Posts by garyneal

My wife, daughter, sister-in-law, her baby, and I originally sat up front during the memorial. However, my daughter became fidgety (as usual) and we had to move to the back momentarily. Her sister and I was under the impression that our family was coming back up front so sister-in-law and neice remained up front as we all moved to the back. Finally, my wife told me that we were staying in the back. The talk was finished, as was the prayer, and now the witnesses are moving to pass the bread around.

During this part, I got up to ask my wife's sister if she wanted to come to the back. She said no so I went back to sit down with my family and I noticed on the way back to my chair someone in the row of seats where the elder I knew was sitting. This person was looking at me with a look of disgust and was shaking her head like I was some bumbling idiot or something.

I later told my wife about it and she said that that individual had no room to criticize for she and her husband (though related to the elder) were C.E.O.'s (Christmas' and Easter's Only, a reference to people who attend church only on those days). I laughed and said, "But honey, Jehovah's Witnesses don't celebrate Christmas. So they would only be E.O.'s or M.O.'s (Memorials Only)."

14

What's Happened to Schipper?

by jookbeard in

jw
friends

any news?.

garyneal

All I know is I cannot read his posts anymore. Threads that were started by him have his posts missing.

14

What's Happened to Schipper?

by jookbeard in

jw
friends

any news?.

garyneal

pjschipper?

31

where is the proof that the holy spirit is an impersonal active force?

by javig in

jw
friends

what exaclty does the jw mean by force regarding the hs?.

how that force came to exist in the first place?.

if jah used that force to create the universe...would that force ever vanish?

garyneal

PSac:

You don't have to beleive that the HS is a person in the physical sense, but a person in the "personal qualities" sense.

I believe I said that. Yes I did:

Better to think of the Holy Spirit as something that while it is not like a person as we can comprehend, He has a 'personality.'

That's how many people view the Holy Spirit. I guess it can be misinterpreted though considering the context with the other comments I made. Essentially, we are saying the same thing here in these two sentences.

24

New (non Witness) here

by juci32 in

jw
friends

hello guys!i am just introducing myself here.

i have been visiting this site for about a year but never really posted much but i have really learned and enjoyed the topics on this forum, in fact i think this is the best discussion forum i have yet to come across .. a little about my situation is i am a non religious person married to a devout witness, when i met him 4 yrs ago he was out in the "world", never really mentioned his beliefs as we were enjoying life without it.

the more we dated the more i realized that something wasn't right.

garyneal

juci,

Welcome to the forum. Our circumstances are similar. My wife is an unbaptized publisher and I think that is the one thing that is working in our favor right now (the unbaptized part). We have similar exchanges (I've even posted some on this board) and it did not take me long to realize that she is not interested in facts that undermine her neat packaged theology. She has lots of family in the bOrg and she is a very family oriented person. So I think she is more interested in becoming a witness to please the family, especially her mom.

While her sister is also an unbaptized witness, she is currently not active. Her sister even nailed it on the head when she told me that they seem like a bunch of 'mind numb robots.' Of course, her sister and my wife also said that they dreamed of being with a JW man so you can bet that if her sister settles down, expect her to return to the bOrg.

I consider myself a Christian but I find my devotion not as strong as it probably should be. However, by not being such a devout Christian, it gives me clarity to see both sides of the situation. I guess, in a sense, that is good but if I had been a devout Christian, I may also be married to one so who knows. All I know is what am I to do with my life as it is now?

My wife and I also agreed that we not try to 'change' one another. I guess in a way she is holding up her end of the bargain though I do wonder how her religion will affect my family. I remember praying and recall being told to simply love her for her and everything else will work out. I will also admit, our situation is probably not as intense (yet) as yours since she is unbaptized and somewhat unsure of her faith at times. However, when I challenge the WTS (in attempts to free her) she 'digs in deep' and defends her faith with all her might. Now I just let it go for the most part. I guess if she did not seem to express how 'torn' she is at the holidays, I would not feel so compelled to haul out facts about the society. Then again, I needed a WTS detox myself so my advice to you is don't get to deep into thinking that they may be on to something. You're doing the right thing researching them and coming here.

