Posts by Diogenesister

40

Resurrection, Reconstruction? What is it? It never made sense to me. Your opinion.

by Wasanelder Once in

i never had much faith in whatever resurrection was.

what appealed to me about jw doctrines was the rejection of the "it's a mystery" defense of the indefensible.

when i would ask how going into non existence could be reversed when all the atomic parts of who we are had been scattered for thousands of years, the answer was "jehovah can do anything".

Diogenesister

Nitty Gritty Don't forget it was the Jews that wanted Jesus gone at all costs, regardless of any miracles or resurrections. After Jesus' death they would have strongly denied any powers that Jesus had, otherwise it would have made them look like slayers of God's son. And they did deny everything Jesus did, and deny it to this day. No one would have wanted it to be written into history, that the man they killed had performed miracles and brought people back from death

Nitty Gritty You said it yourself....no one would want to be known as the people who slayed God son - the man that had raised the dead - no one in their right mind, that is.

And we have no reason to believe ALL of these Jews were mad. So why did they allow his death? Because they DIDNT BELIEVE he was God son, obviously. They obviously thought him a charlatan. Why would you kill the only person in history to raise the dead? The answer is....YOU WOULDNT.

Also, I have to say, the way you describe the spirit sounds exactly like a soul. Sorry but it does. Different word, same concept.

40

Resurrection, Reconstruction? What is it? It never made sense to me. Your opinion.

by Wasanelder Once in

i never had much faith in whatever resurrection was.

what appealed to me about jw doctrines was the rejection of the "it's a mystery" defense of the indefensible.

when i would ask how going into non existence could be reversed when all the atomic parts of who we are had been scattered for thousands of years, the answer was "jehovah can do anything".

Diogenesister

Finally, if Jesus was brought back to life, didn't that undo the sacrifice since nothing was really lost?

I've always thought the real sacrifice is Judas. Someone had to betray Jesus. They had to. Otherwise no crucifixion. Judas will never be resurrected - unlike Jesus he'll be dead forever - and has the worst name to boot.

So who made the real sacrifice now? Interestingly, Oscar Wilde wrote an essay about it.

Yes unless you walk into paradise from Armageddon alive, without a soul you're just a copy.

30

I had a somewhat paranormal experience 2 days ago, but I think science is just light years behind on this.....

by Bad_Wolf in

for the record i'm agnostic, never seen any direct evidence of spirits, afterlife, etc.

i've been visiting my mother during this corona ordeal.

a year ago i had a dream i was much older and talking to somebody about how my mom died this year but it was avoidable.

Diogenesister

I think the dream was a fear rather than premonition. Dreams are usually fears or wishes.

But I think checking on your mum was no coincidence. Animals know when we are unwell - fits, cancer etc .....and we are animals. We sense something ...perhaps electrical, perhaps you sensed a change in electrical impulses generated by a change in her breathing. Something, anyway. You spend so much time with a mother you are connected on such a deep level, most of which you are unaware of. Just my tuppence worth, anyway. Very glad she is better!

60

Will You Constantly Wear A Mask?

by minimus in

jw
friends

today, it will be 90 degrees and humid!

this morning i’ll be playing tennis again.

while most people have been holed up in their houses, i have regularly played the sport outside.

Diogenesister

Absolutely.

I will wear a mask in public spaces, particularly inside, because I care about others.

Wearing a mask is about protecting others from you! You may be asymptomatic or pre-symptomatic, remember!

Keep your droplets out of my mucous membranes!

57

In 2020 In Your Country or State Are Race Relations Better or Worse Than Before?

by minimus in

jw
friends

archie bunker from all in the family was considered by many as a racist.

there are still many people who think and act like him.

of course, in today’s world, there are many extremes.

Diogenesister

you like to see what racism is, go to Europe to see white people being explicitly racist

Absolute cobblers. Didn’t the black G.I.’s love Europe and find it hard to deal with the racism back home in the USA after the war? In Britain we have no where near the type of racist incidents you have in the US. We don’t have segregated areas like you do....whole areas of just black or just white. Sure there are individual racists everywhere, but it’s just not on the level you have in the US. We also don’t have the simmering hatred among the younger generation of black kids you have toward whites for everything their parents went through and the violence cops do to them on the regular. Just doesn’t happen here.

14

Looking for suggestions, I'm being called on by a JW

by Tameria2001 in

just before the pandemic affected my area, a couple of jws came to my door.

this was the first time i didn't tell them to hit the road but instead had a pleasant conversation with them.

i never revealed that i am a former jw, nor do i ever want the jws in my area to know that i was ever one.

