Posts by Diogenesister

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

Diogenesister

final proof I offer is this. Don't forget about Lloyd being a fool on the boat during his Warwick lake protest. Maybe I am wrong, but didn't that one include Mark O'Donnell? They know who Lloyd is. Do you think a stunt like that went unnoticed?

Only Javier and Lloyd did the boat stunt. Mark didn't go on to Watchtower property (without permission)as far as I remember (I may be wrong).

There is only an official dress code for baptised Jehovah's witnesses at Bethel . 'Studies', 'interested persons' etc are more than welcome at Bethel and don't have to follow the dress code (within reason).

Aside from maintaining that Putin's Russia is only reinforcing the JW persecution complex by banning them, what on earth has Lloyd Evans done that has benefited Watchtower in any way?!!

The majority of people who find his videos are on their way out anyway & there's nothing he says that everyone else doesn't also say. There's no information he holds not available everywhere else, nor does he hold views about the org the majority of ex witnesses don't also hold.

Therefore, where is the 'control' in his opposition, if such opposition is found everywhere else by exjws not controlled?

173

Roe vs Wade Overturned by US Supreme Court!

by Simon in

i know there was a leak a few weeks back, but this really does seem to have come out of the blue.. the anomaly was the original decision.

it clearly had no basis in law or the constitution, and was a flimsy, ridiculous ruling.

plus the whole thing was based on a fraudulent case in the first place.. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-61928898.

Diogenesister

I feel sad when I think of human fetuses (or even chimpanzee fetuses) in the womb (or outside of the womb) being intentional killed. Likewise, infanticide saddens me.

Yes. This is another thing that confuses me - the argument that improvements in medical science have made the concept of abortions more contentious, since it's been proven fetuses feel pain.

Ok. I get that.

So why don't we feel the same compassion about the pain of chimps? Or Gorillas? Why isn't the killing of them deemed murder? It should be - if you're going to make laws around the 'personhood' of a fetus, capacity to suffer being the deciding factor.

Surely that makes other apes, other mammals even, persons too due to their capacity to suffer and feel pain??

173

Roe vs Wade Overturned by US Supreme Court!

by Simon in

i know there was a leak a few weeks back, but this really does seem to have come out of the blue.. the anomaly was the original decision.

it clearly had no basis in law or the constitution, and was a flimsy, ridiculous ruling.

plus the whole thing was based on a fraudulent case in the first place.. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-61928898.

Diogenesister

The dictionary defines viable as, "capable of existence and development as an independent unit." So by definition the life of a baby at six or seven months post-birth should be able to be legally terminated as they are not yet 100% viable.

Obviously it means capable of surviving independently of the mother's uterus. Prior to that nothing and no one can replace the uterus as a source of life. That is no medical intervention and no other human or equipment can carry out activities of daily living for the baby, such as feeding or breathing.

Claiming a six month old is non viable is absurd since clearly something, or someone other than the mother and her uterus, can feed the baby.

173

Roe vs Wade Overturned by US Supreme Court!

by Simon in

i know there was a leak a few weeks back, but this really does seem to have come out of the blue.. the anomaly was the original decision.

it clearly had no basis in law or the constitution, and was a flimsy, ridiculous ruling.

plus the whole thing was based on a fraudulent case in the first place.. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-61928898.

Diogenesister

Thought experiment:

Choose between the death of your 8 week old fetus and your 40 year old sister. I'll make it easier - you've never met your sister.

Not difficult. I'd give up my 8 wk old fetus any day. Choose between your viable fetus and your sister...the choice becomes very different. I think it's obvious age matters.

Unfortunately the Supreme court couldn't really make any other decision from what I've read. That doesn't mean the government shouldn't have stepped in years ago and encoded early abortion into law.

I've never met any woman (or man for that matter) who didn't want restrictions on abortion. To claim the choice was between rampant, unfettered terminations of viable babies or even anywhere near viable, or no abortion at all, is framing the whole thing incorrectly.

I've also never met a woman who has had one who didn't feel absolutely terrible.

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

Diogenesister

They really don't know who the fuck they are. They are insignificant to the WTS.

Definitely this. However.....

It's not about us vs them, it's about the old-boys-club / in crowd vs the plebs

Lloyd was taken in by a local man and a historian of the Bible student movement, well known to watchtower. Nothing 'off' there.

Also when Mark O'Donnell went I don't believe he was known as an apostate at that point and remember Paul Grundy probably has contacts of contacts in Australia, able to get him in.

So yes, in effect a bit of an old boys club. Watchtower believes they have god on their side so they don't see anyone as a threat to them.

13

Random thoughts on the Jubilee in the UK

by ballistic in

jw
friends

saluting the flag was something not encountered very often here in the 1970s uk, in fact that kind of nationalism or patriotism was something i'd been warned about as a young boy, being brought up in the jehovah's witnesses from age 4, through meetings and the publications.

at some point, i don't know when, i decided it was more american, whether rightly or wrongly.. but even so, there was a large black and white photo of our entire school in panoramic format right outside my classroom on the wall saluting the flag, and i think this was the 1977 25 year jubilee of queen elizabeth ii.. now as a young person attending a fairly religious school in the 1970's, you were used to "making a stand" for things, letter in hand first day in a new class, and being ushered into one room or another to avoid religious assemblies and other xmas, and other seasonal celebrations.. one day the teachers, in their abundant wisdom, stood myself and a younger witness in the corridor right outside the assembly hall where the children would filter past.

every second or third child that filtered past would ask, "why are you standing there?

