Edit: Publicly they might, but privately they absolutely do not.
Razziel
JoinedPosts by Razziel
-
40
Pioneers studying with people in the nursing homes.
by life is to short inis this a trend that is going on.
i live on the west coast and the po's or cobe's wife has at least one study if not more with a old lady who is totally mentally gone.
she has no clue what is going on.
-
-
-
40
Pioneers studying with people in the nursing homes.
by life is to short inis this a trend that is going on.
i live on the west coast and the po's or cobe's wife has at least one study if not more with a old lady who is totally mentally gone.
she has no clue what is going on.
-
-
Razziel
Retrovirus: Because every JW I've ever met believes secretly that Jehovah will judge hearts and not the religious affilication of a person at armageddon. Every JW I've ever known has known "good" worldy people, and they all believe God will take this into account when the time comes. I have yet to meet a JW that tows the party line that only baptized JWs in good standing who don't live a double life will be the only people to survive.
-
40
Pioneers studying with people in the nursing homes.
by life is to short inis this a trend that is going on.
i live on the west coast and the po's or cobe's wife has at least one study if not more with a old lady who is totally mentally gone.
she has no clue what is going on.
-
-
Razziel
During one of the yearly regular pioneer schools I went to, the CO greatly encouraged finding what he called "captive audiences". He specifically mentioned people on public transportation, in prison, and in nursing homes. I don't know if that was just his idea, or off an outline. But he greatly encouraged finding people in situations where they "couldn't slam the door in your face", and were forced to listen to you.
Personally as a pioneer, our cargroups visited the local nursing homes at least a dozen times a week. One of the congos in our circuit had a prison, and I know they did the same there.
As previous posters said, and from my personal experience, almost every person in the nursing home was ecstatic to have somebody come see them. Half these poor souls were abandoned by their family and we were the only visitors they had. This was about the only aspect of JWs work that I would still consider "charitable" even if that was not the intention any of us had.
I cannot emphasize how much it breaks your heart when you see an 80+ year old person who is bed-ridden, and in continuous pain break into a truly heartfelt smile when someone comes to see them. True JW believer or not, it made me want to shake my fist in the sky and say "WTF Jehovah. Is it really worth all this pain and suffering to satisfy your ego?" I'm not kidding. Visiting nursing homes and seeing the non-stop suffering really made me question if the issue of universal sovereignty and vindication of God's name was worth the price and if a loving God would truly feel that way.
-
22
elders would like a talk with me
by varian inhi everyone.. i recently had a phone call from an elder of my former cong.
they would like to chat with me, and obviously want to encourage me to come back.. to make a long story short: the last 4 or five years i was a jw in their kh, i was more or less completly ignored.
had in that time no phone calls, visits or any interest how i felt etc.
-
-
Razziel
Having a shepherding call isn't necessarily a death sentence particularly if there isn't some specific wrongdoing they want to meet with you about. If you are just fading away with lack of meeting attendance or field service, meeting with them and keeping your mouth closed could actually work in your favor.
The most important thing is keeping your mouth shut. Don't express doubts or bring up past wrongs which will give them ammunition and will turn them against you. You say the PO is a nice guy. Come across as a nice guy too and just non-commitally accept what they have to say. Talk about football or something secular you know he likes. Do not make any firm commitments if they want to pick you up for a meeting or service. Mention your health problems and say it is day-to-day, that way you can cancel on anything later.
Eventually they'll stop bothering you, particularly if you don't make any waves. If you do make any waves, chances are, somebody will take offense and make it their personal goal to get you DF'd.
-
39
Advice for a non-witness dealing with a fiance's witness family
by JAG913 inmy name is jaime and i'm here because my fiance recommended this site.
i am not, nor will i ever be, a jehovah's witness.
i strongly believe it is a cult, but i also am respectful of the choice people make to associate themselves within the witness "world.
-
-
Razziel
Congratulations on your baby!
I'm going to offer a contrarian point of view based off of my own experiences. FYI, I was raised and baptized as a JW at age 12, and faded out in my early twenties.
None of my grandparents were Jehovah's Witnesses, and my parents didn't allow me to have much contact with them. My grandparents were vocally disapproving of JWs and my parents thought they'd turn me away if I had any contact with them. As a result, I never got to know much about them, their lives, or their life experiences. By the time I left the organization, they were all dead. I know my parents were doing what they thought were in the "best interests" for me, but I still resent them for not allowing me to develop any sort of relationship with my grandparents, regardless of what their beliefs were.
