When I was a young teenager we had a deaf group in our KH. A lot of us kids liked to watch them sign and wanted to learn. We would sign along during the songs. I also practiced signing while listening to pop songs at home. There are still a few songs from that time I can't listen to without imagining the signs I used to do! But I think what we were learning was Sign English rather than ASL. My class now is very concerned with teaching us, not just the language ASL but about Deaf culture, too.
bluecanary
JoinedPosts by bluecanary
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41
Aposta-Deafies
by White Dove inso far, there are yiz, asilentone, and me.
who else is d/deaf here?
had to make my own thread as i was in serious danger of hi-jacking asilentone's thread about potato salad.
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10 good reasons why celebrating birthdays should be allowed
by bluecanary ini cannot take credit for any of the gems below but i did want to polish and organize them.
much of the information was borrowed from this thread.
if you can come up with any more, please post them.. the bible does not ban birthdays.
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bluecanary
Sweet you have ignored the evidence presented and continue to spout watchtower rhetoric even when it's contradicted by fact and logic. You've also ignored my invitation to discuss a truly relevant topic, like every other JW that's come along. What exactly are you hoping to accomplish?
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10 good reasons why celebrating birthdays should be allowed
by bluecanary ini cannot take credit for any of the gems below but i did want to polish and organize them.
much of the information was borrowed from this thread.
if you can come up with any more, please post them.. the bible does not ban birthdays.
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bluecanary
From this thread that has lots of good points:
Birthdays ? Disapproved by Jehovah?
Since the Society disallows baptism for those that are currently celebrating birthdays, it is considered an important matter. Does the Bible actually support this position? Following are several lines of reasoning, and why those lines of reasoning are in question. If it can be shown that birthday celebrations are not condemned by the Bible, would it not be ?going beyond what is written? to forbid them? (1 Cor. 4:6)
- There are only 2 birthday celebrations mentioned in the Bible. Both were for wicked people, and murder took place at both of them. (Gen 40:20; Mark 6:21; Matt 14:6)
- Jezebel and apostate Israel (both guilty of murder) are the only individuals in the Bible said to use eye paint, making themselves beautiful. (2Kings 9:30; Jer 4:30) The same reasoning that forbids birthdays should also forbid eye makeup, but it doesn?t.
- It can?t be reasonably argued that their use of ?eye paint? was excessive, since God?s own word admits they were ?beautiful? after so adorning themselves.
- There is no record that the Jews or 1 st century Christians celebrated their birthdays
- There is also no record that they held bridal showers, baby showers, or called their houses of worship "Kingdom Halls". The fact that they did not perform a certain act doesn?t in itself preclude our doing so.
- The date of Jesus birth is not recorded in the Bible. If we were expected to celebrate birthdays, surely this would be the most important birthday of all.
- As shown in point 2, the Jews did not celebrate birthdays, so it is not surprising that Jesus continued that custom. But the point is not to establish whether we "should" celebrate birthdays ("Is it a command?") but to determine if we should not do so ("Is it forbidden?") There is no record that Mary received a baby shower for Jesus or any of her other children, but that has not caused the Society to forbid us from hosting such events.
- Birthdays are of Pagan origin, rooted in astrology and showing undue prominence to ruling monarchs. (See http://www.triumphpro.com/birthdays_origin.htm)
- Many things originated with people that did not serve Jehovah. This is to be expected, since down through history most people have not followed the path of true worship of God. Is it necessary to reject all things that did not originate with Jehovah?s people?
- The use of eye makeup is tied to false beliefs about evil spirits. Should it be forbidden? (see http://www.thehistoryof.net/the-history-of-cosmetics.html)
- The practice of dressing the bride and brides maids and the groom and his attendants in similar clothing has pagan origins. Should it be forbidden? (see http://www.iberkshires.com/howto.php?howto_id=7&child=13)
- The practice of cremating a body rather than burying it has pagan roots. Is this practice disapproved by God? (see http://www.triumphpro.com/cremation____pagan.htm)
- Also consider the pagan origins of the calendar, the names of the planets, wedding rings, wedding veils, and the use of perfume. None of these are forbidden, despite their pagan origins.