Diogenesister

would probe them a bit on the "wonderful news" about God's Kingdom. Ask them who would be annihilated to achieve this. We know that the Society teaches that everyone who isn't a JW ( and even some who are but are weak ) will be destroyed including new born babies and children.

Yes once I establish non Jehovah’s witnesses will not survive, I always say that no matter when Jehovah chooses to execute Armageddon there will always be a certain percentage of unborn children, or very young babies, probably in their millions, that will die. If they claim that Jehovah knows the heart you can say that they must believe in predestination. If they attempt to blame the non believing parents and/or the State, you can say “didn’t Jehovah say no one can pay for the sins of another or a child it’s parents sins?”

I also like to ask if they believe in the soul. When they state they don’t I would ask what will happen to those who die of covid19 before Armageddon. When they say resurrection I would explain that due to decomposition, if you don’t believe in a soul, the resurrected person would just be a clone of the original person. Even more so if god wipes out bad memories as many witnesses believe. New body and new memories, how is that the original person in any shape or form? (Maybe send them a scan of the Wiki of The ship of Theseus).

41

The ransom makes no sense

by BourneIdentity in

if mankind needed to be redeemed from sin and death, why didn't the redemption happen as soon as jesus successfully lived his entire life without sin and sacrificed his life?

if he was successful, the price was paid and we'd all be living forever.

it's all bullshit, or jesus fucked up and sinned, so it nullified his sacrifice.

Diogenesister

It's ironic that the JW's still claim that Barbour rejected the ransom given the fact that they are far closer to his view today than they are to Russell's

TD or Cofty can you explain the difference please....I still don’t get it

5

Disfellowshipping or reinstatement during covid

by hoser in

jw
friends

i wonder if the covid restrictions continue are they gonna disfellowship via zoom?.

Diogenesister

How absurd, surely Gods organization cannot hold meetings “in abeyance” when the spiritual health of the congregation is at risk!!

Yet another legalistic term in the borgs repertoire and yet another situation where the legal department trumps the Holy Spirit!!

How predictable.....,the firm is about as spiritual as Wall Street

19

Watchtower President Dies From COVID-19!

by Atlantis in

jw
friends

watchtower president dies of covid-19.

https://nycinews.com/jehovahs-witnesses-president/?fbclid=iwar3n7jwlxwtmvhkjswhhdxekgxcvogw0jxp-rkyhfb_mg1trztlsb3uhkiw .

petra!.

Diogenesister

These online so-called journalists (and their proof readers/editors) simply cannot write or spell English.

Whats up with that? Even reputable newspapers like The Daily Express have online pieces with appalling grammar and don’t seem to fact check even basic details.

15

A thesis: The Discursive Construction of Freedom in the Watchtower Society

by AndersonsInfo in

jw
friends

a thesis: the discursive construction of freedom in the watchtower society.

https://ris.cdu.edu.au/ws/portalfiles/portal/24632569/thesis_cdu_24577264_chester_h.pdf .

be aware, this thesis, although supremely stimulating, thought-provoking, fascinating, attention-grabbing, remarkable, noteworthy, and appealing, the author made use of out of the ordinary, worthy of note, and fascinating words and statements that, for the reader of average intelligence (like me), make for laborious reading.

Diogenesister

like the analogies used, one to the human body, and one to an org. with similarities, Alcoholics. Anon.

f NA

I haven’t read this yet (look forward to doing so) but I’ve always said the similarities between AA , NA etc and watchtower are striking. Essentially because AA is a cult (all the ‘annonymous’es are derivatives of AA and based on its principals). Although there has been some recent attempts to remove the religious aspect from NA, replacing it with ‘spirituality,’ no rational person is seriously going to consider an effective higher power as their motorbike🤣 (although if it raises your social standing it does in effect work that way since both groups share utility for the member as social clubs primarily).

Most people assume AA shares similarities to mainstream religion in such things as it’s tradition of confession. But the confession of AA is not like the Catholic confession because, and here youll begin to see the connection with watchtower, NA confessions will essentially end in judgement, removal from the group and shunning. Of course they will both deny this, since you may still attend “meetings”....but no one of note will associate with you and the group pressure ensures these rules are strictly maintained. Anyone who ignores these social norms will find themselves on the end of the same treatment! Oh but there is one difference connected with this behaviour - NA will claim its ‘a selfish programme’ whereas Witnesses will claim they do it out of ‘love’.

Another nasty aspect they both share is a very subtle pressure to leave a spouse who ‘enables’ you, ie was supportive of you before you got with the programme or you were a worldly, even if that spouse has loyally been by your side for many years.

Edit although the research tends to show AA is not very effective at keeping people clean, most of us know people who have been saved by both AA or Watchtower. Having said that, as time progresses we are developing more effective and more humane ways of keeping people healthy and safe through the ravages of addiction,