Posts by nugget

9

What's the difference between 'works' and 'fruits'?

by TTWSYF in

my uber jw elder brother used to use jesus's quote "you know a tree by it's fruit" and then would speak about how jws are the only ones going door to door and restoring god's true name.. my niece was the first to point out that those were works and not fruits.

my brother retreated for a few days to contemplate the difference between works and fruits and when he returned to address the comment, he stated that works are fruits.

what's the take from the jw apologist?.

nugget

Works are tending the tree so in this case the service and the promoting Jehovahs name are works, The fruit will be the results of these activities.

So door to door work what are the fruits, what is the purpose behind it? If it is to make disciples then it is a poor crop. If it is to explain their faith then the world outside the organisation is still unclear on the specifics of the faith and that Jehovah is their interpretation of God's name. If it was a real tree or a crop it is very poor indeed. Just doing the work is not enough there has to be something to show for it.

35

out for a long time

by Sledracer in

my husband and i have been out for a long time, maybe fifteen years, i must say we are in a bit of a nowhere land spiritually, we find it impossible to attend any other church.

we really resent so much of how they messed up our and our children's lives.

we can't get back all those 25 years we were in.

nugget

When we left the organisation we lost many people who we had viewed as friends and had to start again. We were in the organisation for 40 years so they had pretty much controlled our youth and held us back. However I have put a lot of effort into rebuilding my life and finding new friends who will not drop me the minute I disagree with them.

I try not to look back as there is little of value behind me and so much to discover ahead of me. Personally I could not go back, I found the basis of my faith was built on a lie, that the people responsible for my spiritual well being didn't really care about their followers and that my children were unimportant to them.

I can honestly say that by embracing opportunities it helps recovery. You have time to explore spirituality and look for answers without returning to the organisation. Fear of other religions has been programmed into us and whilst it is good to be skeptical you can try talking to people with other faith perspectives and those who have none to see if this helps you gain an insight.

Depending on where you live there may be a thriving community of exJWs happy to hear your story and talk about where they are in their lives and how they have recovered. You have made a start reaching out you can build from this point.

36

Estimating future growth or decline of Watchtower

by shepherdless in

i have seen a few posts here, in various guises, in relation to whether watchtower is in decline.

plenty of people respond, but it is all fairly anecdotal, or "gut feel".

some of it has been wishful thinking.. as of late 2015, watchtower's numbers suggest it is still growing marginally, but there are various anecdotes on this site of publishers typically being older, and younger ones disappearing.

nugget

I haven't been to a hall since 2009 so I am not in a position to say what is happening regarding meeting attendance. What I do know is that I see fewer witnesses on the traditional door to door work. I see fewer out and about in the community and apart from the occasional apathy cart they are invisible.

It seems that the term witness has gone from an active verb of speaking out and sounding an alarm to a passive verb of someone who watches people go by.

20

Reasons for NOT Returning

by Saved_JW in

i left the watchtower in the winter of 2008. my first year out was by far the most difficult.

i had every intention of returning to the watchtower for the very purpose of being able to speak with my friends and family.

i had already concluded that the teachings were not the "truth" [after reading crisis of conscience] so coming back was more emotional then anything.

nugget

I would add the loss of self.

In the organisation you are taught never to think too much of yourself, not to celebrate your achievements or develop skills outside the watchtower's activities. From children you are taught to have no self esteem and to trust elders and appointed men completely. You are not encouraged to think for yourself, make your own judgments or pursue knowledge. You live a half life throwing away your potential to slave for an organisation that does not care for you or your well being. They squander the lives of their followers simply because of greed with no thought of the misery that this inflicts nothing could be more selfish or self serving.

34

I have doubts... can you help me??- A new idea

by HowTheBibleWasCreated in

i have been perplexed as to how to brung my wife out of jws and to exit the religion... but i had an idea last night.

i know that elders will legitimantly meet with brothers who have doubts and encourage them... not df them .. this is a sheperding call etc.. thus since my wife knows i have doubt s i could say: i want to have two brother over to discuss this ... she will agree.... of course i will hit these guys with biblical textual issues, an biology to where they are stunned and still ask... "so brothers... can you solve this conflict...?".

in this case they will not think of me as an apostate but may question their own beliefs... .

nugget

Remember that people as highly controlled as JWs do not always react logically. By expressing doubts in front of 2 elders and challenging their beliefs you go from spiritually sick to apostate before you can blink.

