I had read somewhere that Lucifer referred to the actual morning star that was closest to the horizon. It depicted that star (due to it closeness to the horizon) as being the fallen star and that is how it depicted Satan, as a fallen star or sorts. Of course, I also heard that that account also referred to a king (not sure which king). The best person I could think of to elaborate on this is Leolia.
garyneal
JoinedPosts by garyneal
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Question regarding Lucifer
by truthhurts13 inif one of the meanings of the name lucifer, is morning star, can someone please explain to me the last line in revelation 22:16?.
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Should an elder discourage military service even if said elder has a military pension?
by garyneal indiscussion with my wife concerning what i perceive as a hypocrisy that i see amongst elders (and ministerial servants) who happened to serve in the military long enough to draw a pension check.
all this in a former life (read before coming in to the truth) of course.
i think if said elder were to discourage a young one from seeking military service, or worse participate in the disfellowshipping of such a person if he or she choose to serve, smacks of total hypocrisy.
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garyneal
Good comments, everyone, I guess my main contention with this is that any active elder who is drawing a military pension has no business telling young ones not to serve in the military. They can keep their pensions but if they deny a young one the opportunity to join the military so that he or she could one day get the same benefit, then said elder should be willing to give the pension back. Anything less smacks of hypocrisy, in my opinion.
In the USA, doesn't this money still come from the Dept of Defense (DOD)? Seems like a true Christian would not accept money from such a wicked source.
That's precisely my point and I really appreciate this comment coming from DOC. Witnesses benefitting from the system that they abhor, such hypocrites. Of course, those witnesses who are on disability or some other public assistance but don't vote and discourages others from doing so are equally hyprocritical in my opinion. Don't participate in Satan's system except when it is giving you a hand out.
I don't really see it as hypocrisy. The pension is for work done previously. It's like a debt the government owed to the person. Most military people make far less than if they were working in the private sector, they accept that, knowing they will get a pension later on. I don't see a conflict, the service to the government has already been done.
To take the cheques (checks) no, to actively discourage or disfellowship another witness for wanting this same opportunity, YES. At least that is how I see it. I mean, I realize what is done is done and perhaps they would not do it again if they could do it over but I still don't get why they should discourage others. But I guess that is just me.
The person joining the military was not treated like a person who had sinned.
So would it be correct to ascertain from this statement that no JW who joined the military should be disfellowshipped? If that is the case, then perhaps I am making waves about this over nothing then.
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Should an elder discourage military service even if said elder has a military pension?
by garyneal indiscussion with my wife concerning what i perceive as a hypocrisy that i see amongst elders (and ministerial servants) who happened to serve in the military long enough to draw a pension check.
all this in a former life (read before coming in to the truth) of course.
i think if said elder were to discourage a young one from seeking military service, or worse participate in the disfellowshipping of such a person if he or she choose to serve, smacks of total hypocrisy.
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garyneal
Bells: Indeed, the witnesses are all about hypocrisy and they manage to somehow justify it. Frankly, I am surprised that my wife is able to attend a Christian university and join the YMCA without attracting too much attention from the elders. But this is a military town and I know at least some of the witnesses there have or are currently benefitting from the military in one form or another. Brother Hero, a witness who I studied with who couldn't explain why whole blood was bad but blood fractions were okay without looking like an idiot, was former military.
llamallcool: I take it your step grandfather worked for Lockheed in his former (non witness) life. I can appreciate and respect why he would take the money but what I have a problem with is if he was discouraging young ones from serving so that they too can get this much needed money to support their families. The military pays more than what a window washer makes, eh?
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Should an elder discourage military service even if said elder has a military pension?
by garyneal indiscussion with my wife concerning what i perceive as a hypocrisy that i see amongst elders (and ministerial servants) who happened to serve in the military long enough to draw a pension check.
all this in a former life (read before coming in to the truth) of course.
i think if said elder were to discourage a young one from seeking military service, or worse participate in the disfellowshipping of such a person if he or she choose to serve, smacks of total hypocrisy.
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garyneal
Discussion with my wife concerning what I perceive as a hypocrisy that I see amongst elders (and ministerial servants) who happened to serve in the military long enough to draw a pension check. All this in a former life (read before coming in to the truth) of course. I think if said elder were to discourage a young one from seeking military service, or worse participate in the disfellowshipping of such a person if he or she choose to serve, smacks of total hypocrisy. Unless, of course, that elder gives up his military pension checks and let Jehovah provide for his needs.
My wife vehemetely disagrees and cannot see the logic in this. Putting up straw man arguments like and older one who had a baby out of wedlock discouraging younger ones from engaging in premarital sex. "Such a hypocrite unless that person gives up his baby," she reasons. Another one involved a witness doctor who was giving blood transfusions before he learn da TROOF. "Should he stop being a doctor?" she reasons. Or the schoolteacher who is now retired but was celebrating the holidays at the school BEFORE she learned da TROOF. "Should SHE give up the pension?" she reasons.
