JeffT

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Posts by JeffT

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  16

  Any recent wack-a-doodle elder comments in your congo lately?

  by sir82 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  our go-to wack-a-doodle elder moved to a new congregation a few years back.

  the position has been vacant since then.. we had an elder move in a few months back.

  he appears to be angling for the position of resident wack-a-doodle.. at last night's service meeting, he said (paraphrased): "as a congregation, we've been busier than ever before with our special campaign.

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  JeffT

  Gregor, I think you're talking about the tract campaign that started in the fall of 1973. The tract was released right after a drama about Jericho at the summer Internaional Conventions. Rumor had that there would be seven such tracts with the last one in the fall of '75. I remember it well, because that was my first convention, I was baptised that fall. Everybody went crazy speculating about that!

  Wife and I started our exit 15 years later after sitting through a talk about how our children shouldn't waste there time on education since the end was coming so soon.
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  8

  Sunday's NA meeting

  by Pistoff in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  she begins:.

  i have never spoken before in a meeting, and i am nervous.

  i am one week away from having 6 months clean.. at sunday nights meeting, millie spoke for the first time, and it made me consider again the merits and pitfalls of belief.. me, i have been in recovery since the mid 80s and have recently begun attending na meetings again, just to feel more sane and to be there for newcomers; i know how great it was to have people at meetings with time when i started going.. halfway through her sharing, she said:.

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  JeffT

  Pistoff

  For starters, I dislike using the term "cult." It's been my experience that most conversations on the subject tell me more about the people talking than they do about cults. Everybody's idea of a "cult" translated as "people who think differenly than I do." I prefer to talk about "high control groups" or "toxic societies" as these terms are more descriptive or what a group does.

  Having said that, to answer your question the big identifier is look at what actions are incorporated into the structure of the group. In the case of JW's, disfellowshipping, shunning and the sanctions against asking questions or holding different opinions are integrated into the official structure of the organization. Most of the elder's manual is devoted to discussion of these issues. At the same time, there are no tangible benefits to being a JW; and a lot of tangible disadvantages, such as seperation from the community and no higher education.

  Shunning and removing people are not integrated into the structure of AA, although some individuals can still be control freaks. I tell people not to judge AA by one or two groups, to shop around some and find one that suits them. The odds are not good with any treatment program, but there are still a lot of people like me around, who have benefited from the program.

  Personally, I see a world of difference between AA and the Watchtower.
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  1

  Modern European History-What Topics Are Covered

  by Band on the Run in

  1. social
  2. current

  i want to audit classes starting tmw.

  is this a standard topic?

  were any parts particularly difficult?.

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  JeffT

  Check the course descriptions. I took a year of European history a long time ago. (If I remember correctly) The first semester covered the period roughly from the Renaissance to the Napoleanic Wars. The second picked up there and ran to about WWII. I also took a course on Russian history. The Russian history course was great, the early European history was good. The late European history was hard to follow during the period of the 1848 revolutions - or maybe I just wasn't paying attention. Best history class I took was East Asian history, taught by a former CIA agent.
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  68

  Come on! Tell it like it is. People are LYING when they tell you, "I've read the Bible."

  by Terry in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  go ahead.

  tell me.. "i've read the bible cover to cover.

  i don't believe you.. it is damned near impossible!.

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  JeffT

  I've read the entire Bible all the way through in three translations (King James, NWT, and NIV). I've read the NT in two more (New English and The Messenger). I've read parts of it in the Amplified Version and New American Standard.
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  8

  Sunday's NA meeting

  by Pistoff in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  she begins:.

  i have never spoken before in a meeting, and i am nervous.

  i am one week away from having 6 months clean.. at sunday nights meeting, millie spoke for the first time, and it made me consider again the merits and pitfalls of belief.. me, i have been in recovery since the mid 80s and have recently begun attending na meetings again, just to feel more sane and to be there for newcomers; i know how great it was to have people at meetings with time when i started going.. halfway through her sharing, she said:.

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  JeffT

  I've heard there is a big difference between East Coast and West Coast meetings. What you are describing would never be tolerated at any meeting I've been to.
• 
  8

  Sunday's NA meeting

  by Pistoff in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  she begins:.

  i have never spoken before in a meeting, and i am nervous.

  i am one week away from having 6 months clean.. at sunday nights meeting, millie spoke for the first time, and it made me consider again the merits and pitfalls of belief.. me, i have been in recovery since the mid 80s and have recently begun attending na meetings again, just to feel more sane and to be there for newcomers; i know how great it was to have people at meetings with time when i started going.. halfway through her sharing, she said:.