Diogenesister

I never, ever remember having to salute a British flag as a kid. Nor ever hearing the National Anthem played anywhere I was (only for posh people's events!). They'd stopped playing the anthem in cinemas by the time I was going. Witness kids went to the library at assembly (never understood why, since it only avoided saying the Lord's prayer at the end spoken by a teacher - no denominational overtones). I tried to skip out, too, but my Dad wouldn't allow me.

I do vaguely remember being made to wave a flag when the Queen came to our town as a very small child (4??).

I also remember those silver Jubilee commemorative coins. My father kept ours, but they were lost (together with commemorative stamps for various things that Dad bought us) when our mum sold my alcoholic dad's home. We had the best ever silver Jubilee street party outside Dad's AND my best JW friends were there with their pioneer mum. I think some sensible JW mum's felt bad as the parties were literally outside their kids front doors, so they went .🤷‍♀️

The only thing I really missed out on due to neutrality was the ceremony our (Royal) University Hospital had for its graduates. This included standing for the anthem and curtseying to royal family member presenting the silver medal every graduate is given⚕️. It's a shame because not attending meant i missed out on individual and group photos in our new uniform - complete with antiquated frilly hats lol. These were dispensed with later that year, so photos of them are a nice piece of social history.

Our boys attended the Golden Jubilee street party we held but there was nothing around here for the recent jubilee😔I think white British people in London are so sensitive to anything remotely connected with empire, after the BLM protests, they didn't organise parties. That's all I can think of....???

16

Dear Female ExJWs

by Simon in

jw
friends

judging by some forum comments and tweets, it seems like some female exjw's feel they are being ignored or excluded from things.

i thought i'd share my views.

what could possibly go wrong .... first, i think it's unfair to post and judge people based on a private chat shared without permission and posted without context.

Diogenesister

Funnily enough I think in this particular instance the person who organized this video is doing a bit of healing. It will take time, but I think it's moving in a positive direction and Cappytan has been smoothing the way forward, in my opinion. Thank you, if you see this.

I've also noticed quite a few male exjws very specifically featuring female exjw discussing subjects relevent to us (Jake, I'm looking at you).

HOW-ever......I understand why this is a prickly subject for many of us and I'm afraid there has been a bit of a history of that kind of over bearing i-know-best behaviour from *some* exjw men....but they are by far the minority and usually repeat offenders.

35

Still here.

by Lee Marsh in

jw
friends

the last 2 1/2 years have been extremely stressful.

while the rest of the world was dealing with covid, i was also dealing with cancer.

in fact it seems none of my doctors knew about it.

Diogenesister

Oh my goodness it's rare we get to hear such fantastic news, thank you for sharing it with us!

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

Diogenesister

SHGuys, this is such toxic behavior this community does not need personal grievances between 2 parties as its not our beef so please only talk about ex jw topics and let sleeping dogs lie. Kind regards

I understand why you posted this because it may seem insane of us to continue posting when there is no further "news" as such.

The reason we do so is to keep updating this thread so that it ranks higher in search results, it's as simple as that.

If someone searches Lloyd Evans we want them to be aware of his negative behaviour because for too long he has silenced and bullied others in this community and we don't want his victims to think they're alone.

There is also a deep conflict of interest in his use of exploited women and girls and his CSA, domestic violence and sexual assault advocacy. His fraudulent insistence that he cares for those leaving Watchtower has been exposed as a lie and his activism nothing but fiscal self interest - for which he has cruelly driven off anyone who is a threat or with a dissenting opinion to his.

The only ex witnesses he was interested in were those he could use for content or to further his career and he has never renumerated any of them.

There is method in our madness, Steve.

19

Beards- just told by an elder

by dothemath in

i know this subject has been talked about lots over the years, just thought i would share a recent finding from canada.. while visiting with a group of friends, an elder (don’t recall how the subject came up) mentioned the local body had voted to allow brothers with beards be allowed to give talks from the platform.

(it was a very close vote).

the direction given was for each congregation to decide for themselves if that is now acceptable.. so some congregations will be for, and for many it will not.. it’ll probably be a long time before we see any pictures on the watchtower where they’re allowing this though..

Diogenesister

St George of England Here in the UK in our congregation there are several brothers who have a full beard and are used to give talks, other meeting parts and prayers etc.

Back in the 1970's in another part of the country, I had a beard and never had any problem. Maybe a case of having to use what you have, cannot afford to be too choosy!

George

St. George Yes my JW best friend's father had a real "Santa" beard....pretty messy. He converted in the 70s after his wife got involved (always felt he did so to protect his family more than anything). I remember them arguing about his beard because after a few years the elders asked him to cut it off and he refused. He said it was bonkers because he'd always had a beard!

I think they really wanted him for an elder because he had the perfect witness family, was as an aircraft engineer and test pilot, so he was Uber useful - could make and design.anything. literally.

Kept the beard and worked behind the scenes doing the books and heading up building stuff.

If they need you enough...you get to keep the beard.

They need baptised males at the moment.