Let's not forget too that by keeping you from going to college (like those of my generation who didn't need to go to school because the end was so close), a bunch of us are stuck working dead-end, manual labor jobs, and can't hardly put food on the table, more or less have *ANYTHING* left over to put in the box. My middle aged body can't take much more of the manual labor that I have to do on a daily basis. No health insurance either! Where's the WTBTS health care plan? I can't think of anything that makes you more a part of the world, than going on welfare and having a bunch of worldly people's tax dollars support you because you didn't go to school so you could provide for yourself adequately. They've created a whole generation of people that cannot afford to put anything in the donation box because we don't have anything left to give. You darn right they're hurting.
silent
JoinedPosts by silent
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20
WTS Loses Money By Disfellowshipping Info.
by mind blown inhello, i found this info interesting from a spanish xjw site and thought it may be of interest to you too?
i used bing language translator.
i assume when the post below refers to commissions judicatives, they may be referring to jc?.
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A Dazzling apologist effort concerning Watchtower United Nations N G O
by Terry inintroduction: in the beginning.
how it all started.
read this chapter.... know your ngos!.
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silent
If being a member of the YMCA makes me an activist and proponet of some interfaith movement, then does giving money to a non-JW doctor and his medical organization make me an interfaith proponent? What I'm getting at is if I'm paying for a service, then how is that any different than paying a non-JW plumber, non-JW doctor, non-JW public utilities department, non-JW anything for services or product? I live in a small town where the only swimming pool I can go to for exercise and therapy is at the YMCA. If I wanted to donate money to their cause, that's one thing. But to get a membership (as they call it) or pay dues so I can have access to their swimming pool is considered interfaith? Okay, well if that's the case, then where is the JWCA pool so I can go have my therapy there? Honestly, if your heart is all for Jehovah, and your motive is pure, do you think Jehovah will hate you so much he'd kill you over something like that? What kind of God are they making him out to be?
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Top 10 EASIEST WAYS TO FADE....lets use our new Code words ( I will do 2 of 10 )
by dreamgolfer in1. move out of your assigned congo territory - with gas going back to $ 4 a gallon, they wont come hunting for you.
2. stop going to meetings because you:_______________________________________________.
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silent
I told an elder about all the stupid things people had said and did to me while I was dating my now-wife. I explained how people judged us for meeting online, driving around and doing stuff without a chaperone, and a whole list of negative things. We found out that dating without a chaperone was a non-event. Every single person in my age group that went to my hall while I was growing up is either DF'd or not doing anything with it any more. I remember thinking from a young age that I better not have anything to do with girls because I figured I'd be all caught up with passion and drop my pants and start hammering away. My wife and I had no problems with any of this while we were dating. We were just 2 kindred spirits who wanted to wait until after we were married to have sex. So many JWs minds were in the gutter, they personally marked us and considered us bad association.
So how I faded was I told the elder, "When will all this stupid stuff stop so I can come back?" He had no answer and that was the last time I talked to him.
Wouldn't it better, instead of making all kinds of rules about things, just to tell people what the discipline will be for certain behaviours, and then let them experience the discipline if they make a mistake? Let people live and try to live and if they make a bad decision, well just own up to it and move on. I just wish JWs would treat each other better and treat me better. I enjoy the beliefs but have zero respect for anything that isn't bonafide in the Bible. If it's not in print, I can't go along with it because then you are adding to it.
Maybe how I went wasn't a fade per se, but up until that meeting, I had done a good job. I attended a friend's wedding and got pigeon-holed into a corner at the reception. I told him that's why I sweated bricks and debated going to the reception because I was worried an elder was going to pigeon-hole me and have this discussion - just like right now. I was really agitated.
I'm just sad that I can't worship Jehovah without all the other B.S. that gets in the way. I think underneath the facade that the WTBTS presents Jehovah as, he's a really loving, caring, considerate God and I'd really like to just visit with him personally. I think a chat with him would expose so much of the hurtful rules that are foisted upon us and makes us hurt inside so much. If you really love someone, you don't make up rules that hurt them and tears them down - making them want to kill themselves as was the case with me for so many years.
I've had to fade for my own survival because wanting to die is not a product of a healthy religion.
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Did You Have A Lot Of Meetings With The Elders?
by minimus inwe're you always in the back room with the elders?.
