Posts by TheSheppard

84

question for theMadJW and other Wt apologists

by isaacaustin in

on what basis do you make the claim that the leadership of the jw's, aka governing body, is the organization god is and has been working through continuously since 1919?.

TheSheppard

Interesting view isaac, but I don't understand how you reach the conclusion that "the whole assembly" decided what should be done.

Acts 15:6 says "And the apostles and the older men gathered together to see about this affair".

So it wasn't the whole congregation gathering to decide the outcome, but only the apostles and the older men.

Once the decision is made, Acts 15:22 now says "Then the apostles and the older men together with the whole congregation favored sending chosen men from among them to...".

So the congregation helped with the choosing of the men by some sort of voting system I imagine, but it was after the apostles and the older men had discussed matters and reached a decision to communicate to the rest of the congregations.

Then verse 23 says that the letter is from the apostles and the older men, not from the whole congregation in Jerusalem, the scripture describes the beginning of the letter, "they wrote: “The apostles and the older men, brothers, to those brothers in... ""

Verse 28 says "For the holy spirit and we ourselves have favored adding no further burden to YOU, except these necessary things, ...", in this scripturee it is obvious that "we ourselves" refers to those that wrote the letter and made the decisions which verse 23 described as "the apostles and the older men".

It is crazy to think that whole congregation would be debating to reach a decision, that is chaos and not consitent with how Jehovah structured his earthly organization throughout time.

84

question for theMadJW and other Wt apologists

by isaacaustin in

on what basis do you make the claim that the leadership of the jw's, aka governing body, is the organization god is and has been working through continuously since 1919?.

TheSheppard

Caedes:

Come on dude, those questions you reference where not even yours. Just copying and pasting from another site and then requesting me to answer. And then having a bunch of ignorant posters clap like monkeys saying "oooohhh that was good Caedes, hehehe".

I ignored the post as I saw it like a waste of time. But if you have real questions that you sincerely want me to address, feel free to email me or pm me.

84

question for theMadJW and other Wt apologists

by isaacaustin in

on what basis do you make the claim that the leadership of the jw's, aka governing body, is the organization god is and has been working through continuously since 1919?.

TheSheppard

I think the answer to your question comes down to faith. First of all, you might not agree, but it is logical to have a governing body. Jehovah has always had representatives taking the lead in his theocratic government on earth. Acts 15 describes this arrangement for the first century Christian congregation. Acts 16:4,5 shows that the congregations followed the decrees that were decided by the apostles and elders from Jerusalem.

Please allow me to quote from a 1990 watchtower regarding the governing body in the first century:

"While all anointed Christians collectively form God’s household, there is abundant evidence that Christ chose a small number of men out of the slave class to serve as a visible governing body. The early history of the congregation shows that the 12 apostles, including Matthias, were the foundation of the first-century governing body. Acts 1:20-26 provides us with an indication of this. In connection with a replacement for Judas Iscariot, reference is there made to “his office of oversight” and to “this ministry and apostleship.”"

Now comes the role of the faithful and discreet slave who was assigned to be the master's steward, which included dispensing spiritual food to the individuals within the household of God. Witnesses have published that the modern day "official" appointment came to be in 1919.

Firstly, wether it is in 1919 or at another time, Luke 12:43, after describing the faithful Steward says "Happy is that slave, if his master on arriving finds him doing so!". So there would come a time when the master would arrive to inspect if the slave or house manager was taking care of business or not. So the question is, when did the master arrive to inspect the slave's work?

To do this, Witnesses point to the beginning of the parousia and then make some calculations when examining what was happening in the world and within the organization. This is where faith is required as I mentioned in the first line. As a Witness, I understand completely your view and realize that you either believe this or not.

Witnesses point to 1914 as the year of Christ's heavenly enthronement. I understand this date has been debated on this board so I'm not going to get into that now. I'm just stating what we believe in order to answer your question. Returning to the topic at hand, it is logical to think the master, Jesus Christ, would come to inspect the work of the slave after his enthronement since up to that point he has only been sitting at the right hand of God waiting for this time.