- Some have said they feel rule for determining if a custom with pagan origins was still acceptable was if the custom was accepted by the world in general (such as the names of the days of the week) and if continuing in the custom did not violate any of Jehovah?s laws from the Bible. By that measure, makeup, cremation, and birthdays would all be acceptable.
- Jeremiah 10:1-3 warns us not to ?adopt the customs of the heathens?
- The fact that another nation did something does not in and of itself make it wrong. The context of these verses (and similar ones throughout the Bible) make it clear that it is the unclean, scripturally disapproved customs that are in question. As an example, the heathens may have known of a certain construction technique that worked well with the raw materials at hand in the land of Canaan. The Israelites would not have thought it improper to adopt those building methods, since they did not conflict with Jehovah?s laws.
- Birthdays direct undue prominence to one person, elevating that one improperly
- A wedding feast, such as the one attended by Jesus, would have the same elevating effect on the newly married couple. A baby shower puts the new mother and her child in the spotlight. Even a simple announcement at the Kingdom Hall that a certain individual is pioneering that month tends to draw prominence to that one. But this is not considered wrong under any of these other circumstances. Why single out birthdays?
- Solomon warned at Ecclesiastes 7:1-4 that ?the day of one?s death is better than the day of one?s birth?, presumably because at death the individual has run the course of faith successfully and has established his name. The celebrating of one?s birth runs counter to this admonishment.
- Solomon said a name is better than good oil, but this does not forbid the accumulating of oil. He said being sad is better than being happy, but this doesn?t forbid being happy. The entire run of verses makes the point that there is a need to spend some time seriously working on one?s character, becoming a genuinely good person. A life spent in sheer frivolity would not result in a good name, but enduring the pain and sadness, along with the comforts and joys, leads to a full life. Solomon was not expressing an opinion about birthday celebrations any more than he was forbidding obtaining good oil, or laughing.
- Baby showers are held to celebrate the birth of a baby. Would these not also violate any supposed "rule" of Solomon? While it may be true that the shower provides items for the family, the fact is that the reason the shower is held is because a child was born.
- We have no need to celebrate birthdays. We can give gifts all year long, there is no need to wait for a certain day.
- While that?s true, the point is to determine if such celebrations are displeasing to God. For instance, there is no real need to drink caffeinated drinks such as coffee or tea, but it isn?t forbidden. We wouldn?t use that same logic to try to forbid any other unnecessary aspects of our lives (pet ownership, home decorating, drinking alcohol), so why would we single out birthdays?
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10 good reasons why celebrating birthdays should be allowed
by bluecanary ini cannot take credit for any of the gems below but i did want to polish and organize them.
much of the information was borrowed from this thread.
if you can come up with any more, please post them.. the bible does not ban birthdays.
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bluecanary
Double vision, when I can get back on my other computer, I'll try and round up my sources on #5 for you. If you want to run a search in the meantime, I found info on those items on this board. Here's what I can dig up right now:
The early Christians apparently never pooped. In fact, the only instances of anyone using the crapper in the Bible were Eglon and Saul, both bad men.
Jezebel and apostate Israel (both guilty of murder) are the only individuals in the Bible said to use eye paint, making themselves beautiful. (2Kings 9:30; Jer 4:30)
All instances of dogs being mentioned in the Bible were negative. The Bible doesn't even mention cats. If the early Christians didn't own them, apparently it would be unacceptable for us today.
Bridesmaid Dresses
"If you've ever wondered why bridesmaids all dress the same, it's because Roman law required ten witnesses to make a wedding legal. Several of these witnesses dressed up exactly like the bride and groom, to confound any malevolent forces who might show up uninvited."I have a good scripture about wedding gifts but it's on the other computer.
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What year Did you Stop Attending Meetings - How Long were you a JW ?
by flipper ini'm trying to compare some statistics and figures on this to share later in the thread to see if more long-time witnesses are exiting- or are newer witnesses exiting after a shorter period of time.
and - are more people exiting in the last 10 to 15 years than before.
so your answers would be helpful in looking into this .
