Posts by jayhawk1

67

The serious conversation with the wife about the cult

by OnTheWayOut in

jw
friends

if you needed my background, this thread will tell it-.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/6/121888/1.ashx.

my wife recently asked me about not commenting at a wt study.. our discussion was the topic of this thread-.

jayhawk1

Nathan, thanks for posting so soon on my question.

Maybe my memory sucks, but I could swear Watchtower did a lengthy article around 1996 about Scientology and L. Ron Hubbard. I could swear it was written not all that long after they did one on Mormons and Joseph Smith. I am more certain about the article on Joseph Smith.

I could be totally off on that one though and could have it confused with my own personal reading.

The WTB&TS is built largely on attacking and condemning the Roman Catholic Church. I guess that as PROTESTants, that should be expected. They make a weak attempt at addressing other mainstream religious systems: Judaism, Islam, Hinduism, Buddhism; but do quite poorly really on the entire CULT issue.
I think they are afraid to look in that mirror.

Too true. Makes me wonder if any JWs are turned off by the constant attacking of Catholics.

67

The serious conversation with the wife about the cult

by OnTheWayOut in

jw
friends

if you needed my background, this thread will tell it-.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/6/121888/1.ashx.

my wife recently asked me about not commenting at a wt study.. our discussion was the topic of this thread-.

jayhawk1

Man, you've got it all figured out. I like your approach. When I was having doubts long before quitting, I did meet with one elder at a McDonalds just so I could leave if I ever wanted. You're right about that. Nothing would look worse than telling an elder to get off of your property.

Have you figured out a plan in case they show up uninvited? I don't have a good answer for that myself.

14

Sharing Your new light with your Parents

by pratt1 in

every so often i get to share some of my thooughts about the borg and my new found beliefs with my mom , who is a die hard pioneer for over 20 years.. we actually have had decent conversations about doctrines and interpertations of the scriptures, and she has admitted that at times the borg may have misapplied certain scriptures over the years.. her excuse is that imperfect men sometimes make mistakes and jehovah makes allowances for this.. but what really gets her upset is when i bring up certain aspects of my childhood, that because of her belief in the borg, she made some unwise decisions for not only me be her family.. me getting baptized at 13, her not being fully supportive of higher education, cutting off family members, pushing me into an early marriage when i was clearly not ready, teaching me that all "worldly people', including my father woiuld die at armageddon, these are just a few examples that when we discuss them, she becomes extremely angry and then accuses me of making her out to be a bad mother.. i got me thinking, do you think that many dubs refuse to acknowledge the problems with their religion because it would mean that they made some really bad decsions in their and their families lives.. are they afraid to accept the responsiblity for this because of the guilt they would suffer?.

what are your thoughts?

.

jayhawk1

As for the rest of your post...

Are they afraid to accept the responsiblity for this because of the guilt they would suffer?

Since JWs are taught their way is always right, that would make this a correct statement. JWs are afraid of anything that would mean living with reality. Their's is a fantasy world waiting for a better fantasy world. So accepting responsibility for reality is not something JWs like to do.

14

Sharing Your new light with your Parents

by pratt1 in

every so often i get to share some of my thooughts about the borg and my new found beliefs with my mom , who is a die hard pioneer for over 20 years.. we actually have had decent conversations about doctrines and interpertations of the scriptures, and she has admitted that at times the borg may have misapplied certain scriptures over the years.. her excuse is that imperfect men sometimes make mistakes and jehovah makes allowances for this.. but what really gets her upset is when i bring up certain aspects of my childhood, that because of her belief in the borg, she made some unwise decisions for not only me be her family.. me getting baptized at 13, her not being fully supportive of higher education, cutting off family members, pushing me into an early marriage when i was clearly not ready, teaching me that all "worldly people', including my father woiuld die at armageddon, these are just a few examples that when we discuss them, she becomes extremely angry and then accuses me of making her out to be a bad mother.. i got me thinking, do you think that many dubs refuse to acknowledge the problems with their religion because it would mean that they made some really bad decsions in their and their families lives.. are they afraid to accept the responsiblity for this because of the guilt they would suffer?.

what are your thoughts?

.

jayhawk1

Her excuse is that imperfect men sometimes make mistakes and Jehovah makes allowances for this.

The next time she says this ask something like this...

Would you agree with this statement? Jehovah managed to get men to write the Bible without their making a mistake.

So if you agree Jehovah managed this, did Jehovah forget how to use men to spread his message? Why does his men make mistakes today?

If your mom is still wanting to stay on this subject, take her to the scripture that talks about what to look for with a false prophet. Then ask her if the Watchtower Corp is guilty of any of their prophecies proving false.

Now if she doesn't agree with the statement... "Jehovah managed to get men to write the Bible without their making a mistake." Then have her show you in the Bible a scripture that Jehovah didn't want in the Bible. That would cause her to reverse course and agree with the above statement.

(This may start a fight, but this conversation will cause her to think independently at least for a short time.)

67

The serious conversation with the wife about the cult

by OnTheWayOut in

jw
friends

if you needed my background, this thread will tell it-.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/6/121888/1.ashx.

my wife recently asked me about not commenting at a wt study.. our discussion was the topic of this thread-.

jayhawk1

COs come and go. Your dealings with your current CO suggests he either doesn't care or is incompetent. Not exactly a bad thing from your perspective. Around here we've had some that liked to "keep the congregation clean." It must have been awhile since the local congregation has had one of those. As it has been 5 years since an elder has contacted me for "incouragement."