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  JeffT

  Friday night I marked 9 years of sobriety thanks to AA. If you don't like it don't go there. We aren't banging on doors looking for recruits. You can keep drinking if you want for all we care.
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  108

  Was droping bomb on Hiroshima in 1945 evil?

  by new hope and happiness in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  sorry for such a depressing question, but i was moved by a picture i saw of the consequences.

  ( a woman carrying her child) and i realised:-.

  a) it was a civillian population.. b) i don't see how a nuclear holocaust can ever be right.. c) they could have bombed tokyo where all the generals lived but chose hiroshima.. d) the irony after the bombing america conceeded to many of japans terms.. your opinion would be valued..

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  JeffT

  Good comment Hamsterbait. Add to those questions this one: what if it isn't your life but its someone elses? Or hundreds, thousands, or even millions of someone elses?

  One of the options for the fall of 1945 has not yet been discussed, we've focused on the Bomb vs peace talks vs invading Japan. The US Navy was convinced they could bring about a Japanese surrender with a close blockade of their home islands. They probably could have, but how many Japanse would have starved to death before they saw the light?
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  159

  An important message from a PRACTICING Jehovah's witness

  by Sparks in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hi, i am also a practicing jehovah's witness and very proud of it,to say the very-very least..!

  i am a middle-aged man with many decades of being a witness of jehovah god in england.. this important letter is personally to you, just as many of the bible's 88 letters are to be taken personal by you the reader.

  i am writing to you to urge you to take stock of your life, think what your future holds for you.

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  JeffT

  This important letter is personally to YOU, just as many of the Bible's 88 letters are to be taken personal by YOU the reader.

  Sparky, the letters in the Bible were (according the Watchtower) written by God. I see you are following the example set by the GB and confusing yourself with God.

  I'm not disfellowhipped. I suppose you could say I was stumbled - by the Governing Body. I left when it became clear they have no special connection with God. With that, there was nothing left in the Organization for me. As they say, a fish rots from the head.
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  108

  Was droping bomb on Hiroshima in 1945 evil?

  by new hope and happiness in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  sorry for such a depressing question, but i was moved by a picture i saw of the consequences.

  ( a woman carrying her child) and i realised:-.

  a) it was a civillian population.. b) i don't see how a nuclear holocaust can ever be right.. c) they could have bombed tokyo where all the generals lived but chose hiroshima.. d) the irony after the bombing america conceeded to many of japans terms.. your opinion would be valued..

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  JeffT

  Band, if you have not already read it, you would like "Japan 1941" by Eri Hotta. It is a very well researched history of events leading up to the attack on Pearl Harbor. The War Lords you mention seemed to be as intent on fighting each other as they were their perceived Western enemies. Many of them expressed private doubts about starting down the road to war, none of them wanted to be the guy suggesting that in meetings, as they would be branded a coward. Much the same thing happened regarding ending the war.

  Edited to add: recent research suggest Hirohito had more power than was earlier assumed.
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  108

  Was droping bomb on Hiroshima in 1945 evil?

  by new hope and happiness in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  sorry for such a depressing question, but i was moved by a picture i saw of the consequences.

  ( a woman carrying her child) and i realised:-.

  a) it was a civillian population.. b) i don't see how a nuclear holocaust can ever be right.. c) they could have bombed tokyo where all the generals lived but chose hiroshima.. d) the irony after the bombing america conceeded to many of japans terms.. your opinion would be valued..

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  JeffT

  New Hope, you are basing this on one side of the argument, here's one from the other side of the argument.

  Baby in the bombed out remnants of the Shanghai rail road station, 1937.

  

  I thought of posting a bunch of other pictures but decided they were inappropriate for this board. As I said previously, research the Rape of Nanking. Google images will yield pictures of Japanese bayonet practice with living prisoners, and other prisoners being beheaded or buries alive. "Rape" is literal in this historic event, sexual assault in China was widespread and brutal. Iris Chang's book contains a picture of a dead Chinese woman with a stick in her vagina.

  I don't know if the use of the Bomb was moral or immoral. I do understand the thinking of those what wanted to put a complete and total stop to what the Japanese had been doing in the rest of Asia. Incidently, the scale of these atrocities was known to the Allied comand by 1945, although probably not to the puclic, at least not in full. The liberation of the Phillipines in particular would have provided proof of the brutality of the Japanese occupation forces.