The song lyrics I posted before was inspired by an E. E. Cummings poem, thought I post that too:
--how fortunate are you and I, whose home
is timelessness: we who have wandered down
from fragrant mountains of eternal now
to frolic in such mysteries as birth
and death a day (or maybe even less)
.
...thats all i had to say for today.
goodnight.
So is that a reason to not enjoy life where we are? Should we not appreciate what we have because some people have it worst off?
One thing to consider is that an American would no doubt think it's much worse being thrust into such a situation because they are used to living in better conditions. Do you think it's possible for people to take pleasure in the simpler things even if they do have it tough? Of course, the point is that it's relative, and you are just reiterating that point. Nobody is belittling the suffering of others who have it much worse than we do. Then again, suffering is suffering - which is better, to starve physically or to be abused by those who are supposed to be your caretakers? Ultimately I see no usefulness in making comparisons like these, not if you are going to really look at things globally and embrace all of it.
I also imagine that they don't have the time to think that they are working so much for a bowl of rice, and that American's have it so much easier that they have the time to ponder these things, they're just working to get their bowl of rice. Of course, I'm speaking to people who have a computer, those who do have time to ponder the question. I also agree that it's important to acknowledge the situation as you describe it, but beyond that it doesn't really help anyone. I don't believe in supporting people in their misery, I'm more interested in changing it for the better. This is not to say that you have no sympathy for them, but just because one person think about it more or feels it more strongly it doesn't make them a saint, it just means they think about it more. (of course, there is the danger of being stuck with that one perspective, regardless of whether it's that of a mentally ill person in a developed country or a starving child in the third world) But I think your message actually helps people appreciate those simple everyday things even more, because even though they are ordinary by our standards we're lucky to have them if you look at the big picture. If we do see the beauty through the little things that are available to us it opens the way to an appreciation for all of life, including the life of all those who are just barely getting by, and that will provide the impetus for change.
.
...thats all i had to say for today.
goodnight.
Funny you should bring this up, Seed. I was just thinking today that when people say how bad everything is (people like the JWs), the thing to ask is "compared to what?"
Pat, you might also ask "to who?" Obviously there are bad things in the world, but it does depend on the person perceiving it. My question is: Why can't it be both? That seems to be the fact of the matter isn't it, even amidst all the chaos there is beauty in the world. Why don't we open ourselves up to that?
last night, my wife zazu, had a stroke.
she is in the hospital, and will be there for a least a week.
she can still think clearly and converse.
Carl, my thoughts are with you, like many here I'm sure. Take good care.
Mark
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this is a true story - this girl from school was smoking weed with some other people, and a squirrel pee'd on her.
i've had a squirrel cut me off while walking before, but this takes the cake..
This is a true story - this girl from school was smoking weed with some other people, and a squirrel pee'd on her. I've had a squirrel cut me off while walking before, but this takes the cake..
when it comes to cars, i tend to like toyota's.
when it comes to food, i like chinese and italian.
when it comes to vacations, i like the mountains or tropical beaches.
I think the issue is not so much whether there is one right religion, but rather what religion is and how people approach it. To put it quite bluntly, the way most people use religion is like a guy making love to a picture of a woman as opposed to a real, actual woman. You might call it mental masturbation, actually. It's a matter of seeing what it points to, not taking it as absolute fact. Here, I'll type GOD, that spells God. Did I just summon God? It's just a representation isn't it? So are the thoughts in your head, even if you have all your mental ducks in a row.
Another way in which it might be similar is how people go from one person to the next trying to find "real love", whereas the only thing that's different is the person they're with, and what they have to do is change the way they relate. It's not always "the other", whether that other is a person or a belief system, part of it has to do with the seeker. If you're a silly wanker, then no woman or belief system is going to change that, and you probably can't have a successful relationship with any one no matter how great they are. I don't really care if people fancy themselves as logical, scientific, critical thinkers or whatever. If they use it to serve their ego rather than allow that to be integrated into their psychology, they're still silly wankers.
the following is a repost of a april 2001 post on h2o.. .
the key to properly understanding the bible is remembering that it is all about the spirit.
whatever is spoken of in the bible no matter how literal it appears to be is intended to convey something of the spirit.
Zechariah, you've repeatedly made the claim that those who are not willing to believe are pessimistic and are afraid of being disappointed, but do you realize that you need to have some kind of expectation so as to have even the possibility of a negative contrast? There can be no pessimism or fear of disappointment if someone has no expectation and no assumptions to start with. Your argument makes sense from the standpoint of someone who is "unbelieving" in the sense of being very incredulous, but that's just belief turned upside down. They simply believe that something is false rather than true, it's still a belief. Frankly it's just in the same category to me, two sides of the same coin. There is such a thing as non-belief, not having a position at all. That is truly the absence of belief, not just holding another position. It's also what we call being open minded. So I think in general, there can be truth to this idea that someone might choose to believe something is false or does not exist simply out of fear of being disappointed, but the real issue here is the need for a sense of security. Believing in something allows you that sense of security, but if you're honest in acknowledging the unknown then you're without that security. Is it better to fake certainty or to be honest with yourself about what you can reasonably accept as true?
its weird...i was feeling fine all day and then all of a sudden i just feel depressed.. i'm wondering if i made a mistake divorcing my wife.
i know i made a right decision leaving the wt, but just wonder if i should have stuck it out with her.
not that she wanted me or anything, thats the main reason why i left.
Oh, and of course once you recognize what might be contributing to the feeling, it only makes sense to do something to offset that. It helps to be sensitive to and take care of your physical health.
its weird...i was feeling fine all day and then all of a sudden i just feel depressed.. i'm wondering if i made a mistake divorcing my wife.
i know i made a right decision leaving the wt, but just wonder if i should have stuck it out with her.
not that she wanted me or anything, thats the main reason why i left.
If it happens all of the sudden there may be another factor, perhaps a chemical/organic one. This may or may not be the case for you, but it's good to be aware of this. Most people seem to think of biochemical balance to be a matter of pharmaceutical regulation, but I know in the past when I was depressed I've been able to identify certain things I ingested, or simply blood sugar level and things like that if I stopped and asked "what the hell made this happen?" This is not to say there aren't issues that you may have to face, but if you are down chemically/metabolically you may simply feel it more strongly. It is possible to feel lousy and not have it affect your thinking, atleast not to the degree where it incapacitates you and blinds you to what's going on in your body.
i have a problem..... ok, i'm almost finished... but... what now?
how can that person begin to live a normal life, and don't feel so guilty all the time?
what's the next step.
You mentioned guilt and not seeing meaning in the bible. Well, you have to have self judgement if there's going to be guilt right? So what is your friend judging (him?) self by? And as far as the bible is concerned, it makes a lot more sense to see what meaning there is in what it has to say in a given part rather than just write it off completely as not having meaning to you personally. We talked a bit about this in another thread. Dresses and suits are clothes that are fine for formal occasions, just because the witnesses happen to wear them a lot doesn't change that fact. Being free from the JW past means not caring about their rules and such, not doing the opposite of everything they do. (example: I'll disagree with everything the bible has to say because the witnesses claim they base their beliefs on the bible) If you do that, you're still defining yourself by witness standards, you're just turning it upside down. I'm not going to let that define what I wear or read, or anything for that matter.
