Posts by Aeiouy

45

Introducing myself

by Aeiouy in

and a third continuation........meh.

however, breaking up with her had a very good affect on me.

an unexpected one.

So I need some help. Suggestions, ideas, etc. I spoke with this girl about my posts, and sent her an email with the link. She read it and sent me a very heartfelt email in reply. One of the things she mentioned was that she didn't think quitting meetings and growing a beard was enough to give my mother the idea. She said it was a cop-out, and was not really communicating. I tend to agree with her. I've had issues with proper communication, and want to start getting it right from now on. @Independant_tre: I totally see where you are coming from. I think with my particular situation though, it might be best to send my mom an email and explain my stance.

So, any suggestions on what to include? Things that bother me are: Beards; Children being slaughtered by a bear for calling a prophet baldy; 1914; 607; Jesus being the mirror Image of Jehovah: Would Jesus have killed children by sending a bear to eat them? I think not. etc.; The GB's infallibility; The GB saying they are not inspired, but acting like a prophet anyway. Anyone every heard of an uninspired prophet? Yeah, they're called false prophets.

How doI express my feelings about this without forcing her to do what she thinks she has to and reporting me to the BoE. Or should I even worry about that?

Again, thoughts, feelings, suggestions. And thank you for all your help. This is really strengthing me to stand up for what I really believe.

38

Science Fiction recommendations

by JeffT in

so i have my daughter (a 33 year old choreographer turned psych student) reading rah.

so far she's read double star and tunnel in the sky, she stayed up all night friday night finishing tunnel.

she's working on the moon is a harsh mistress now.

Aeiouy

My favorite series of all time is by Kevin J Anderson. The series is called Saga of Seven Suns. The first 150 pages of the first book are awful but necessary. After that, it's an amazing series.

My other favorite Scifi is by Ted Dekker. He has some religious overtones that I don't particulary like, but the story is amazing. It's a trilogy, First book is called Black, next ones are Red and White. It's about a man who is shot by the mob in the back of the head and killed, and suddenly wakes up like he was dreaming. He goes about his day, and when he falls back asleep, he wakes up right after he was shot in the head. Good stuff.

Aeiouy

45

Introducing myself

by Aeiouy in

and a third continuation........meh.

however, breaking up with her had a very good affect on me.

an unexpected one.

Aeiouy

@dgp: Thanks for the welcome and the good advice. As far as the questions she asked me, I don't remember. I guess I should add an important detail. I don't think I included this. I still work with her. In the same building. I see her every day. We actually sat right next to each other for at least 6 months. That being said, I will see her tomorrow and will ask her if she remembers the questions. It was basically about what we believe though. I remember trying to explain everything we believe, and feeling so lost because it all sounded so absurd.

>>>>Me trying to explain<<<<

"See there's this one class, m'kay, and it's going to heaven. There's 144,000 in it. We get that number because Revelation says it. And it's literal. Even though nothing else in that book is, m'kay. And then there's this other group, and we don't know the number, m'kay? But it's big, m'kay. And it's called the Other Flock, m'kay. It's gonna live forever on earth. And everybody who doesn't believe us is going to die, m'kay? But I can't actually say they are going to die, m'kay. Cause that would be judging, and we don't really know who is going to live and die, m'kay. Are you following me? So everyone is going to die who is not a JW, but we don't know that for sure, m'kay. And by the way, we can't masturbate because that is self abuse, m'kay. Don't you feel like you're abusing yourself when you do it? You don't? Must be because you're Worldly. Oh, and everyone who isn't a JW is called Worldly, m'kay. But we can't actually call you Worldly, m'kay, because our PR department said we were getting bad rap for that. So we call you Unbelievers instead, m'kay? Also, the Governing Body is God's mouthpiece, m'kay. No no no, not INSPIRED, m'kay. Just a mouthpiece. So they speak for God m'kay. But they are not 'God-breathed'. How does that work? What do you mean? They are a Prophet. No not an inspired Prophet.... No not a false Prophet either, m'kay. Just a prophet. As in they speak for God, but he doesn't tell them to speak. But he does through his Holy Spirit, m'kay. So they're told what to write, but they're not told what to write, they're just told by the HS, which isn't God, see? Are you following me?"

Lol! maybe that will help ya until I ask her tomorrow. What a load of lies.

