Posts by HintOfLime

96

Understanding Revelation (According to the JWs)

by brotherdan in

debator (or any other current jw on the board),.

will you please explain to me the understanding of how the 7 trumpet blasts in revelation were fulfilled?

has it already happened?

HintOfLime

Straying off-topic, I know - but I think Penn and Teller pretty much summed up the value of prophecies like Revelation and Nostradamus's work in their episode about the End of the World:

"This is an Ancient Latin Quatrain that really predicts so much that was to happen" (Penn points to blackboard covered in Latin text)

"'The wheels of the bus go round and round, round and round, round and round...' Now the wheels on the bus represent Napoleons's army - or 'bus'. 1812.. marching all around Europe, circling Prussia, invading Russia, and then '...all through the town...' of Moscow.

'The money on the bus goes clink clink clink...' Here money of course represents gold transported on the bus - Manchester Liverpool Railway - 'clink clink clinking' in the safe transport. The next 'clink clink clink' is clearly the key stolen by Edward Pierce - 1855 - when he masterminded the great train robbery, and listen to this: 'clink clink clink.' The sound of the cell doors closing on Pierce and his two accomplices - predicted right here. The recovered money of course 'clink clink clink'.. back into the bank - a story retold 'all through the town'.... of London England. Right there, clear.

'The driver on the bus says move on back, move on back, move on back'. Ah hah! December 1955, James L. Blake the driver on this bus told Rosa Parks to 'move on back!' Repeating the command: 'Move on back, move on back, move on back' to each of three other black passengers in a row 'all through the town' of Montgomery, Alabama..

'The mommy on the bus says shh shh shh, shh shh shh, shh shh shh.' Here the mommy is Richard Nixon shushing his staff as Watergate threatens his presidency, shushing himself before the secret oval office tape recorders, paying out shush money, and the second mommy down here at the bottom - Rosmary Woods - shushing 17 1/2 minutes of taped conversations...."

His point of course was that you can take ANYTHING - any writing, and 'apply it' to real-world events as "prophecy in hindsight". It is trivial to do, and absolute meaningless. Because you can apply it to ANYTHING, it can mean ANYTHING, so ultimately it means NOTHING.

I'm thinking of a sentence. I've replaced each word (each concept) in the sentence with another word or concept: "The king ate bread on his throne." What was my original sentence?

The correct answer is: "There's no way to know. You didn't provide enough information."

That's what the book of Revelation is. "I have a message for you... but I'm not going to tell you what it is. I'll replace each concept in my message with a 'symbol' - but I won't provide required information as to what each symbol ultimately represents."

To think that a 'wise creator' didn't grasp how utterly useless this sort of 'encoded message' is - or to think he would ever employ such a form of "guesswork communication" is absolutely asinine.

- Lime

PS: Oh, and my sentence was "Colonel Mustard (The King) killed Mr. Body (ate) with the Rope (bread) in the Conservatory (on his throne)."

35

Strangest comment

by drewcoul in

what is the strangest or most wacked-out comment or answer you've ever heard at a wt or book study?.

i remember at the cong.

wt study, we were studying about the jews being led out of egypt by moses.

HintOfLime

LDuh: Damn she's creepy.

- Lime

35

Strangest comment

by drewcoul in

what is the strangest or most wacked-out comment or answer you've ever heard at a wt or book study?.

i remember at the cong.

wt study, we were studying about the jews being led out of egypt by moses.

HintOfLime

Hey, I like this guy. At least he doesn't pray stock, formalized thee and thou prayers.

There were several of these in one of my halls - people who had a 'collection of sayings' they repeated verbatim in every prayer. Occationally they would repeat one word-for-word twice in a single prayer.

The weirdest comment I remember though was by a brother who likenend those who didn't take the magazines to "dog manure that can get stuck on your shoe" (something about not letting one rejection effect the next door or something). He went on and on with it... and the conductor had to interrupt him regarding the 'appropriateness of his illustration'.

- Lime

48

Do You Truly Believe A Certain Politician Or Political Party WILL Bring About Real Change?

by minimus in

jw
friends

soooo many thought obama was the savior and now scores of people are abandoning him and his policies.

the pendulum swings and you hear how we need a republican to bail us out of our mess.. do you really believe a single person or party can make the changes for the country or the world ?

?.

HintOfLime

Taking all this stuff out of the earth is actually MAKING IT LIGHTER and is damaging gravity, tides, rotation, electromagnetic grid lines, etc....

Sorry, but there are so many things scientifically wrong about that bit... Burning oil doesn't destroy matter (it converts it from liquid to gas of equal mass)... The tides are caused by the moon's gravity which isn't changed by burning oil on earth... Earth's rotation?? Grid lines??... What??

Aughhhh!!!

- Lime

44

"We're not here to debate or argue"

by sabastious in

as a jw i was always taught "never to get into debate or argue with householders.".

you know what is interesting about that?.

the message i had when i went to your door was essentially "hello, what ever your current belief is... is wrong.

HintOfLime

Jesus said it himself about those not interested "shake the dust off your feet off them". Jesus felt no need to get into debates or arguments with pharasees he simply gave them his position and they accepted it or rejected it. We follow his example in this.

Of course, online, you don't follow his example at all. You name yourself 'debator' (homeschooled, perhaps?) and seek out debates and arguments.

Typical J-dub. Say one thing, do another.

- Lime

19

Would WT-Fantasy Videos Keep Kids in the Truth?

by compound complex in

jw
friends

if the society put out theocratic warfare videos, it would really help jw youths stick around, imho.

in place of commercial videos that are violent and suggestive, wt-sanctioned videos would supply a viable, healthy alternative.

accordingly, concerned and thoughtful witness parents could participate with their little warriors in theocratic warfare videos as virtual ot prophets wipe out the dread canaanites, zimri and cozbi take love to new heights and the beasts of revelation devour their quarry .... and the parents count their time.. any other thoughts regarding family worship night and related meeting parts?

