trebor

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Posts by trebor

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  29

  Steve Hassan Interviews XJW elder, Roberto di Stefano, at ICSA Conference in Italy

  by AndersonsInfo in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  trieste, italy - icsa conference - july 6, 2013. both roberto di stefano and steve hassan were speakers at the conference.

  you can see the hassan interview on his website.

  here's the link:http://freedomofmind.com/media/video.php?id=59.

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  trebor

  Well done...Thank you for sharing the link, Barbara.
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  39

  Why are the moms so attached to religion?

  by ILoveTTATT in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  please don't take this the wrong way, i would love it for women to comment on this thread because i just can't understand something!!.

  here's the pattern i see:.

  mostly guys in here.. if the guys are married, their wives usually stay a jw, or it takes 3 times as much time to convince a woman to leave than a man.. if the guys have a jw father, the father is open-minded and can be more easily persuaded to leave.

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  trebor

  In general, if you ever been in a serious relationship with a woman, there is the understanding there are much stronger emotions tied to even the most instinctual aspects of the relationship (aka sex) than for a man. For example, in the most blatant of terms, many men can just have sex without there being this strong emotional connection or feeling behind it. Many women, on the other hand, most of the time, like to have and feel the love, the emotional, the compassion, and passion behind the love-making.

  You have to consider being a part of the organization of Jehovah's Witnesses as being in an extremely unhealthy and very damaging relationship. Ever see a talk show and wonder why (usually) a woman will stay in an abusive relationship typically more so than a man? It has nothing to do with logic or intelligence, rather women (in general) are in touch with their emotions better and the ties that bind them are stronger.

  Enter what the Watchtower Society controls and/or manipulates - The BITE model:

  Behavior
  Information
  Thought
  Emotional

  While there is an emotional section specifically designated, a person's behavior is strongly tied to their emotional state as well as information and your thoughts can be of an emotional nature. Having the Watchtower control and manipulate emotions the way it does, many men may be able to just disregard or tuck away much of the emotional grief or loss associated with the Society being wrong, for women, for many of them, you're taking about never seeing family, friends, presently and the future "promise" of the Watchtower's interpretation of a paradise on earth with the living and dead loved ones again - The emotional grief may be just too much as the emotional investment was much greater for them; not that men don't have the same losses or feelings - Just that it is stronger, deeper, and more encompassing for women in many cases.

  Again, in general, the emotional connection and bondage is much stronger for a woman - As would be the heartache and loss on an emotional level. Ever heard of someone dying of a broken heart? It happens.

  Not to forget also the organization 'cripples' women like they should be viewed in a 1950's sitcom. They do not give the illusion or feeling of power to women as they do to men (This ironically enough helps in a small way to leave the Society). They condition women to believe you need to look to their leaders. Even at the bottom of the barrel, men are "at least" the head of a woman in any adult relationship and interaction (Including preaching door to door, prayer, and decision making). All those subtle and not-so subtly items, consciously and subconsciously, bubble to the surface when you’re going to make, or think about making, a life altering change as leaving the Watchtower.

  There are exceptions for both genders and rules are broken constantly, but in general, overall, I believe the above to be the causes of the difference you (and I) have seen and experienced.
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  32

  WATCHTOWER CD ROM to be TERMINATED

  by The Searcher in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  imho!!!.

  reasons?

  just have a look at one or two of my very many favorites from the wt library.

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  trebor

  Absolutely, agreed with you LongHairGal on not using "the truth" label. I also do not refer to the members as brothers or sisters. Ditto on calling anything "worldly". Using their terminology just reinforces the control and psychological ties they place on individuals.

  brothers and/or sisters = members

  "the truth" = the organization('s teachings); The Watchtower Society('s teachings)

  worldly = not of or from the Watchtower Society('s approval).

  Those are three of the near immediate changes I made after leaving the Watchtower's religion. I made an effort to stop using the Watchtower Society's loaded language to help release the bonds of their control.
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  165

  Board of bitterness

  by 1009 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i always was a critical jw, now df and agnost.

  but still this religion fascinates me.

  in my eyes most jw are very sincere, but dumb sheep.. this board is filled with ex-jw.

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  trebor

  1009,

  When an organization has promoted the thoughts and/or actions to shun, hate, and kill members who leave, what kind of reaction do you think that would evoke?

  http://savedfromthewatchtower.blogspot.com/2009/05/shun-hate-kill.html
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  32

  WATCHTOWER CD ROM to be TERMINATED

  by The Searcher in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  imho!!!.

  reasons?

  just have a look at one or two of my very many favorites from the wt library.

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  trebor

  A Jehovah's Witness may dispute the quote and the Watchtower Society provided more information in German, but in English, the entire quote appears like this:

  “Our coming to know "the truth" - the entire body of
  Christian teachings that has become part of the
  Bible - and adhering to it are essential for our
  salvation”.