Aeiouy

45

Introducing myself

by Aeiouy in

and a third continuation........meh.

however, breaking up with her had a very good affect on me.

an unexpected one.

Aeiouy

Wow! I am completely overwhelmed. Thank you to everyone for the support. I really need this.

@outatlast: Her mom is actually one of the smartest people I know. She had dealt with other organized religion and had lots of issues with it. Her mom also had dealings with alcoholic parents, which in a lot of ways can be similar to a cult. She has done lots of research on the subject so can understand somewhat the things I am going through. IT was her mom that purchased the books of Amazon for me. I didn't even ask, they could just see I needed some help. That's true kindness. There were no ulterior motives with her getting them for me. Funny thing is, She purchased the cult book, a book on relationships, and Crisis of Conscience. I knew Crisis of Conscience was 'apostate', so I took the other two but not that one. I am now half way through the cult book, and on page 40 of Crisis.

@Billy the Ex-Bethelite: Thank you so much for grouping the posts together and labeling them 1,2, and 3. I was wondering how people were going to find them. I do have a journey ahead of me, and I've hurt her every time, just before I make a 'breakthrough'. I can see how giving us some time would be helpful. She has been the catalyst though. Every time I've come to a crossroads, she has been the one to help me. I don't think she realizes that completely though. And I will be sure to her how much I think of her. She really has been one of the biggest helps I've ever had in my life.

@everybody else: Thank you for your posts. I have been reading and re-reading them all. It is very helpful to see the suggestions every one gives.

45

Introducing myself

by Aeiouy in

and a third continuation........meh.

however, breaking up with her had a very good affect on me.

an unexpected one.

Aeiouy

@Aussie: Thank you for that. That is actually very encouraging. I know my mom loves me. And I'm sure she still will. This is just a very difficult situation as you well know.

@jamiebowers: I plan on avoiding them like the plague. I know the persuasive influence they can have, and I'm not ok with that in my life anymore. AS far as my brother, I may get in contact with him. We'll see. My dad on the other hand is an abusive ass who I wish to have no dealings with. I cut off contact with him, not because he stopped being a witness, but because of his abusive actions. He was reproved for fits of anger. That should give an idea of how he treated my mother and I. I'm not bitter toward him anymore. And if he died, I would probably go to his funeral, something I would not have done 4 years ago. But I have no interest in being pals with him. I just downloaded Crisis of Conscience. I'll check out the other book too, and that website. Thanks for the info.

@Hopscotch: Thank you very much for the support.

2

Welcome Aeiouy!

by jamiebowers in

i tried responding to your first thread, but i couldn't get a response space to come up.

simon has been upgrading this site for quite awhile, and posts being cut off have happened every now and then.. anyway, you'll find lot of experts about the 607 thing on here.

sorry, i didn't get it when i was a jw and definitely not interested in it now.

Aeiouy

Thanks for the welcome. I had to post three different times to include everything. Just look under the posts titled, Introduce myself. You'll see what happened with the girl. And if by fade, you mean the dark stubble I'm getting on my face, then yes, my beard is coming along nicely. Lol. No for reals though my last meeting was Tuesday. Never again. I don't like people I barely know asking if my girlfriend came or not. Disgusting. Mind your own business.

45

Introducing myself

by Aeiouy in

and a third continuation........meh.

however, breaking up with her had a very good affect on me.

an unexpected one.

Aeiouy

And a third continuation........Meh

However, breaking up with her had a very good affect on me. An unexpected one. I finally could see through it all, and see how this 'truth' has been affecting my life. There is a book that she had given me, entitled "Taking back your life." It's about cults and abusive relationships. I decided to pick it up and read it. This book is not about JW's or the WTS. But if I didn't know better, I would think it was. It describes everything that goes on in this Org. Over this past week, I have seen how much the opinions of men have swayed everything that is taught. Then I found this site. Best thing that's ever happened to me, other that meet this girl from work. After reading things like Amazing's post on masturbation, I feel like a veil has been lifted from my eyes.