HintOfLime

Would WT-Fantasy Videos Keep Kids in the Truth?

They already produce fantasy videos - along with fantasy books, magazines, etc.

I imagine bible-accurate video production of the Song of Solomon might help with the 'young men' though.

- Lime

49

How do I cut off pioneering?

by bottleofwater in

i'm 19 and trying to get a job.

my dad won't pay for my college if i don't pioneer.. if i get a job, i can't pioneer while in college.. i can supposedly work and study, but i need a good way to get rid of pioneering (it was never my idea in the first place - blame the parents with their social coercion).. if i stop pioneering, i will be told by my parents that i don't love jehovah (not that i care what they say).. how can i do this as painlessly as possible?.

i want to move out someday and have enough money to do this.. by the way, if you read my started topics you will see my situation in more detail and that my dad is the coordinator of the boe..

HintOfLime

1. Student loan. 2. Move out. 3. Part-time job. 3. Get living. 4. No regrets.

I totally agree with this. It is hard taking those first few steps out of the nest, but everybody has to do it sometime, and this sounds like a good time.

And when you do it, and you're standing on your own two feet and taking control of your own life instead of letting other people control it for you - believe me, it feels absolutely awesome. It's like breathing air for the first time after holding your breath underwater nearly to the point of bursting. Even if things don't always go 100% the way you like, it still feels great.

- Lime

143

How do Jehovah's Witnesses Explain This Fossil Record?

by sabastious in

according to jws, evolution is false.

so how do they explain these human-like fossils?.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/human_evolution.

HintOfLime

I already said (and it has been admitted on here by others) that the fossil record is only 10% at best of records. No one can prove or disprove anything by it. There are simply not enough fossil Jigsaw pieces available.

The bible is <0.0001% at best a "historical record". In Jesus life alone, entire decades of his life are unrecorded. THEREFORE, by your own logic: No one can prove or disprove anything by it. There is simply not enough historical Jigsaw pieces available.

In other words: What you just said was extremely stupid... and we know far more about life and earth by means of observation than the bible "reveals" (which is often outright wrong, see: "Waters above" lol).

- Lime

143

How do Jehovah's Witnesses Explain This Fossil Record?

by sabastious in

according to jws, evolution is false.

so how do they explain these human-like fossils?.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/human_evolution.

HintOfLime

Ask Darwinists to explain the Cambrian explosion in the fossil records.

Wow, is Debator trying to play in an Evolution debate? This'll be good. So, to start, regarding the Cambrian Explosion for any third parties who are interested, I think Thunderf00t counters this 'creationist argument' extremely well:

A) Oxygen was becomming more present in the atmosphere, which presented lifeforms that could utilize it new competitive advantages.

B) The Cambrian Explosion took place over 6,000,000 years (EDIT: fixed)

C) All the animals in the Cambrian Explosion were water dwelling. (If this is being purported as a 'creation event', why do we not see similar 'creation events' for the other animal groups/creative days? Answer: Because they didn't happen.)

D) A significant number of those animals (I don't have an exact percent) are now extinct, which makes very little sense from an 'intelligent designer' stantpoint.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sui4CadfhDM

If anything, the Cambrian Explosion is a remarkable study in competition and evolution.

For more information that isn't based on appeals to ignorance and/or bronze-age nonsense, see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cambrian_explosion

- Lime

87

The EVOLUTION thread!

by BurnTheShips in

i would like to start a boilerplate thread to discuss evolution.

there seems to be a great deal of interest in the subject.. so, i ask our members, what do you think about the veracity of the biological theory known as evolution?.

is it true?

HintOfLime

SBC, what I don't like about evolution being proclaimed a "fact" is that it's like evolution is being held up as an end-all be-all. I don't like how those who question it are constantly belittled and worse. I don't like how people get shouted down when they don't uphold evolution as an absolute. Just sayin'...

I was just watching a documentery last night (100 Top Discoveries, by Bill Nye.. the Science Episode), and he was discussing the discovery of the Periodic Table of Elements. It wasn't enough that Dmitri Mendeleev put the elements into a table or tried to order them - that idea didn't revolutionize anything, and in fact, other scientists had quietly made their own tables, many very close to what Dmitri did.

What Dmitri Mendeleev did that made his theory valuable, however - was to make a prediction regarding the nature of 3 elements that had not yet been discovered. When those predictions turned out to be a factual reality - only then did his work on the periodic table get notice.

That's the part most non-scientists don't get - Evolution is not an opinion. By means of the theory of evolution, predictions have been made (such as the prediction that cellular life must have a means of transmitting information from one generation to the next - well before gene theory or DNA were discovered. Also if humans and apes have the same ancestor, then in Human DNA we should find a point where two chromosomes merged, to explain our different chromosome counts - also predicted before it's discovery. There are dozens of examples where Evolution predicts something, and that indeed is the case.)

Opinions and "it's only a theory" just don't mean anything when you understand that it makes valid and useful predictions - it's pretty well been vindicated. It's made non-intuitive predictions, and those predictions have turned out to be factual reality. When one can acurately predict something - then one truely understand it... and that is what Science is all about - understanding the universe as it really is.

People, of course, are free to their opinons - but when those same people are voting, starting wars, indoctrinating children, and actively seeking to poison science education in classrooms... I think it is worth pissing off a few forum posters and getting the word out that there are better explainations than 'goddidit'.

- Lime