Posts by Cadellin

24

The impact of Governing Body policy on higher education: read this!

by Terry in

excerpt:.

does your religion affect your income?by mari cockerell, ktxs newsabilene, texas -- the pew forum on religion and public life recently put out the results of a survey on wealth and religion in the united states.. you may be surprised to learn which religious groups in this country have the most and the least wealthy members.an infographic produced by the folks at www.good.is breaks down information gathered by the pew forum on religion and wealth.

it maps out distribution of income for the 14 major religious groups in this country, charting those whose income is less than $30,000 a year all the way up to $100,000+.. what they found is interesting.the religions whose members earn the most money are jews and hindus.

Cadellin

It would be more useful if the survey differentiated b/w Hindus that emmigrated and those born in the US. Those that come to this country are often wealthier to begin with, so that might skew results, even when it comes to 2nd generation kids. As far as LDS, they encourage education--heck, they even have their own University (Brigham Young).

I'm surprised that the college degree rate is as high as it is among JWs, according to that survey. I would have put it at 3-4% for an undergrad degree and around 1% for anything beyond.

38

New light emerging?

by breakfast of champions in

so, just recently ( i believe it was the september 1 wt) there was the thought that only the "incorrigibly wicked" will be destroyed at armageddon.

at the recent visit of the co, several times he brought up the idea that the "great crowd" will be far more people than just the 7m jws on earth today.

all my life i was raised thinking only jws would be the gc, and the other 99.9% of humanity would be fertilizer.

Cadellin

There is no doubt that this is a major contradiction in doctrine. The WT has repeatedly put in print their explanation of Ezekiel's vision of the man with the secretary's inkhorn that marked on the forehead those sighing and groaning over the detestable things being done. The mark on the forehead indicating those who would be spared destruction corresponds to modern day baptism into Jehovah's organization. They have stated this unequivocally on more than one occasion, and I'm sure someone (Blondie?) who has easier access to the WT CD could pull up a multitude of citations fairly quickly.

So, if you need the mark on the forehead--supposedly a mark of identity, that everyone can see--to survive (and in Ezekiel's vision, NO ONE survived w/o it) aka public baptism--any supposed "reading of hearts" is meaningless.

322

WT Nov. 1, 2011 (public) - When Was Ancient Jerusalem Destroyed - Part 2

by AnnOMaly in

out now.. yes, yes, yessssss!

on p. 26-27 they talk about how the lunar positions on vat 4956 fit 588/7 bce!!!.

"clearly, much of the astronomical data in vat 4956 fits the year 588 b.c.e.

Cadellin

I was speaking to a friend high up in the WTBTS who was talking to a Brooklyn Bethelite about the spurious experience in a Watchtower earlier this year (an Ethiopian schoolgirl who was allegedly offered a 2000 euro a month job but turned it down to serve Jehovah.) The Bethelite admitted that after it went to press they realised that the experience was a load of rubbish but once it was in the magazine they could do nothing about it & they couldn't amend it & to print any kind of correction in a subsequent magazine would "stumble the brothers".

Dozy, have you posted about this before? How did they find out it was rubbish? Do you have any more info? (Sorry, I'm not trying to hijack the thread).,,

24

Stressful Session with Uber-Zealous Parents--The Mermaid needs a hug!

by Cadellin in

okay, for those of you who don't know, i was raised jw by really great though uber-zealous parents.

i'm now an adult and have been inactive for about two years due a bunch of reasons, the primary one (or at least the one that got the ball rolling) being the pathological intellectual dishonesty of the wt in how it handles secular quotes and citations.

anyway, my parents are aware of all that and have left the issue alone for about the last year.

Cadellin

What something means to me and what it means to a JW are two very different things.

Franklin: Yes, this became clearer the longer I talked to them. They prioritize information differently. At one point, after I had pointed out the dishonest quote used in the CReation brochure, my father said, "Yes, but it still points to the truth about creation!" That response underscored for me the difference b/w using ideology to shape your world view vs. using facts. Idealogy in the JW world takes precedence--the Bible is the a priori inspired Word of God--and therefore material, measurable phenomenon (facts, we could say) are valuable only to the extent they serve such ideology. Beyond that they have no purpose or, what's worse, are outrightly denied as false and from Satan. The Truth is the ultimate and only truth and therefore, any use of measurable facts to support that truth--or that can be made to look like it supports that truth--is acceptable because Truth is being promoted. Chilling, really.

Of course, we all, JW or not, use ideology to shape our views. But when a person is under the thrall of a cult, it's just more pronounced, more entrenched and inflexible, more resistant to examination.

Scully, your point aligns with the foregoing as well. Of course they wouldn't suggest that! That's because the Catholic Church doesn't have the Truth. And JWs do, silly!

Mickey Mouse: I feel for you right back--be aware that such a response will be opening a potentially very stressful and painful conversation, depending on how close you and she are. How are you going to tell her?

24

Stressful Session with Uber-Zealous Parents--The Mermaid needs a hug!

by Cadellin in

okay, for those of you who don't know, i was raised jw by really great though uber-zealous parents.

i'm now an adult and have been inactive for about two years due a bunch of reasons, the primary one (or at least the one that got the ball rolling) being the pathological intellectual dishonesty of the wt in how it handles secular quotes and citations.

anyway, my parents are aware of all that and have left the issue alone for about the last year.

Cadellin

THanks everybody! I so appreciate your comments. It's a new day and I"m feeling way better. Scully, yeah, the reasoning is just crazy. The scary part is that on other non-WT subjects, my dad is so friggin' smart!! And when we get onto the WT, you can just see the cult mentality take over. It's like Invasion of the Body Snatchers.