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bluecanary
My parents started studying in 1985. I was baptized in 1995. I stopped attending summer of 2008 at age 25.
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10 good reasons why celebrating birthdays should be allowed
by bluecanary ini cannot take credit for any of the gems below but i did want to polish and organize them.
much of the information was borrowed from this thread.
if you can come up with any more, please post them.. the bible does not ban birthdays.
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bluecanary
Sweet, I started a thread a while back that discusses the reason why I feel JWs are not the true religion. I've been looking to see if a JW or JW apologist could address that issue. Would you mind taking a crack at it?
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41
Aposta-Deafies
by White Dove inso far, there are yiz, asilentone, and me.
who else is d/deaf here?
had to make my own thread as i was in serious danger of hi-jacking asilentone's thread about potato salad.
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bluecanary
I hear fine, though I have difficulty with auditory processing. It's like listening to someone in another language when you only half the words. I get most of it through the context. I am learning American Sign Language right now!
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90
10 good reasons why celebrating birthdays should be allowed
by bluecanary ini cannot take credit for any of the gems below but i did want to polish and organize them.
much of the information was borrowed from this thread.
if you can come up with any more, please post them.. the bible does not ban birthdays.
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bluecanary
honestly people are doing paganism things with the birthdays.
So what? Wedding veils were worn by pagans to keep the bride from affecting the groom or his family with the "evil eye." Most of the wedding customs we use in the west today are from pagan customs. If the Watchtower isn't going to get in a stink over that why should birthdays be different? The true religion can't use a double standard.
and to top that off birthdays are like self-centered type thing...conceited if you will.
You think so? Because I think birthdays are an opportunity to show our appreciation to those we love. Maybe you're just a more conceited person than I am. Are married couples being conceited when they throw parties to celebrate their anniversary? Does it mean they only appreciate each other once a year?
to the poster who wrote about celebrating their mom on her birthday...appreciating her...on "her" day...seriously??? you wait 364 days to tell your mom you appreciate her??
You're saying that if we celebrate a person on one day, it means we don't appreciate them on other days. Do you see the failure in that logic? Gift-giving/parties are one way, not the only way, we show our appreciation. It's ok to to ramp it up a notch every now and then.
for jws they are taught to give gifts all year around....whenever they felt like it.
Do you know any JWs who do that? I didn't. We always claimed we could give gifts whenever we felt like but neither my family nor any of the families I knew in multiple congregations did this.
why feel special on only a few days out of the year??
This is another fallacy. People don't feel special only on the occasion that they are receiving gifts. They feel special because they know they have family and friends that care about them enough to put time and effort into celebrating them. This feeling permeates throughout all non-gift-giving times as well.
the jws don't celebrate birthdays because of 2 bad incidents in the bible..
Did you even read my post? The JW religion is FULL of poison. You are straining out the gnat and gulping down the camel.
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The MYSTERIOUS STRANGER.............
by Terry ingod could make good children as easily as bad, yet preferred to make bad ones; who could have made every one of them happy, yet.
never made a single happy one; who made them prize their bitter life, yet stingily cut it short; who gave his angels eternal happiness.
unearned, yet required his other children to earn it; who gave his angels painless lives, yet cursed his other children with biting.
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bluecanary
Believers like to say that because God is higher than us we can't hold him to the standards we live by. I disagree. In fact, I say that if there is a God he must be held to higher standards than we are. I expect adults to have better behavior than children. I hold humans to higher standards than animals. If we are to be held to a strict moral code why would a supposedly superior being not be held moreso?
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Friendship with the opposite sex
by LoriJis ini have to ask a personal questions.
do you think it is ok to have a friendship with someone of the opposite sex if you are in a serious relationship or married?
nothing intimate just friendship.
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bluecanary
Farkel I hate to egg you on in your fowl joke but you know birds of a feather stick together. Whether you have a cock is irrelevant.