Of course they will want to shepherd me, some. I will not have them to my home, I have already learned that I would need to meet them where I can walk away at any time.

You are so smart about how you are handling this! I can offer something on this. Allow me to tell you about the last time an elder wanted to bring the CO over for incouragement (5 years ago).

Elder named Ben, "Hello Jay, how are you today?"

Jay Hawk, (My name is really not far removed from this BTW.) "I'm great Ben..."

Ben, "Well, I won't keep you long. Recently we've got a new CO and he would like to stop by and meet you. Would you be available Tuesday afternoon around 4?"

(Keep in mind this was a week in advance. How did this CO know he wanted to talk to me so soon? If somebody could help explain this one to me, I'd welcome it.)

Jay, "Umm, no thanks."

Ben clearly shaken, because he never expected me to say that, "Well, our meetings are Tuesday night, Thursday night and Sunday morning and we'd love to see you there. Bye."

Jay, "Talk to you later. Bye."

I've learned that it is okay to even tell these people "no thanks." They can't gather information if you don't give them any. I hope your wife can live up to her promise and not snoop for them. If your wife can keep her promise and you say "no thanks" they can't do much about you. Who knew two words could do so much?

67

The serious conversation with the wife about the cult

by OnTheWayOut in

jw
friends

if you needed my background, this thread will tell it-.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/6/121888/1.ashx.

my wife recently asked me about not commenting at a wt study.. our discussion was the topic of this thread-.

jayhawk1

Nathan Natas, why do you suggest looking into what JWs teach about Scientology? In all my years on this board, I have never seen that suggestion.

Onthewayout, your conversation with your wife was amazing. Again, this is a troubling statement...

"My mother raised me to get married and have someone else make decisions for me,

That definately reflects JW mind control. I'm not smart or experienced enough to offer anything more to this conversation, but I do wonder...

How do you keep your wife from knowing about this discussion board? Do you think she will accept your plan of reduced meetings and traveling with her to assemblies / conventions? How do you know the CO will not want to meet with you to discuss why you've trailed off on your service to Watchtower? Aren't you a former elder? If you are, wouldn't they make it a point to visit persons who once had privilages to see why they don't want to have those privilages again?

67

The serious conversation with the wife about the cult

by OnTheWayOut in

jw
friends

if you needed my background, this thread will tell it-.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/6/121888/1.ashx.

my wife recently asked me about not commenting at a wt study.. our discussion was the topic of this thread-.

jayhawk1

"Well, many people who leave the truth start to lead a life of sin. It could happen."

(I've only read posts 1 and most of 2, but when I came to this statement I had to comment. I promise to read the rest especially because your posts are some of the best.)

Isn't this typical of the mind control you've read about in your books? This one is a tough one for the fully indoctrinated JW to get past. As if somehow by remaining a JW keeps one from "living a life of sin." What ever happened to personal choices? It just never occurs to the JW mind that perhaps if they don't want to practice a certain "sin" they don't have to. Say "no" to drugs, say "no" to stealing, say "no" to whatever you object to. It doesn't take Watchtower meetings and books to keep you from "living a life of sin."

But convincing a JW of that... well that's a hard one.

19

Let's Review: How the Watchtower Society Uses Quickbuilds to Make More $$$

by under_believer in

jw
friends

i posted something similar to this in another thread, but i decided that this is an important subject, and something that a lot of people don't realize, so i expanded it into its own post.

and we can always use a review now and then, so that lurkers, active witnesses, and newly ex-witnesses can catch up.

according to the watchtower society, one of the best examples of god's holy spirit operating on the organization is the building program.

jayhawk1

Under_believer, your thread is excellent. There is just one small thing missing. In most Kingdom Halls (maybe all) there is a special donation box for the Worldwide Kingdom Hall Building Fund. Now that box does not get as much attention as the other donation boxes like The Worldwide Work (Watchtower money) or the Local Box (Kingdom Hall money) but that's still free money that the Watchtower Corp. gets for doing nothing. The average JW is told the Building Fund money is for Kingdom Halls in developing nations, and maybe the money does go there, but we can be certain that money is a loan and not a gift.

14

I Phoned Johnny Depp

by OUTLAW in

i phoned johnny depp and asked him if he would like to come up to the ranch..he declined..i told him he could ride the "snow thrower"!..he still said no.

(the man has a will of iron!..lol!!

)..i told him if he did`nt come to the ranch,there wouldn`t be a jehovah`s witness on this planet,that would clean his windows.he said that was alright with him..so i said,well if you don`t want to come here,can i come to france and ride your "snow thrower"..he said no..the guy is totally unreasonable to deal with!..(lol!!

jayhawk1

Mr Depp will have a hard time getting that overbite right.

20

Watchtower Angelphone Phonograph, get it while its HOT!

by Apostate Kate in

ebay: watchtower angelophone phonograph the real thing (item 220066239863 end time jan-04-07 11:32:37 pst).

it is over $1000 and an hour to go.

.

jayhawk1

Interesting indeed.