What may be a ploy is to use family worship night to explore different areas of JW belief that you have issues with. E.g look up quoted sources in magazines and literature to see what the full quote says. Look at JW facts for some ideas of areas to tackle. Present it as a faith strengthening exercise rather than a destruction campaign. Always appear surprised when negative conclusions are drawn. If you challenge JWs directly they cling to the organisation since that is what they are programmed to do.

44

This is Just getting Ridiculous and out of hand with the Borg

by MrsR-Awaken in

jw
friends

saw this on reddit it was posted by user morgan_sparlock .

to me honestly this would of been prohibited 10 years ago, but now every dub is obsessed with this website, it's everywhere even a damn iphone cover... ooh they don't approve of idolatry ooh no they don't accept cross veneration thats bullshit to me!!!

its getting to a point that they are venerating this website (company logo) it's their version of the cross.

nugget

I am really surprised how much the society has changed since we left. All the old strictures seem to be worn away and they look more and more like a business and less like a religion each dazy

15

my first painting after my cataract oeration

by nugget in

have only just been able to paint again after a cataract operation in september.

i had complications which meant my short sight has been compromised but following some surgery the fluid buildup seems to have cleared and i have started painting again.

this is a larger rendition of an earlier piece, such a relief to be ble to see the paper again..

nugget

Thank you all. It is such a joy to. be able to pursue a talent without guilt. One thing the society does is inhibit our ability to follow our dreams and develop skills. It is amazing how much of what makes us unique we were prepared to deny ourselves because of the whims of a publishing house.

15

my first painting after my cataract oeration

by nugget in

have only just been able to paint again after a cataract operation in september.

i had complications which meant my short sight has been compromised but following some surgery the fluid buildup seems to have cleared and i have started painting again.

this is a larger rendition of an earlier piece, such a relief to be ble to see the paper again..

nugget

Thank you. This is an ink drawing with ink wash as the colours remain true when they dry. The disadvantage is that you have to work fast as the ink stains the paper as soon as it is applied.

I need to get painting as there is a summer exhibition and I need work of exhibition quality before then. I usually do the bulk of my pictures in late summer early autumn but this year I need to catch up. Not sure if this picture will make the cut.

79

What's a word that describes the way Witnesses behave as a group?

by paul from cleveland in

jw
friends

i can't recall the word that describes a group that keeps to itself like the witnesses do.

i thought it was "insular" but i don't think that's the one i'm looking for after reading the definition.

i remember an elder using the word "clannish" and that has the proper definition but it reminds me of a group of elves.

nugget

Tajfel (1979) proposed that the groups (e.g. social class, family, football team etc.) which people belonged to were an important source of pride and self-esteem. Groups give us a sense of social identity: a sense of belonging to the social world.

n order to increase our self-image we enhance the status of the group to which we belong. For example, England is the best country in the world! We can also increase our self-image by discriminating and holding prejudice views against the out group (the group we don’t belong to). For example, the Americans, French etc. are a bunch of losers!

Therefore, we divided the world into “them” and “us” based through a process of social categorization (i.e. we put people into social groups).

This is known as in-group (us) and out-group (them). Social identity theory states that the in-group will discriminate against the out-group to enhance their self-image.

The central hypothesis of social identity theory is that group members of an in-group will seek to find negative aspects of an out-group, thus enhancing their self-image.

92

So Proud of Pops

by brandnew in

jw
friends

ok so a car pulls up to the house and 3 eldurrs from my dads congo come up.

they come in and have thee nerve to ask me to step out so they can speak to pops!!!!

this is the good part.....pops says...and i quote " whatever needs to be said..can be said in front of my son".

nugget

Good for him. His contribution was significant so no one else felt obliged to dip into their own pockets. Nice to know that money was the sole purpose for their visit.