One thing that had always bothered me was not being able to have a beard. Where was that in the Bible? I never told anyone from work about it because I was so embarrased. I realize now I was embarrased because I knew how stupid of a rule it is. And then to see how it started with Rutherford's feud with Russell. Ridiculous. So I started growing a beard. :)

I wanted to tell my story because I need some advice. My brother is DF'd, sister was never baptized and is a druggy, dad is an inactive SOB reproved elder whom I haven't seen in years. But mom is still a JW. She doesn't know how I feel. I love my mom. I always have and always will. I need help breaking this to her. I'm thinking I'm just gonna stop meetings cold turkey and grow a beard, and she will get the idea. But I know there are going to be problems and I'm not looking forward to them. She has said she will remain loyal to Jehovah regardless of what I do, which means she would cut all contact off with me if I'm df'd. Any ideas would be great.

Now, I feel much better. I've realized that in order for me to be happy, I do not need my mother's love. But I DO need to love my mother. So I am happy because I do love her, regardless of how she feels about me. What she thinks and believes is up to her, and I will love her even if she cannot talk to me because of JW requirements. I also have lost any feelings of being lost this week. I've realized that I have a journey, and it's ok to not know the answer. For the first time, I actually look forward to NOT being a JW, because I now have the freedom to examine everything. And that is exciting. It is a journey that I am looking forward to, and I think I won't get bored in my travels. My only wish is that my girl, the one from work that I let down again, can forgive me. I hope she can see the difference she has made in my life, and how much she has changed my outlook for the better.

Anyways, thanks for letting me introduce myself. I look forward to any replies, and also being a part of a community like this. Talk to you all soon.

Aeiouy

4

Introducing myself

by Aeiouy in

think i figured a work around.

keep reading.. that was taken directly from the cd.

i don't know what book it is, but it has the initials kc.

Aeiouy

Think I figured a work around. keep reading.

That was taken directly from the CD. I don't know what book it is, but it has the initials kc. Regardless, there was a little bit more on the subject, but in my mind, not a lot. And not very convincing. I found it surprising that the society doesn't have hardly anything on this subject. More on that in a minute.

I had always wondered, if the Gentile Times ended in October, why did WWI begin in July? Wasn't WWI a result of Satan being cast down from heaven, according to JWs?

As most Dub's do who begin to question their beliefs, I said to myself, "I must not have all the facts." We are taught that if we don't understand something, we need to wait, as our understanding will become clearer. So I waited.

Then I found out that the majority of historians claim Isaiah had more than one writer. Deutero-Isaiah they called it. Why had I never heard about this? I went to pioneer school. 2 weeks of intense study. And yet nothing on the subject. Needless to say this was irritating.

Fast forward a month or so, I had gotten extremely involved with this girl from work. We took it "too" far, and my conscience was stricken. I went and told the elders, effectively ending my relationship with this girl I cared about very much. Because it was the right thing to do, and she was Worldly. I was doing the right thing, what I was supposed to.

I should have gotten a clue when I had my Judicial meeting. I didn't know how to respond when I was asked if I made her come. Really, you need to know that? How is that any of your business? I told you I fornicated. Why the hell did they need to know anything more than that. To this day I can't believe I didn't run like the wind after I was asked that. But no, I was the ever obedient publisher.

I was reproved. For a few weeks I had nothing to do with the girl at work. One of the elders told me, and I quote, "You need to look at her as if she is the Devil." So for a few weeks she had horns and a tail growing out her ass. Lol. I believed this? Then I moved out on my own, and decided I didn't want to be a witness anymore. I stopped doing meetings regularly, and started to get involved with this girl again. This did not come easily, as I had lost her trust, and rightly so, as I had dropped her like a sack of potatoes for the 'truth'. But we started dating, even went on vacation together. Things were going pretty good, but I still had doubts about whether I was doing the right thing. I constantly had a feeling of being lost, not knowing what to believe, thinking there was something wrong with me because I couldn't make up my mind and 'do the right thing.' Then I get a call from one of the local elders, who says he wants to come over and talk for a bit. I say sure.

He talked about what I expected, and said a lot of the JWs in town had seen me with my girlfriend. They wanted to know if anything had happened between us. I lied and said no. So he told me that I needed to get my act together because I was going to lose my life if I didn't. I couldn't be walking the line like I was, and they were there to snatch me out of the fire. I was scared. Terribly scared. I genuinely believed I was going to lose my life. Regrettably, I spoke with my girlfriend about our meeting, told her I wasn't sure about anything, including if we should keep dating. That was a week ago. Stupidest thing I have ever done. I have yet to see if she will forgive me again. I hope she will, but wouldn't blame her if she didn't.