I know you know this already, but just to keep up with the timeline. According to the book of Revelation, Jesus had to take care of some business in heaven as soon as he was enthroned as the Messianic King. So the "inspection" must have happened after that heavenly war. So now the war in heaven is over and it comes time for the new King to focus on the earth. The first thing he does is inspect who has been doing the work of the "slave" or "steward". Here is where the organizations history comes into play. I understand that readers or posters here will have some sort of conspiracy theory on this and will criticize what was happening during that period of 1918 to 1919, but the Witnesses believe that upon inspection, the master found only one group attempting to do what was right.

Again, I apologize, but allow me to quote from a watchtower on what the Witnesses believe:

"On arriving to inspect his slaves in 1918, therefore, whom did the Master, Jesus Christ, find giving to his body of attendants their measure of food supplies at the proper time? Well, by

76

I am gay and Jehovah Witness

by yosisoy in

jw
friends

hello, i am jehovah witness and gay.

i am from puerto rico.

i would like to know how hard is to leave the organization.

TheSheppard

"I would like to know how hard is to leave the organization."

Well, "yosisoy", it is very easy. Call an elder and tell them you're gay and that you enjoy that lifestyle and walla, you will be out of the organization. Of course there are consequences for that so don't cry about that, it just comes with the decisions you make.

All these comments about the guy that said that homosexuality is condemned in the bible are just rediculous. "You are promoting hatred, blah blah blah". No body is promoting hatred. It's just a fact that the bible shows homosexuality as a perverse practice that Jehovah hates. That's not insulting or hating, it's just stating what the bible says.

You can try to rationalize or justify homosexuality all you want. Like the silly arguments that "some monkeys are gay", "some males dogs do it with other dogs". Those arguments (which I've ready in this forum and you can look them up) are just plain idiocy. If you want to start acting like monkeys or dogs, so be it. While you're at it, go ahead and do everything that those animals do. Just be careful what you start sniffing.

Again, I'm not insulting, just stating an opinion. I have that right, just like you think you have the right to be a practicing homosexual. You actually do have that right as Jehovah does not force you to serve him or follow his laws. All he says is that you should be ready to face the consequences for your actions.

48

Disfellowshipped and Armageddon

by IMHO in

will a disfellowshipped person survive armageddon?.

will a disassociated person......?.

will an inactive person.....?.

TheSheppard

All good questions, since Jehovah is Love we can be sure his judgement will be just. The heart condition is of course very important and he will take into account every situation so it is hard to just generally label what will happen with each group.

As a form of disclaimer, these are just my thoughts and they should be taken as such. I am not representing the whole organization nor do I want to even attempt to do so.

Will a disfellowshipped person survive Armageddon?

Being disfellowshipped is a form of discipline and does not mean that Jehovah does not love that person. If the person has a good heart and has taken some steps to rectify his/her conduct, then I'm more than sure Jehovah will give that person an opportunity.

Will a disassociated person......?

This one is tough because there are extenuating circumstances to why someone will make this decision. Jehovah will analyze each situation and will always look for an excuse to forgive.

Will an inactive person.....?

Again, depends on the situation. Why did the person become inactive? Jehovah knows all so he is the best place to decide.

Will a weak person......?

I believe we are all weak in one way or another since we are imperfect. Even someone that might appear to be strong spiritually will have weak moments, days, or longer. I am sure Jehovah will save these.

Will someone how has shown no interest in 'the truth'....?

Unfortunately, they had an opportunity and if they don't seize it then there are consequences. The people in Noah's days had about 50 years to make a decision to enter the ark. They didn't. The egyptians had an opportunity that many of them took to join Jehovah's people after they were liberated. The Canaanites had 400 years to make changes and they had knowledge of Jehovah. The Gabaonites took advantage of this opportunity that Jehovah gave and found way to not be destroyed. Jesus gave instructions about the coming destruction of Jerusalem and those that followed the instructions survived.

So Jehovah always gives opportunities.

Will someone who has rejected 'the truth'....?

Could there be some extenuating circumstances for rejecting the 'the truth' or the organization? That is something that Jehovah will take into account. Some have mental problems that are out of their control. Some have been deeply hurt or offended and Jehovah must take that into account. So there is not a yes/no answer, each individual case is different. But, if someone is openly campaigning against Jehovah's organization, that person will not survive.

