i don't know if anybody else has mentioned this, but i'm currently at a dc in sweden, and this morning, during the symposium on different kinds of service, it was mentioned that 40% of baptisms are the result of informal witnessing.
if you add the number of baptisms of children of jw parents to this, how many are left that are baptized as a result of the door-to-door work?
doesn't sound very effective at all....
I brought someone in from D2D (to my regret).
I can see a number of benefits to the Washtowel society:
1 JWs buy lots of mags which they pay for up front (or used to when I was enslaved);
2 It increases the pressure on individuals - it can be stressful and the push-back can be used to justify themselves - the old persecution thing;
3 it keeps people busy, busy people have less time to think for themselves.
don't know whether anyone has made prior reference to this treatise by doug mason -- if so, i most have missed it; but it's an important document and "keeper" for anyone interested in throughly acquainting themselves with the logical and scriptural fallacies, not to mention the underlying intellectual dishonesty of this "gb = fds" change: http://www.jwstudies.com/the_truth_changes.pdf.
I think he needs to get out more.
the scoop of humanity at one khall, the anointed ones" were a mixed group.. one bro, h. had been in for eons.
he was df for adultery, back in the day when they would announce your sin openly from the platform to everyone.
he just kept on coming and partaking until he was reinstated.
What a bonkers religion this is.
so, unexpectedly, the final talk was announced today and to my surprise and evil glee, they announced gerrit loesch as the speaker!
first off, at the beginning of his talk, he interrupted himself in the middle of his sentence to scold the microphone brother to lower my mike it's right in my face.. anyway, it was the talk on inspired truth, vs. inspired falsehoods.
he went through 6 expressions inspired by the demons.
Very interesting - you'd have thought some time considering the victims of abuse might be appropriate.Jeesh
ok so if the bible is nothing more then a pagan religious book, then how do all of you that think this, think we got here?
and please don't tell me you believe in evolution, because even the experts are finding major flaws in that theory.
so what is your opinion??
It depends what you mean by crap. The bible isn't a single book with one author, it's composed of many books. Some of the content is doubtless historically accurate, some is myth, some of it is political propaganda, some of it religious control, and some is bonkers. Trying to treat it is as a single, coherent message from 'god' doesn't seem very sensible to me.
As for evolution, what is the objection to it? Even a cursory view of the evidence to support it shows it holds water and cannot be dismissed.
I am curious to know what the failings in the understanding of the evolutionary process are. I am sure there may be some elements of it that are not fully evidenced, but fitting the picture together and acknowledging any gaps just seems honest to me.
If the need to reject evolution is because it conflicts with the bible then the argument is already lost as far as I can see.
I think it's more likely that bananas evolved into chimps rather than a straight mix of DNA. I don't think they are sexually compatible. Or that bananas and chimps shared a common ancestor :)
i have seen debates and shizzle about god or not god etc etc.. i was even confronted by an aggressive and trheatening muslim in the street, who was angry that i wanted proof that god existed.
he ranted on a load of old b0110cks about 'hell' and stuff.
finally he yelled at me: 'do you want god to write your name in the sky?
I can't see the objection to iceltic's question. Even if the gospel accounts were written by the people claimed, and I understand there is some doubt about this, it is simply their testimony. Testimony is only as good as the credibility of the witness. For the New Testament:
1 can we even be sure who wrote the testimony and when?
2 could the writers have any motives for lying?
3 could they be mistaken? - some of the testimony is itself hearsay
4 the Jesus character didn't seem to have any objections to proving himself to genuine sceptics eg Thomas. Why would he now?
The answers given so far to iceltic look like evasions to me.
I do not see how anyone can put such faith in a document about which there seems to much uncertainty. Whilst a person is free to believe what they want, convincing others is a different thing. As far as the bible's testimony about itself is concerned: "we'll they would say that wouldn't they?". It's like accepting a tobacco company's marketing about its own product as the undiluted truth.
Before using the bible as proof of God, one must first establish that the Bible is what it claims to be.
in just the several months i've been lurking here, i have benefited from many of the posters comments and viewpoints.
this is truly a special place for the unique community that has been created here.. after years of holding off my exit from the org (that may be another post) i recently became officially out (by letter of da), but it was a very difficult process as many of you know.
thankfully, i now have my wife (was also a witness) onboard and we support each other.
Love the term J-bot lol
welcome
this is the first of three "dramas" this dc, and i have to say, it was one of the weirdest dramas ever.
i won't go through all the details.
maybe someone else wants to throw in their 2c.. it starts out with two men standing on the "beach" talking, but it took me awhile to figure out what in the hell was going on.
Sorry could only manage 1:20 then I fwowed up.
the only reason i am posting this is because i know many of you are going or will be going through something similar and wonder if it is worth it.
i personally feel that it is worth it regardless of what i lose.
my wife is backing me and i have my children.
I guess your mum really believes all the WTS guff. She has a massive investment in it and maybe in some ways she sees your rejection of it as an attack on her as well as 'Jehovah'. There is probably nothing you can say to persuade her now and in fairness if she abandoned her faith, there is nothing to replace it with. It's all downside for her. I suspect she is genuinely concerned for your future but you know it's a crock.
Good advice above, which I think you probably already know. Be kind, don't react, get on with our life and treat it as background noise. Engaging in debate will drain your own energies with no prospect of benefit to any party it seems to me.
You're doing the right thing for your own family, just as she thinks she is for hers. You'll be better off out of it.
i have always found the hubble deep field photograph, apparently hubbles most important photograph, very interesting.. for those of you who don't know, it's a long exposure or series of long exposures taken over many months of an otherwise completely empty and black region of space.. i was reading some info on it from the uk physicist brian cox, and he explains another dimension to it.. when you look at the deep field photograph, you are seeing a true 3d picture.
each galaxy in the picture are vast distances apart.
some relatively near, some almost the entire edge of the galaxy away.
Breathtaking picture. Small point: I think you meant the edge of the Universe in the OP, not the 'entire edge of the galaxy'?
I suppose in a sense it is a 4D picture - 3D plus looking backwards in time :)
I know, I should get out more...