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silent
I used to have lots of meetings with elders. They took issue wtih the most basic of things - namely me just trying to find a wife. She came here from a foreign country (she's a JW) and she stayed in the basement of the house while I stayed upstairs with my brothers who also live with me. They came unglued and said it, "Looked bad." I was ready to call off everything because I hated being in the spotlight. I finally wisened up and just said that after 40 years of dealing with it all - people ratting on me, certain people getting away with things others weren't allowed to, my wife's brothers getting sexually abused by JWs but nothing came of it (because the perps were unbaptized), people spying, my having to take sedatives just to attend a meeting, phone calls about low service time, taking 3 different anti-depressants over the course of 10 years, etc. I just had finally had enough. Surprisingly my depressive episodes have all but vanished, I'm married to my wonderful wife, no more calls, no more guilt trips, no more sedatives, no more feeling like I wasn't good enough, etc. Although we do both suffer from a terrible loss of self-esteem that permeates everything we do and bothers us daily to the point of torment, we still manage and do the best we can. Looking back, growing up a JW was extremely hurtful, debilitating, and it's left us both damaged goods. We hurt a lot inside, but we get up every morning and try our best. If a person sticks to the bible 100% and doesn't add anything and mean ANYTHING (no hourly requirement, no titles for levels of service, no prohibition on college (how in the heck are you supposed to provide for your family and afford health insurance working mential cleaning jobs?) and speaking to people as your heart motivates you to instead of trying to meet some hourly goal, then it feels good and you can see how simple serving Jehovah really is. Man has to add all kinds of things that spoils it for everyone. I see it as protection for the group, not the individual. I mean after all, if Jehovah protects us individually, then how do you tell that to someone who was as JW and execute by the Nazi's. I honestly think what it is, is when Jesus comes back to clean the earth, the WTBTS can say, "We did everything you asked." and covered their rear-ends at the expense of many humble individuals whose hearts and spirits were broken with rigid rules that were created, applied unfairly, and enforced only to a level based upon your service time - none of which the Bible backs up.
Interestingly enough, my wife grew up literally on the other side of the world and in the southern hemisphere and her experiences of being shunned and mistreated (especially for going to school) were the same as mine. And once she finished college, Bethel in her country came knocking and wanted her to work for them. How can they do this when they are busy telling everyone they shouldn't go to school? How did their lawyers earn their degree to practice law? By divine inspriation? I just don't get it why it's okay for some and not for others. We're suffering out here and nobody seems to care.
Sorry for my OTP. I finally don't have to feel bad for being called in for an unfair elders meeting. I told them I hated being in the library and being seen in there and they called me in anyway. I almost killed myself over it - it hurt so bad. I still talk to people about happy things concerning the Bible and a new life and new world where wrongs will be righted. I do this out of my own enjoyment in my heart. I don't turn in my time because I don't like them keeping record of it and using it as a guide to judge me. My time is between Jehovah and myself and I enjoy letting him see into my heart that I'm an honest-hearted person trying really hard to do the right thing. I told the brothers a year ago if they would pay for my anti-depressants and sedatives, I would be able to go back. So far, nobody has offered to pay...
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I Am So Bad~Yard Sale Experience
by StAnn ini went yard saling today.
had lots of fun, got some great bargains.
at one of the yard sale, the people were firm on their prices.
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silent
I had a guy get upset about me seeing a piece of lawn equipment and staying firm at $55. He tried for $45 and got upset when I told him I never sell anything under $50. He scoffed at me and made some off-color remark about my lack of intelligence. He left in a huff and I sold it 4 days later for $55. :)
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My brief respite
by silent ini have been so worked up and worried for years about the end and armageddon that i have headaches, depression, and all kinds of maladies.
been having troubles with it since 4th grade and nothing seems to help.
just being at the kingdom hall is mentally taxing, just anything jw is mentally taxing.