Your are in the inverse of that situation. You want to look after the best interests of your child by keeping them away from their grandparents who may try to influence the thinking of your child's young mind towards their religion. Of course your MIL wants to take your kid to the zoo. She probably thinks that's a great opportunity to teach a child about the wonders of creation made by a loving God.
Someday your child is going to want to know their grandparents. It may not be until they are grown up, but by then it could be too late. Until they're 18, it's your choice if you allow that to happen. I think the key is limiting influence while still allowing contact. Remember, that for many years, as Mom, you are the prime educator in your child's life, and they are going to listen to you over anyone else. If you educate and explain things to your child, helping them to develop their cognitive skills, and be a good example yourself, I highly doubt your in-laws will hold any risk of turning your kid against you. And someday, it may be 50 years in the future, your child will thank you for having the opportunity to know their grandparents.
Every family situation is different, because every person is different, so advice that works in one situation may not work in another. That said, I can say from experience it is no easy task as a baptized Fader, living with his "worldly" fiancee to have even limited contact with his parents. That by itself speaks volumes about your in-laws. Regardless of the intentially mean or argumentative things they say, it shows that the familial bonds are tugging on them equally to their spiritual vows. They also haven't gone to the Elders to get your son disfellowshipped, which means they are probably secretly covering over or leaving out facts about their son when others in the congregation ask them about him.
That is going to severely hurt their consciences, which means they are going to say and do things in their relationship with you that justify and rationalize their actions. This is the hard part, and I will explain.
My father has been an Elder for over 40 years. I've been disowned 3 seperate times by my parents over 7 years, being told face to face they never wanted to see or talk to me again. The first time was a deliberate effort to scare me back to the meetings after I was inactive when I told them I was going back to college. The second time was when I let them know I had been dating a "worldly" girl for several months and wanted them to meet her. The third time was when they figured out we were living together. Each was followed by months of no contact.
A few months after the second disownment, I went by their house to say "Hi". My mom opened the door and said "Who are you?" I said "I just came by to say Hi and see how you are doing." She looked at me, then looked down at my crotch and said, "I don't know who you are, and I don't know where that has been, and neither of you are welcome here."
I cannot recount all of the intentionally hurtful things that were said by my parents. I cannot count all the times I've been told "I wish you had never been born." At each step of the way I could have said "F%uck it!", blown up on them, and walked away never to speak to them again. I do have the self-esteem and self-confidence to do that. But I didn't. I recognized that just by keeping contact with me, their love for me was equally as great as their love for the watchtower, who told them to shun me altogether. After 50 years of indoctrination, they still talked to me, in violation of the rules, even if it was just to yell at me or tell me how horrible a person I was.
And slowly, very slowly, things have changed. I did what they could not do. I turned the other cheek. They were constantly baiting me to say something or react in anger to give them justification for how they treated me. And I didn't give it to them. We have slowly achieved a stalemate. They don't talk about doctrines or how I need to come back to meetings anymore. They will occasionally have dinner with my fiancee and I. They don't approve of me living with my her but they no longer berate me for it other than the occasional "When are you guys getting married?". I'm still not sure if I can get them to attend when it does happen, but I'm working on it.
The point is, you have to ask yourself how important it is for your husband, your child, and yourself to have some sort of relationship with his parents. There will never be some single confrontation or argument where someone is proved right or wrong. But the fact they contact you and want to have a relationship with their grandchild says you have a chance. It's not an event, it's a process. And for any hope of success, you're going to have to ignore a lot of the argumentative things they say. You will have to prove their preconceived notions wrong by your actions.
If you really want a relationship with them you have to choose your battles. It's a pyrrhic victory to win a battle but lose the war.
-
18
Anyone here truly understand Quantum Physics and M-Theory?
by AK - Jeff injust beginning to read steven hawking's book the grand design.. will i understand these concepts better by the time i complete the book, likely?
or do i need a primer to 'get it'?.
jeff .
-
-
Razziel
To agree with bohm, I had an Iranian quantum mechanics professor who said in his experience, Westerners have a more difficult time grasping QM because our culture biases us towards causality and concrete ideas, whereas Eastern thought is based more on abstract ideas.
QM is very counter-intuitive and has few classical analogues to make it easier to learn without dumbing it down so much you lose what is really going on. Re-reading difficult to understand passages several times, and looking to a little outside research may help you as it helped me when taking the course.