  They put quotes around "the truth" as all Jehovah's Witnesses know (consciously or subconsciously) refers to the organization, its interpretations and especially its primary indoctrination and "new light" tool the Watchtower.

  If the intent, when originally presenting the phrase -the truth- was just to refer to the information in the Bible, the sentence at best could have been phrased better, at the very least there should not be quotes around "the truth". By doing that, the writer(s) knew exactly what they were doing, implying, and how that statement should be taken. "The truth" - in quotes like that, again refers to the organization and its teachings.

  If any Jehovah's Witness is denying that phrasing, intent, and reference to "the truth" they're just being disingenuous and/or experiencing cognitive dissonance.

  When you leave the Watchtower organization, its teachings, and/or interpretations, Jehovah's Witnesses say you have left "the truth".
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  32

  Stuff You Would Lose If You Went Back

  by Nosferatu in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  so we know all the things the wts prevents us from doing, but that's much, much different than the stuff we've grown accustomed to.. for those who have been out for a number of years, what kind of things would end up being abandoned if you suddenly started going back to the kingdom hall?

  you know, stuff that you now do on the nights you used to attend meetings, the things you own, the things you wear, etc..

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  trebor

  Honesty.
  Dignity.
  Integrity.
  Common-Sense.
  Logical Thinking.
  Critical Thinking.
  Self-Respect.
  Time.
  Energy.
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  22

  JW family trying to compensate for us being "spiritually weak" through increased activity

  by cedars in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hi folks.

  one of the things that has been most frustrating for my wife and i since beginning our fade as been the way certain family members have responded by ramping up their own involvement in the organization seemingly in a bizarre attempt to compensate for our lack of activity.. close relatives who were once doing precious little study and weren't going out of their way to attend meetings or go on the ministry are now studying every morning and busting a gut to attend "theocratic" arrangements.. it makes no sense to me, because salvation is supposed to be based on the beliefs and actions of each individual, not on those of his or her loved ones.

  just what is the logic by which they think they can make things better by doing more themselves?.

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  trebor

  Cedars,
  My siblings started doing the same thing after I disassociated myself from the Watchtower. I think it is in part due to the explanation you offered up as well as what Julia mentioned.

  I was seen as always the 'strong one' in the organization. Studied, prepared well, hardly missed meetings, regular in field service, auxiliary pioneered when I could, gave several public talks and conducted the book study numerous times. I worked the magazine and literature counters, mics, sound booth, and my last major assignment before leaving the Watchtower was Accounts servant.

  Hindsight is 20/20, but I still can't believe I was okay with friends and family members being shunned. Then again, I understand the Watchtower cult-like tactics and brainwashing I was under. Regardless, it does boggle the mind though; including family ramping up their activity in the organization, which I think runs in harmony with the level of cognitive dissonance that was turned up with my departure.
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  28

  My Jehovah's Witness broke up with me :(

  by jws in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  a few months ago, the jws came knocking on my door (see thread).. this discussion continued and the next time she brought a man along with her.

  i told them that i'd study with them if they could prove to me god exists and the bible was his book.

  for our next visit, only the man showed up.

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  trebor

  Can you give me more indoor links to the evidence that the WTBTS sent representatives to these meetings at the UN?

  http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/scandals/180234/1/WTS-attends-as-a-NGO-to-OSCE-in-July-4-branches-present

  http://masonemerson.freeyellow.com/christianwitnessescom/id187.html
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  29

  Americans in Prison

  by usualusername in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  at the moment the usa has around 2 million people in prison.. along with that you have some crazy prison sentences.. .

  thug shot at police 19 times.

  hit an officer on shoulder.. 122 years.. .

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  trebor

  Trebor would you murder someone?

  My first response is "no". Then, as I've come to realize in life, never say definitely "no" to many things. You know, like asking me 10 years ago if I ever would "leave Jehovah's Witnesses".

  Would you eat the body (parts/insides) of other human beings? Most would say no, even those prior to being trapped in an iced-over mountain with no other way to survive. Some may be surprised what a person, or what they, would or could do.

  Some may be almost just as surprised what a parent would do if someone hurt their child; especially if that child was kidnapped, and let's be honest here, more than likely sexually molested by this "person".

  I'm not saying in hindsight or even logically it is the right thing to do. What I am saying is with the circumstances provided, I can more than understand and relate to the man doing what he did and not serving jail time for doing so. I would also be lying to say I wouldn't react in a similar way if it were my child.
• 
  29

  Americans in Prison

  by usualusername in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  at the moment the usa has around 2 million people in prison.. along with that you have some crazy prison sentences.. .

  thug shot at police 19 times.

  hit an officer on shoulder.. 122 years.. .

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  trebor

  The dad killed (or murdered) a man accused of a crime who unquestionably abducted his son, and believed to have sexually abused him.
  Would you want him as a neighbour?

  usualusername, I fixed that for you.

  My answer to that question is yes.

  If it were my son, he would have been lucky to have even lived long enough to be flown from California.