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silent
I have been so worked up and worried for years about the end and Armageddon that I have headaches, depression, and all kinds of maladies. Been having troubles with it since 4th grade and nothing seems to help. Just being at the Kingdom Hall is mentally taxing, just anything JW is mentally taxing. Tonight I went over to a gentleman's house to help him work on his computer. He knows me from work, I'm good at computers, and I not only love to fix them but teach people as well so they realize it's just fear of the unknown that makes it scary. The 2 hours I was over there, I completely forgot about Armageddon. We talked about corruption in the workplace, some political issues (of which I could care less), lamented corruption in the legal system, about thunderstorms and tornadoes, etc. I almost didn't want to leave because it meant slipping back into this depression riddled world I live in. "In due season we shall reap if we do not tire out," I think. Something is just really nice about being ignorant of the world scene. It struck me though that the whole reason I have so much trouble with witnessing is because I'm a non-confrontational person and this indeed puts you in a confrontational situation. If only I could have a relaxing chat with some sane JWs about topics such as hobbies and personal interests instead of it being punctuated with guilt and terror. "In the new system where knowledge of Jehovah is commonplace we will have this kind of peace," I think to myself. I find that when you know what the future will bring (good or bad), it completely and utterly ruins your life in the present. Then to know there are tests to determine your "faithfulness" and whether you're fit to live on the earth or not just totally robs the enjoyment of life for me. I actually researched purchasing valium online because one healthy does of that can put you out of your misery forever. I guess I need to read and concentrate more on topics such as God/Jehovah's love, mercy, kindness, as well as Jesus' qualities instead of having this JW-driven idea of the both of them being tyrants willing to kill you at the drop of a hat. It's how I feel all the time. Another thing I noticed at this gentleman's house is that his 2 boys have girlfriends and they have their pictures up all over the house. Just really a nice family-oriented atmosphere. I've noticed that the relaxed atmosphere in "worldly" homes seems to create a nice & loving feeling. I'm sure a fair amount of worldly youth get involved in sexual sins, however I suddenly realized that in an environment as that, even if I had the chance to have sex before marriage with a young lady, I just couldn't do it to her out of respect and love for her. It seems that incessant fear-mongering about sins does nothing but create an atmosphere of distrust and you can't even act like a human being anymore. It struck me then, that a true test of morality is how you behave when you no longer fear discipline for wrong-doing or dwell on the what ifs all the time. All of a sudden, at least to me, it takes away the desire to do wrong. As I kept thinking, I started to wonder, "How many people would still be in the truth if it was discovered that Armageddon wasn't going to come as soon as was thought or that it wasn't going to happen at all?" I imagined that scenario and I felt like a huge burden was lifted off of me. I started to daydream about being loving, enjoying life, and still having disgust and disdain for wrong-doing. What I could do that I enjoy instead of coming to Solomon's conclusion that everything was vanity and consequently making me give up on life?
It's my inordinate fear of death at Armageddon that is tainting my life and then I'm constantly reminded of it. It's a control issue and fear of how you can be killed for the slightest of wrongs that is destoying my joy. I've read about people who are diagnosed with terminal cancer and they, being right-to-die advocates, secure a bottle of nembutal or pentobarbital. The peace of mind that the sufferer gets from being able to end it at anytime gives them such peace of mind that in many instances, they tough it out until the disease takes them. So I'm curious if maybe I would see a huge relief by being able to end it all at anytime myself. It's a weird situation that is born out of feelings of loss of control but it's amazing to me, that by having the ability to end my life at anytime I wanted to, it actually gives me a desire to live to see if living is really worth it or not.
I've already sinned by thinking and by writing this post. Everything's a sin anymore. I've never understood why Jehovah has rules that are so insanely difficult to follow when those of us humans who take the Bible seriously, have to work so hard and put so much effort into just living. When you feel guilty for everything you do, why even bother living?
Any comments into this insight? I'm not really interested in Witness bashing as I am in just plain ol' common sense balance in biblical matters and plucking the brains of like-minded individuals who struggle along these same lines...
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37
How Did You Deal With Weirdo JWs?
by minimus inlet's face it, some witnesses are weirder than others.
we had one certain mama's boy who made sure he was dressed up properly, especially in the winter.
she'd make sure he had his "rubbers", scarf, hat and gloves.
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silent
Reminds me of a sister I dated for a couple of months. I broke it off when I found out her mom ran her bath water. She was 24 years old at the time.
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34
My JW Life... (LONG)
by silent ini never, ever thought i would ever be posting on a board such as this but here i am.
i've been reading the boards for several months and despite my initial conscience twinges, i couldn't help but follow a logical thought process on many issues that were causing me grief.
over this past week, due to the things i've read on here, i've had a massive cloud lift from me and i'm starting to feel joy and love in my heart that i've *never* felt before.