JRK: Well, I guess its not really a "story." My elder husband swings b/w being understanding and supportive to lapsing into cult-think (or non-think) like my father. One interesting moment came about a year after I'd become inactive. I was still going to Tues. night meetings. Near the end of the meeting, my husband had been up and about, like most elders are during meetings, and he came back to his seat and whispered in my ear, "As soon as the prayer ends, stand up and leave immediately." He wasn't joking either.

"Why?" I asked.

"The brothers want to talk to you. If one of them stops you before you get out the door, just be polite and tell them that they need to talk to me as head of the house. Don't worry." He was dead serious.

Of course, I BOLTED for the door as everyone was saying "Amen." My husband came out to the car about ten minutes later. He told me he'd talked to the other elders and said that he would prefer to handle the situation himself. I've never had any problems or questions from anyone since then. It's AWESOME. THat's why I say my fade has been easier than so many other folks. Who knew the stupid headship rule would actually come to my aid someday????

And though I get frustrated with my husband for his refusal to do any critical thinking when it comes to the WT, we have managed to negotiate a truce and keep our marriage afloat. For now, anyway.

((((((((((((((((( EVERYBODY ON THIS THREAD )))))))))))))))))

51

Suggestions for finally talking to my parents about my doubts?

by stillstuckcruz in

i'll give my story again:.

i was raised a believing witness.

i had a normal life and very loving parents who would do anything for me and my brother(who is 21).

Cadellin

Hey, stillstuck--that's great news! I read your story with interest b/c our situations are very similar except I'm about 20 years older than you. I recently went through a grueling session w/my own parents who are uber-zealous and I have to say, you are getting excellent advice from folks in this thread.

Anyway, if your brother reads CoC, then it will be game over for him, if he's got half your brains. I think it's one of the most--if not THE MOST--power ful books written about the organization.

Please keep us posted.

322

WT Nov. 1, 2011 (public) - When Was Ancient Jerusalem Destroyed - Part 2

by AnnOMaly in

out now.. yes, yes, yessssss!

on p. 26-27 they talk about how the lunar positions on vat 4956 fit 588/7 bce!!!.

"clearly, much of the astronomical data in vat 4956 fits the year 588 b.c.e.

Cadellin

Welcome, Muzikman! Thank you for contacting Sack; yes, please post his response and your email to him, as well, if at all possible. That would be really useful. Actually, I'm just as interested in the WT's continuing misuse of other people's words and research as I am about the chronology. Okay, that's not true--I'm more interested!! I find it fascinating in a horrible way that they (the writer/writers) either don't understand that they're mising those words or they don't care.

13

Rolf Furuli

by inbetween in

my experience with jw so far taught me, that among them are all kind of personalities, with their particular reason for joining or staying in a religion (cult) like jw.. you find those with mental problems, those born in, who dont know any better, those with serious problems handling life (drug, alcohol, porn addic, who need strict rules to function).. but there are also quit normal people, who manage their life failry good, they often just accept anything of the org on a superficial basis, without giving too much thought, and going more or less through the motions.. then there are those, who really are deep thinkers, often with higher education.

besides their belief they take interest in things like quantum theories, history, even philosophy to a point etc..... however, they do not use their sharpe mind when it comes to examining their own religion.

i can in the meantime even understand this, because mostly they have emotional reasons as well to be a jw, and anything contradicting they put under "cognitive dissonance", and just dont think about it.. however, what puzzles me most, is when some of them, being exposed to apostate ideas, still use all their ability and skills to defend clearly ridiculous positions.. personally i also like to scrutinize things, i tried the same with some doctrine, particularly blood teachings, and could not find a solution, thinking it was my lack of insight.

Cadellin

Highly intelligent people are actually better than others of less intelligence at deceiving themselves. They are more skilled at building complex and convincing (to them) arguments as to why what is clearly a ridiculous scenario is believable. When you couple that ability with time and emotional investment in that scenario, you get a very potent, tenacious mind set. My father is a great example of this. Although not well-educated--formally, that is--he is one of the most well-read and intelligent people I know. He's in his late 70's and has a memory that honestly puts mine to shame. His reading comprehension rivals that of folks with post graduate degrees. Yet he is a "company man" when it comes to the WT, lock stock and barrel. He can defend anything that they do and will do so, right to the death.

24

Stressful Session with Uber-Zealous Parents--The Mermaid needs a hug!

by Cadellin in

okay, for those of you who don't know, i was raised jw by really great though uber-zealous parents.

i'm now an adult and have been inactive for about two years due a bunch of reasons, the primary one (or at least the one that got the ball rolling) being the pathological intellectual dishonesty of the wt in how it handles secular quotes and citations.

anyway, my parents are aware of all that and have left the issue alone for about the last year.

Cadellin

You guys are awesome!!! ((((((((((((ALL OF YOU IN ONE GROUP HUG))))))))))))))

Flipper: Brilliant suggestion. Yes, that's what I'll do. I don't want to give them pain, nor do I want to do this to myself again either. Things have been really good b/w us and hopefully they can continue.

Oh, boy, this forum is so incredibly helpful for moments (days) like this. You guys ALL rock!

24

Stressful Session with Uber-Zealous Parents--The Mermaid needs a hug!

by Cadellin in

okay, for those of you who don't know, i was raised jw by really great though uber-zealous parents.

i'm now an adult and have been inactive for about two years due a bunch of reasons, the primary one (or at least the one that got the ball rolling) being the pathological intellectual dishonesty of the wt in how it handles secular quotes and citations.

anyway, my parents are aware of all that and have left the issue alone for about the last year.

Cadellin

Thank you, Free! Just seeing all those parantheses is making me feel better. You know, I never thought about the stupid WT study this week but by gum, I think you've hit the nail on the head. Oh, God!!