Will somone in 'the truth' but leading a double life....?

If this is happening at the time Armageddon hits, I think it would be a tough sell for that person to get Jehovah to be merciful. But you never know. Look at the case of Manasseh (spelling?) in the Bible.

I want to add a couple of more questions to your list if I may.

Will a practicing Jehovah's Witnesses survive Armageddon?

Once again, it is not guaranteed. The once that is faithful until the end will be saved. Also Jehovah will examine their heart condition and what really motivates him to serve.

45

Confirmation on statement made at assembly this past weekend

by koolaid-man in

jw
friends

i received a message on my telephone voice mail by a person who attended a jehovah's witness assembly this past weekend.

i believe the assembly was in michigan.

the caller told me it was announced from the platform that if a person is not attending the meetings on a regular basis active witnesses should not be associating with them.

TheSheppard

As a side note, during the rehearsals, the C.O. will only review the demonstrations and the interviews. The speaker does not rehearse the talk in front of the C.O. nor the D.O. So yes, sometimes a speaker will say something wild and could be counselled after his talk, but they do have the liberty to come up with their own material based on the outline provided.

14

"What should you do when directed to stop preaching?" KM question box

by slimboyfat in

jw
friends

we had that question as an item in the service meeting tonight.

the answer was that we should comply immediately whether it is a police officer or just a caretaker of a block of flats who asks us to stop.

we shouldn't answer back or dispute the issue.

TheSheppard

You misunderstood the instruction. The article is instructing what to do if we are asked to leave a territory or an apartment complex. Of course we have the right to preach, but it is wiser to peacefully and tactfully leave and try again another day. If they tried to ban us from ever going to a certain territory, then it would be a different story.

We had a problem with a police officer that came to our service group and told us that we were not allowed to knock on doors without a permit. We were polite and complied with his request for that morning. Now that was different than telling us to leave for the day because someone called in a complaint. We contacted the legal department and I don't know what they said or what they told the police department. All I know, is we received a letter about a month later from the Branch telling us that the matter was settled and we also received a letter from the Chief of Police apologizing for the incident and letting us know that we do not need a special permit to do our evangelizing.

44

Will Michael Jacksons Mom be DF'd ???

by tresdecu in

jw
friends

jackson family to host first christmasmichael jackson's family is to hold christmas celebrations for the first time this year (09) - putting their own religious beliefs aside for the superstar's three children.. the jacksons were all brought up as jehovah's witnesses, a christian-based religion which does not recognise birthdays or christmas.

but the thriller hitmaker deviated from his family's belief system and always enjoyed the holiday season with prince michael, 12, paris, 11, and seven-year-old prince michael ii.

and family matriarch katherine jackson, who has full custody of the kids, is determined to put their former traditions aside in december (09) to keep the youngsters' lives as normal as possible.

TheSheppard

Well, the source of the article is LaToya Jackson so I'm not too sure how reliable that nut job is.

40

WATCHTOWER MONEY - New contribution program!

by Severus in

watchtower money serves two purposes: to protest the policies of jehovah's witnesses and educate the public about the hidden side of the watchtower society.

consider this a sophisticated form of guerilla protest and awareness campaign.

each bill or check is designed to get the attention of the beholder and quickly provide information.

TheSheppard

So you're targeting account servants?... lol, yeah that will bring the organization down.

Proverbs 26:11:

"Just like a dog returning to its vomit, the stupid one is repeating his foolishness"

45

Confirmation on statement made at assembly this past weekend

by koolaid-man in

jw
friends

i received a message on my telephone voice mail by a person who attended a jehovah's witness assembly this past weekend.

i believe the assembly was in michigan.

the caller told me it was announced from the platform that if a person is not attending the meetings on a regular basis active witnesses should not be associating with them.

TheSheppard

It's probably true that the statement was said. It is logical to be aware of who we associate with, Proverbs 13:20

" He that is walking with wise persons will become wise, but he that is having dealings with the stupid ones will fare badly."