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silent
Than You all again. I'm really starting to appreciate this forum. I always thought that dabbling in this sort of forum would make me spiritually week or take me out of the truth but I'm really starting to feel things inside. Sometimes it scares me. I feel guilty for reading posts on this board but I can't help but feel love inside for all peoples. I don't have to love the wicked/bad things they do nor does it make me want to associate with them. It simply makes me more sympathetic to the victims that we all are on this planet. I had a couple of customers come into my store today and I know they have relatives doing hard time in prison. I just frankly asked them how their relative was doing. They at first acted sheepish and ashamed and I just quipped up and said, "The reason I ask is because I care. We all take different paths in life and some of us take a wrong turn or 2 but that doesn't mean I can't still ask how they are doing." I think the people were shocked that I asked. I even spoke with a gentleman who has a terminally ill wife. My fiance and I went to visit them - not as a formal witnesses thing - but simply to take some motorcycle parts over to them earlier this year. We went in and it wasn't long, this terminally ill lady was in tears because we simply cared enough to step in and visit for a half hour. I was even touched and I usually don't cry.
I see now what I've missed so much is the comraderie of fellow human beings who love and act out of love. I used to be on an antique car forum and was quite revered for my writing style. I miss that admiration but since I've left that all behind, I see that part of being human is really acknowledging that we were created with a need to be loved and to give love back. It helps me understand this whole Jehovah/Jesus/religion thing and helps to solidify and secure good human relations in a way that is necessary when you get to live forever.
I'm so sick of the mindset of having to get in hours and this incessant warning message we are told to give out. Yes it is a warning message and it is urgent but human nature just doesn't respond very well to that. It's too Baptisty-like. Yes, in times past that was required but in this case, you have to feel, love, and sympathize with people - befriend them if you will. Think how Jesus talked to people - he was informal, spoke confidently, and people were drawn to him. Showing up at people's doors with a book bag drives them away.
I hope that sometime in the near future, I'll feel more comfortable to reveal who I am and meet some or all of you in person. I'm not here looking to find fault with the GB - I just find that their approach over all these years has left me with a horrific fear complex and I'm still taking my sedatives trying to shake the pictures that were crammed into my head back in the 70s. Because of that, my entire family doesn't go anywhere or do anything out of this subconscious fear. By their own admission, they are imperfect men and so when I see imperfection, I'm going to do my best to try and perfect it and make it something that works starting with myself.
Thanks for your help all. I'm feeling more and more like living everyday and those guns can stay on the shelf at Walmart. :)
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34
My JW Life... (LONG)
by silent ini never, ever thought i would ever be posting on a board such as this but here i am.
i've been reading the boards for several months and despite my initial conscience twinges, i couldn't help but follow a logical thought process on many issues that were causing me grief.
over this past week, due to the things i've read on here, i've had a massive cloud lift from me and i'm starting to feel joy and love in my heart that i've *never* felt before.
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silent
I want to thank you all for your kind words. I really appreciate it. I've been doing a lot of soul searching lately and trying to make sure I'm doing things right as much as possible. Amongst many different paths of thought that have crossed my mind is that #1 - I want to do what Jehovah wants me to do. And since he is the Happy God, then I must feel happiness in what I'm doing. #2 - Satan's taunt was that we would only serve God/Jehovah as long as things were going easy for us or we got what we wanted, etc. I must admit, that when you do get a few nice blessings, it makes it easier to yield to "commands that aren't burdensome."
I've scrutinized myself over and over to make sure that I'm not wanting to take what the Bible says and twist it around so that it feels to good to me. There may be parts that sting the soul a bit when I realize that I've been doing something wrong and so I can and do make adjustments.
I've come to the conclusion that there is way too much dwelling on when the end will come. The fervor to go preach and warn people is at an all-time high - maybe it's close and maybe it isn't but that isn't the point. People have basic needs and Jehovah programmed some basic things into all humans that you need in order to feel happy. If you forsake those needs and basic desires, I don't care what you do, you will feel unhappy and no amount of worship will bring that happiness back. It's just a basic human recipe of certain things you need in order to feel happy. I gave up pretty much everything for the truth. I gave up an education (though part of me didn't want it anyway since the "end" was so close and I was gonna die anyway), gave up (love) finding a mate because all that is out here is elderly widows and mentally ill teens, and I've given up hobbies for the sake of the truth. Surprise, surprise - I've been miserable, suicidal, and on anti-depressants.
What did I do? I started over. I quit service, I quit the TMS, and I don't even put any money in the box. I'm keeping an open mind, making sure to not to conform the bible's teachings to what I want to hear but what I need to hear. It all starts making sense and here is what I've come up with.