I think for me, what may (or may not) get to her and her family is when I say that God is working in my life too. It also helps when you can back it up with scripture. Sure, they may believe that Satan is working in my life but Christ says that good fruit does not come from a corrupt tree. It also helps if you continue to show kindness, respect, and love to your in-laws. It may really throw some witnesses for a loop since they do not expect it from 'worldly' people.

Oh and one more thing. My wife's KH sits next door to a baptist church. I commented multiple times that I can see the witnesses facing off with the baptist both saying simultaneously, "We have the Truth and Your following false doctrine."

31

where is the proof that the holy spirit is an impersonal active force?

by javig in

jw
friends

what exaclty does the jw mean by force regarding the hs?.

how that force came to exist in the first place?.

if jah used that force to create the universe...would that force ever vanish?

garyneal

I have to admit, I have had difficulty proving to myself that the Holy Spirit is a person. I still believe it but I do wonder where this comes from. The only research I did on it showed some verses where it states 'the Holy Spirit He' but when I compared it to the original Greek I found, "the Holy Spirit, It." At the time, I was more concerned with getting to know the REAL Jesus so I did more research on Him and His deity than I did on the Holy Spirit. While I believe the Holy Spirit is indeed a person, I can see how it can be considered 'okay' to think of Him as being energy or maybe a force that gives God the Father His Omnipresence. Granted, though, this is modalism which is rejected by trinitarians. As you just illustrated, how can one grieve a 'force' like electricity or lie to a force as illustrated in Acts 5:3,4. Better to think of the Holy Spirit as something that while it is not like a person as we can comprehend, He has a 'personality.'

12

And Jesus Will Answer, "I Know You Not!"

by cameo-d in

matthew 7:.

21not every one that saith unto me, lord, lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my father which is in heaven.. 22many will say to me in that day, lord, lord, have we not prophesied in thy name?

and in thy name have cast out devils?

garyneal

Yeah, good and bad in all religions and all philosophies. Funny how the descriptions of the individual catholics in relation to the clergy as described by the third speaker parallels the relation between the watchtower governing body and the rank and file witnesses. Set of dogmas all Catholics must beleive though they may wrestle with them on their own. All Catholics are not permitted to think, etc.. Reminds me of the WT Comments video where an excerpt of what the WT said about Irish Catholics now applies to the witnesses.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztQBKmIFqcc

I'm also a SciFi buff and one of my favorite series is Star Trek Voyager. In the series, there was two episodes concerning an Irish community called 'Fair Haven.' These people were definitely Irish Catholics.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FzriF0eHgZI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PJtwpBgXPlo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RSS-ZWuuPXg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U08XWBHkUdY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NdGukYClXvE

"Religion is a snare and a racket!"

40

2009 CHRISTMAS CARD LIST COORDINATING THREAD

by blondie in

jw
friends

i will volunteer to coordinate this.. if you would like a card sent to you, pm me your mailing address and a name the post office will deliver to.. what do you think the cut off date should be for sending the lists out to everyone?.

do you want it pm'd or e-mailed (if emailed send your email address with your snail mail.. i know that cards going overseas can take longer.. i will try to get the postal rates to other countries and post it here.. .

blondie (never done this before).

garyneal

I'm in too, sending you my address.

18

WT Hypocrisy: Pick Your Jaw Up Off The Floor

by metatron in

jw
friends

from the dec. 15 "let's take a swan dive off the temple mount in regard to employment" issue, page 28.

"teenagers have experienced opposition from unbelieving parents.

some have even been ordered out of the home, but they were taken in by kindly witnesses.

garyneal

I have a simple question. I wonder what is the ratio between unbelieving parents who throw out witness children and witness parents who turn their backs on and shun their 'apostate' children?