However, breaking up with her had a very good affect on me. An unexpected one. I finally could see through it all, and see how this 'truth' has been affecting my life. There is a book that she had given me, entitled "Taking back your life." It's about cults and abusive relationships. I decided to pick it up and read it. This book is not about JW's or the WTS. But if I didn't know better, I would think it was. It describes every

7

Introducing myself

by Aeiouy in

so i've been reading the forums for a few days now and finally decided to register.

must say i love some of the posts on this site.

i just read the one from amazing about masturbation in the '73 watchtower.

Aeiouy

Dangit. I guess I don't have full posting priveliges yet. There was a lot more to this post. It was three times as long. I think I'm gonna write in Word from now on and then copy paste so I don't lose everything I typed. Shoot it took forever to write that too. Wish I knew there was a limit on how long a post could be. I'll finish this post later, but I'm too tired right now.

7

Introducing myself

by Aeiouy in

so i've been reading the forums for a few days now and finally decided to register.

must say i love some of the posts on this site.

i just read the one from amazing about masturbation in the '73 watchtower.

Aeiouy

Hi everyone,

So I've been reading the forums for a few days now and finally decided to register. Must say I love some of the posts on this site. I just read the one from Amazing about Masturbation in the '73 Watchtower. I laughed for quite a while. I could use some advice on my current situation, but first I wanted to mention this. About 10 years ago, my family decided to move to the Spanish language field to help out where the need is greater. I was 13 when we moved, and am now completely fluent in Spanish. Reading, writing, everything. The reason I mention this is I read a post the other day where some were wanting to translate a letter sent to all BoEs but they only had it in Spanish. If you receive any letters and need help with translation, I am here to help. I have worked as a translator before, and currently use my Spanish for work.

Now on to the juicy stuff. I have been of the 'conscious class' for about a year now. It all started with a girl from work. Big surprise. I was not interested in her at first, but as we started talking over the months, I began to like her. One day, I sat down with her, and told her I was not ready to date. I told her I liked her, but was one of JW's and wanted to pursue my spritual career more before I started dating. That of course was not true, I simply wanted to nip it in the bud, because she was Worldly, and that is what I was supposed to do. She said ok, and then asked me a few things about the Org. I answered as best I could, and we went our seperate ways. I should add that I answered all her questions pitifully. I knew my stuff. I have pioneered for 2 1/2 years. Been to pioneer school. Conducted the congregation book study in Spanish, etc. But she asked questions in ways I had never thought of before. Totally threw me off guard. Anways, moving on.

That weekend, I sat down and thought of all the questions she asked. I asked myself why I couldn't answer her questions like I should be able to. I realized that I didn't believe half the stuff I was spouting. That realization didn't come all at once though. It took time. But that following Monday, I talked to her again and said I wasn't sure if I believed everything I had tried to explain. If I remember correctly, we started getting involved, and would go golfing after work. (I'm a golf nut.) As we got more involved, I decided to research everything I had been taught, reexamining everything with new eyes. My motivation was to prove the truth to myself. I was shocked when I found this on Wikipedia.

Jerusalem destroyed in 587 B.C.E........WTF? 587? That's gotta be wrong I thought. I figured I can't trust Wikipedia. So I googled some more, and sure enough, every other source says 587 B.C.E. I asked my mom about it, and she had no idea what I was talking about. So I did some research on the CD Rom to see what I could find. Here is what I found.

{29 However, based primarily on such secular records, some persons figure that Jerusalem was destroyed in 587/6 B.C.E. and that the Jews came under Babylonian domination in Nebuchadnezzar’s accession year, which they calculate as being 605 B.C.E. They thus hold 605 B.C.E. to be the date when Jeremiah 25:11 began to be fulfilled: “All the land shall be a desolation; and they shall serve among the Gentiles seventy years.” (Bagster’s Greek Septuagint) If that were so and the Gentile Times were counted from then, it would put the end of the prophetic “seven times” in the World War year of 1916. Yet, as stated, we believe that there is much stronger reason for accepting the information in God’s inspired Word, which points to the Gentile Times’ beginning in October 607 B.C.E. and ending in October of 1914 C.E.}

That was taken directly from the CD. I don't know what book it is, but it has the initials kc. Regardless, there was a little bit more on the subject, but in my mind, not a lot. An