1) There is no amount of preaching work, talks, bible study, prayer, elder visits, etc. that will make you happy. It's the putting into practice in YOUR REGULAR DAY TO DAY NON-WORSHIPING PART OF LIFE that makes you happy. (and then you kind of do worship that way too whether you realize it or not - it's a non-formal sort of way)
2) You've got to go out and live your life as best as you can through Bible standards. If you put these standards into practice, you'll see just how smoothly things go and you start being successful as is possible in this system. (and yes, we are in Satan's system but part of his sharade I think, is to make you think some things are bad when in fact they are really good/necessary. You, trying to be Christian, avoid certain things (love, sustenance, food, clothing, a little spending money, etc.), become miserable, and then you kill yourself, leave your faith, lose your faith, etc. - kind of almost like a spiritual calling-your-bluff) Next thing you know, you're quitting the truth or whatever your religion to have the freedom to do the basic things you need in order to be happy. The reality was though, those things were never wrong in the first place but lots of misinformation, religious zealots, fear-mongering, etc. make you think they were wrong.) If we are to be content with food, shelter, and clothing - then you're gonna need a wife to help make the food, you need a job to pay for the house and clothes, etc.) and believe it or not, having a good paying job doesn't mean you love money and are wicked. If you are dedicated to making tons of money and nothing else, then you're just sad, but in this system - having money helps and of course it's okay to have a lots of money as long as you hate it. ;) (LOVE of money is the root of all sorts of injurious things.)
The end result for me has been the following:
1) I'm enrolling in a 2 week trade school in a few months that will better my income. I'm not doing this because I love money and want a mansion. I'm doing it so I can provide for myself and my wife to be.
2) I'm getting married in about a year to a wonderful lady who sees things the way I do.
3) My fiance and I have recently gotten some property and when I'm out there working on it - listening to the birds, the peace, tranquility, it's then that I start having these deep feelings of love and thankfulness to Jehovah for what he's done for us and just how awesome it is to be alive.
4) At this point, I'm starting to feel like I want to talk to people and share this wonderful life of mine. I don't get caught up in the "I'm a Jehovah's Witness." I'm a fellow human being is all I am. The Bible says Jehovah created things and that no bad comes from him. All the bad comes from Satan.
5) And now I actually feel good when I pray and *GASP* I want to pray. I admit I'm a sinner, thank Jehovah for sending his son down here to give me a chance, apologize for my mistakes and bad habits, and just do the best I can.
6) I'm no longer worried and focused on when the end will come. I'm just simply trying to live a balanced life and focusing on being more loving, more human, and just knowing the Jehovah appreciates my efforts, sees my potential, and knows I'm doing this out of a motivated heart. You just can't simply be giving talks, putting money in a box, and going out preaching if you're doing it just because you're told to and everyone else does it. And if you don't feel motivated to do it, then don't. Just remember, your heart will motivate you to do something, whatever it is, sooner or later.
As I keep working at physical things and my spirituality, I'm getting a nice sense of balance. I analyze information as it's provided and try my best to make sense of it. If I'm wrong on some things, well that's fine because Russell was out chasing pyramids at one point and evidently he was someone acceptible to Jehovah. Heck, even some of the people that were guilty for killing Jesus later repented and were accepted. I don't feel a big desire to be a servant, I don't feel a big need to be giving talks, and I need to be in a pleasant, non-confrontational atmosphere when I talk to people about religion. I'm just a human being, who wants to enjoy a simple life, and try his best to live it by Bible standards. The worst thing anyone could ever do is drive themselves into a depressive, mentally-ill fervor out preaching to people and trying to get them to listen to you (while thinking this is how you get into the new world/paradise - it's nothing you can earn - it's a gift from undeserved kindness.) Do you honestly think they are going to take you seriously and even WANT to serve Jehovah, knowing they will end up like that? Not all of them do but a fair few do. This whole mess on the earth isn't my fault. I know whose fault it is, I know whose fault it isn't, and so I'll just be pro-active, do what I need to do to feel good about myself and my life, and to heck with the rest of them. Between my lady and I, that's the view we take. We view life as us, our families, maybe a friend or 2, and Jesus and Jehovah and that's it. We don't socialize hardly at all because it causes problems, therefore we have nothing to be tempted to gossip about, we don't fancy joining an elite door-to-door club or telephone and letter writing witnessing club, we just enjoy our lives, and let the smiles and contentment in our lives open the door for us to talk to others. And we do. And people listen. In the end, all people will simply answer for their actions.
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7
Terence Howard reading NWT to Johnny Cash song. Say it's not true!
by millions now living are dead inwhenever i need spiritual support and guidance, i turn to the 4 gospels of johnny, kris, willie, and waylon.
now i see this video.
talk about a little leaven fermenting the whole lump.
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silent
Sure enough it does look like a NWT with the center scriptural references.
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