Another thing to keep in mind in your reading is to keep your ideas of QM and M-theory seperate. As far as new theory, the core of QM hasn't been an emerging field in a long time, though many of it's practical applications have just come into use in the last 2 decades and many are still waiting to be invented or become feasible. QM could be superceded someday as just a special case of another, more encompassing theory, but the important thing to remember is that QM is very refined, and it works.
M-theory, on the other hand, has a lot of support in the scientific community as eventually leading to the best understanding of the nature and structure of the Universe, but it's going to be some time into the future before enough testable evidence is obtained to see if they're on the right track or if this is a dead end.
-
39
Warning To All: Taxes Next Year (2011)
by Scott77 indisclaimer: iam not the author but just merely sharing what i have just read.
its up to each reader to form his or her opinion after reading it.. .
in just six months, the largest tax hikes in the history of america will.
-
-
Razziel
Where did my paragraph breaks go? hah
-
39
Warning To All: Taxes Next Year (2011)
by Scott77 indisclaimer: iam not the author but just merely sharing what i have just read.
its up to each reader to form his or her opinion after reading it.. .
in just six months, the largest tax hikes in the history of america will.
-
-
Razziel
A dollar's worth of goods and services hasn't been directly tied to a dollar in the overall economy in a very long time due to fractional-reserve banking. It's actually worth many times that. This has been great for overall growth of the economy but it definately is a root cause of all the boom/bust cycles during the times there is a glut of commercial bank money chasing finite investment opportunities in goods and services. If you model the modern (consumer-driven) US economy as one giant company, with the taxpayers as shareholders, and the taxes as the investment, the greatest return on equity (ROE) is almost always given by providing the tax breaks to small businesses and the common consumer, not to large businesses or wealthy individuals. Many large businesses are already close to their terminal growth rate, especially in the U.S. market. Many are so awash in cash that they can no longer provide an acceptable ROE with their profits. They either buy back their shares, or return the money to their shareholders in the form of dividends, which lets the investor find a greater ROE elsewhere. Dropping a few billion in the back pocket of companies like these does little to stimulate the economy. Wealthy individuals (non-business owners) likewise do little to stimulate the economy when given extra money. Much of it goes into long-term investment vehicles and tax shelters, which actually serves to remove it from the economy in the short term. Short-term, the greatest ROE and stimulus is provided by tax breaks and stimulus checks to consumers. This money does not go into savings or get diverted to tax shelters. It's immediately pumped into the economy. Intermediate is to provide the tax breaks for small and medium sized businesses that still have large growth prospects (i.e. job creation), or the wealthy small business owners who then may plow some of that money back into their business. Long-term is to heavily subsidize and improve the education system. This has the longest time to maturity but also has the greatest potential return. It expands the consumer base, which drives long-term growth. It provides the technical skills necessary for the American worker to compete globally, and it will result in a reduction on entitlement benefits and social programs.
-
16
JWs @ The Movies: Did you ever...
by Open mind in...know the exact layout of lower manhattan so that whenever a bethel building even momentarily flashed upon the screen you'd go "look, look, it's the watchtower!!".
.
about the only cool thing about jws was the awesome chunks of real estate they had in brooklyn heights.. .
-
-
Razziel
Here's a JW movie story.
I was in a smaller town with only a couple of movie theaters. I was an MS and regular pioneer at the time and had several young servant/pioneer friends in the hall that I was good friends with.
Once or twice a year an R rated movie came out that we would just have to see. So we'd make a weekend trip a couple hours away to Dallas to see the movie where we wouldn't get caught. On one such excursion to see Scream, we ran into another group of elders/ms/pioneers from the hall across town that had driven up to do the exact same thing.
It was very awkward after the movie when everybody congregated near the bathrooms. There was about 10 in each group and we kept about 20 feet apart and just completely ignored each other like they weren't there. Nobody ventured over and said hi or anything. I guess we felt acknowledging our brothers/sisters was like an admission of guilt.
-
35
Is it socially and professionally acceptable to drink a beer during your lunch break?
by miseryloveselders ini've been watching my alcohol intake for dietary reasons.
i've been limiting my consumption to a small half glass of vodka, or a shot or two of bourbon.
alcohol just doesn't do well with the gains i want to make working out.
-
-
Razziel
First and foremost, read your employee handbook. 5 out of 6 companies I've worked for tied their alcohol policy directly to the legal limit for intoxication for their state (usually 0.08%). That roughly correlates to 2-3 drinks for men and 1-2 for women within the span of an hour. In other words, a drink or two is fine, but don't come back to work sloshed!