personal good standing in front of the CO and the WTS. So they don't like geting involved in these 'weird' cases (they like the easy ones).
They also told his wife that she had no grounds for divorce and that if she was a better wife he would probably stop doing that.
NO SUPRISE there: Way to frequent diregard for real victim feelings.
i have been asked about a situation in which a former witnesses ladies now ex-husband has been caught exposing himself, and this has gone on for at least 15 years.
he has also exposed himself to some close family members.
the question relates to the wt explaination of "porniea".
Elder here!
as per WTS, Porneia = imporper use of (at least) one person's genitalia. There has to be another person (or an animal) involved. There has to be manipulation (not just casual touch). By 'improper' they mean someone who is not you spouse; tehrefore, Porneia can only hapen out of the wedlock.
Masturbation: Not Porneia (no other person)
Oral/Anal/hand-job,etc.: Porneia
Exposing: Not porneia
While this seems pretty straight and logic, it leaves big gaps and inconsitencies. For example a regular guy can be df'd for fooling with his fiancee's privates, while the perv exposing himself to kids gets to walk.
Any 'legal' system that leaves room for uneven punishments is conceptually flawed.
So as per this policy, nope, she's not free to remarry. Again, Why does she care? She should do what OnTheWayOut suggested.
i saw one up close and personal because the jw annointed sister who was studying with me, told me that if i looked up every scripture in her (illegally gotten before the school started) pioneer school book and cut it out of old green nwts and pasted them in the margins, it would make her a stronger pioneer and jehovah would reward me.
and in the process i would learn where things were in the bible.. gosh what an incredible honor i was blessed with!
you know i did it..i didnt know a damn thing.
I have it. BTW, I have a few. See, I was a CO and served as instructor like for 10 schools; and never returned some leftover books (Same with some KS91 that I kept).
This 'SECRET' stuff is crap pulled by those who want to feel empowered and have something to show off, like they are part of a special group. Since I HATE those people so much, thats why I would always fight the 'seceret book' myth. I even have a letter (back form my CO days) where WTS clarified this.
The OFFICIAL position is that the Pioneer School Book is not secret. I always made a point at the very beggining of each school, stressing that the book was not secret. it was intended for Pioneers, but that didn't mean it was secret. They were encouraged to share it and even study some lessons with others (e.g. someone you were encouraging to become a pioneer).
yes my father has passed on sunday.... all my family brothers, sister, in-laws are jws .
it is occasions like this that.
make me see why i and countless others are just faders .. not taking that bold step of disassociation .
"For there is hope for a tree,
When it is cut down, that it will sprout again,
And its shoots will not fail.
“Though its roots grow old in the ground
And its stump dies in the dry soil,
At the scent of water it will flourish
And put forth sprigs like a plant"
From the book of Job.
My sympathy is with you, your family and your feelings. The influence of a Father is everlasting as MY father showed me, and as I try with my little ones.
.
just wondering....... are there certain teachings / beliefs they don't tell a person who is studying....until after they're baptized?.
.
It's not only about what you are not told; it's mainly about you being able to see the implications. When you get batpized at 12, or 16, you are not able to see the implications of what you're doing, the comitment you are making.
And, YES, there are a lot of thing you are not told, as some of you have listed here.
But WORSE is the fact that even if they did tell you all (which they don't) they RESERVE THE RIGHT to CHANGE IT AT ANY TIME and you have to take it or face consequences.
That is ABSURD by any measure. That's signing a contract in whichthe other party says, I can chenge the terms at any time and you don't have a say, and can't walk out of the deal.
So maybe you were baptized knowing that such and such was true, and you believed it, and one day out of the blue THEY CHANGE it, and you cannot say a word. You have to swallow it or be DF'd.
did you have enough of boasting, and decided to walk out?.
that's what happened to me during this week's bs about how to "treat the disfellowshipped"?.
i just picked up my bag and stormed out...... will i get called into the back room?.
Thanks, Doubting Bro. I've heard those rumors, but know nothing beyond that. I do think changes are on their way; CO's arrangement has become highly unproductive, it's not cost-effective, and causes more problems that it's worth to WTS. I see a tendency to get rid of paperwork and administrative decisions. A BIG one to me is the recent change by which Reg Pionners are to be named by local elders.
That being said, WTS is famous for being extremely slow for changes (i.e. elimination of Book study, two magazines per month, elimination of Bible study reporting were Henschel-era ideas that we debated some 15 years ago, and they were iplemented just recently).
StAnn: You may (or may not) know that the book currently being studied has an "appendix" covering such 'important' topics as "How to treat a DF'd", "When is it ok to get a divorce", "Masturbation" (How would they let that go?), and the very VITAL and IMPORTANT TOPIC of "When should a sister cover her head". So in a few weeks there will be a book study devoted to that theme.
After some steps on the right direction I see WTS going back to stupid issues like those and imposing rules on things that are none of their business. Apparently Jaracz&Losche are on a rampage!
i wanted to make just a thread for this statement of mind control as it was very blatant .
in the may 15th witness only wt under the article "husbands, imitate christ's love !
" it states, " if you are a christian husband, remember that your wife is also your christian sister.
Marriage is a vow, and Baptism is a vow... Why does the WTS feel entitled to tell ME or MY WIFE or anybody what comes first?
Life is full of choices... Carrer, Spouse, Family, Kids, Marriage, Divorce, You name it! It's YOUR call, it's YOUR LIFE. If someone at some point feels that religious afilliation comes first, good for him (her)! With God it is FREEDOM OF CHOICE since day one (Adam & Eve, anyone?)
I for one, will pick my kids over ANYTHING. They come first, second and third. I'm a JW, a serving elder, was a CO, but the minute ANYTHING interferes with my kids well being, it's over.
Jesus did say he who chooses family over me...yada, yada. BUT THAT WAS JESUS talking not some bunch of old farts in a Brooklyn Office.
did you have enough of boasting, and decided to walk out?.
that's what happened to me during this week's bs about how to "treat the disfellowshipped"?.
i just picked up my bag and stormed out...... will i get called into the back room?.
"BTW, you don't know much about private reproof. Only df'ing offenses come under reproof, private or public."
Blondie seems to know a lot. I like that. I've always liked sisters that know as much or more than elders. To me it shows how hollow and superficial qualifications for elders can be. And how unfair the treatment to women is within JW's.They do all the work, and get treated as third class people.
I'm an elder (ex-CO, BTW) and I walk off meetings all the time. Just like last night with 'how to treat df'd".Same for SM, i Just go to restroom, walk the parking lot with my 3 years old, etc. I always find a reason and a way of skipping the torture of Book Study and SM. For The Watchtower I stay mainly because i enjoy some of the stupid comments made by stupid people so full of themselves.
And wait for next 'Appendix' Book study about women having to cover their heads... That is SO DEMEANING, that I can't believe it's taken seriously!
Newbie here (long time lurker)
WC