My point is that the elder would not discourage becoming a school teacher or a doctor or even continuing in that trade but that same elder would discourage active duty military service to the point of disfellowshipping. But I don't know, maybe I missed something. I just think that is very hypocritical not too much unlike the hypocrisy I encountered amongst the IFBs whose pastor condemned working on Sundays but would eat out or buy groceries on Sunday (someone had to work to serve them).
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Knowing the limit of WHO and WHAT we are
by Terry inwe are each born different from others in many respects.
our human-ness is conceptually the same, however, as we age our differences become more and more apparent.
some kids hate vegetables.
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garyneal
We become what we think about...
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Scary Stuff
by Farkel intoday's high school students in the usa:.
less than 1/2 of them cannot identify the century when our civil war happened.. one in four thought columbus discovered america sometime after 1750.. one in three cannot name one right enumerated in the bill of rights.. three out of four cannot name the first us president.. two out of three do not know the length of term of a member of the house of representatives.. half cannot find britain on a map.. one out of four cannot find america on a map.. when my oldest daughter, who is now a physician was in 9th grade in this once-great state of california, i asked her about the three branches of our federal government.
she was clueless and told me she would take civics in her junior year in high school.
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garyneal
I could give you numerous examples of what I mean, but with your likely inferior education you would merely dismiss it and say, "that stuff is not relevant today and is worthless." You would say that because you haven't read nor been taught what I read and was taught in just High School. You simply have no personal frame of reference.
Considering that I too am younger than your oldest daughter, I too do not have a frame of reference. Can you provide some examples on how education is much better 50 years ago than it is today?
Run away little boy and pat yourself on the back and tell yourself how well educated you are. Damn the facts, just do it.
What facts?
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A Great rebuttal to the likes of Ray Comfort
by cantleave ini was going to add this to the common ancestry thread but it covers much more.
i love this woman....... http://www.youtube.com/watch?list=uuravycv6c0copl2ukvzhznw&v=i0k9nyhh7tq.
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garyneal
It's SPARLOCK, the Warrior Wizard!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-sSV2Nh0rc&feature=c4-overview&list=UUravYcv6C0CopL2ukVzhzNw
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My doubting friend came by and left the letter...
by confusedandalone ini hope that i am not eating up alot of bandwidth and annoying anyone.
however as i make my exit i want to reveal as many things as possible.
i have a friend who had doubts about the latest change and wrote a letter.
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garyneal
What a convoluted mess. So I guess the 1919 selection is now mute?
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After 2000 years since JC was executed ,why have we heard not a whisper from GOD ALMIGHTY ?
by smiddy inhe/she had no problem talking to adam and eve ,though they were sinners in his/her sight .throughout the hebrew sriptures, ot, he /she had no problem communicating with fallen man ,imperfect humans , to dictate his will to his subjects by means of prophets , male and female ,according to the bible , the old testament ,the hebrew scriptures , god communicated not once ,not twice ,not even thrice ,but dozens of times during the first 4000 years of human history according to the bible.. why has this god been so silent these past 2000 years ,when their have been atrocities above the scale of anything that has ever been seen these past 6000 years of human existence .. oh you may say that the atrocities were not committed by god they were committed by man.
fair enough .but god intervened in human affairs in such smaller infringements.
with prophets or so the bible says.. the so called apostacy after the last of the apostles , the influence of satan in the world ,( or was that after 1914 ,) and the 2000 year gap when christ was supposed to return ,never mind about all the crap that went before it .. the fact remains we have never heard from god ,any god, or even" a " god, with either his/her approval or disapproval of events good or bad these past 2000 years... smiddy.
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garyneal
God clearly spoke and told William Miller Jonas Wendell C.T. Russell Joseph Rutherford Freddy Franz The Governing Body that Jesus' Second Coming Armageddon was happening in 1844 1873 1874 1914 1915 1917 1925 1942 1975 within one generation of 1914 the 20th Century within one overlapping generation of 1914.
That's precisely the point I was making to my wife when I told her about the Klines and why my BS meter was pegging big time when I heard them three preach. Let's not forget that God was also speaking to Harold Camping when he made (and revised) his end of the world predictions. Yet, if you question them, you can be labeled as guilty of committing the unpardonable sin for after all who are you to question Holy Spirit?
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People that believe in the hell fire doctrine, do the believe in cremation?
by jam innothing like getting an early start if one believe in the hell.
fire doctrine.. seriously, what are jw's view on cremation?
can not recall but.
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garyneal
My wife wants to be cremated when she dies. But in regards to hellfire believers, my wife's grandmother use to say before her death that she did not want to be cremated. Why? Because she did not want to be burned twice.
I think this is why her mom became so enamored with the witness belief. She commented in one of the meetings that her main thing she liked was that they did not have the hellfire doctrine.