Quillsky

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Posts by Quillsky

• 
  243

  Let's settle this for once and for all...... is atheism a belief, a non-belief or an anti-belief?

  by Quillsky in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  my opinion is that atheism is not a belief.

  it is a belief in no belief..

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Quillsky

  If someone claims 2 but denies 3, they actually invalidate 2 also, they contradict themselves, because 2 inherently implies uncertainty:
  
  "I don't absolutely believe there is a god"

  Hmmm, so a 2, an atheist who has no belief, is actually an agnostic? No my friend, they just don't have a belief, which makes them an anti-believer (my 3, you messed with my numbers.)

  Yet if they can't also say that they "don't absolutely believe there isn't a God" then they reveal that actually they DO absolutely believe there isn't a God

  The quadruple negatives are doing my head in.... I'm going to bow out here because it doesn't make for fun reading.
• 
  243

  Let's settle this for once and for all...... is atheism a belief, a non-belief or an anti-belief?

  by Quillsky in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  my opinion is that atheism is not a belief.

  it is a belief in no belief..

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Quillsky

  LOL! My mind is in a twist. I'm going to read your post again and see if I can come up with an intelligent response, but for now I want to say, I see the "atheism" terminology issue as having three levels....

  The obvious theo/god thing.

  The belief thing (not believing in something, versus believing that something isn't)

  And the couldn't give a damn thing, which I suspect drives the majority of atheists in their identification with the term "atheist".
• 
  243

  Let's settle this for once and for all...... is atheism a belief, a non-belief or an anti-belief?

  by Quillsky in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  my opinion is that atheism is not a belief.

  it is a belief in no belief..

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Quillsky

  Tammy, if you don't mind I shall use your quote to illustrate the problem I'm exploring here.

  Atheist - no belief in God (creator of universe)

  There are two ways of expressing this, both meaning completely different things.....

  I have no belief in this entity. (Perhaps, I have not given much thought to this entity, ergo I have no belief in it. If one day I give some thought to this entity I may shift into the agnostic category.)

  I actively believe that there is no entity like this.
• 
  243

  Let's settle this for once and for all...... is atheism a belief, a non-belief or an anti-belief?

  by Quillsky in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  my opinion is that atheism is not a belief.

  it is a belief in no belief..

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Quillsky

  So Essan, if someone couldn't be bothered to believe (falling into my "non-belief" category), you're saying that makes them agnostic? I say it makes them an atheist that couldn't be bothered to believe.
• 
  243

  Let's settle this for once and for all...... is atheism a belief, a non-belief or an anti-belief?

  by Quillsky in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  my opinion is that atheism is not a belief.

  it is a belief in no belief..

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Quillsky

  I'm going to try to reword it again. (For "god" also read "gods".)

  Belief: I specifically believe there is no god.

  Non-belief: I don't absolutely believe there is a god.

  Anti-belief: Okay, I realized that non-belief and anti-belief are close to the same thing, once I tried to put it into other words! It's sort of "I don't believe in belief about god".
• 
  243

  Let's settle this for once and for all...... is atheism a belief, a non-belief or an anti-belief?

  by Quillsky in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  my opinion is that atheism is not a belief.

  it is a belief in no belief..

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Quillsky

  Excuse me if I misunderstand the debate, but isn't atheism the belief that there is no God, which is the polar opposite of belief in God?

  The core question I'm asking is summarized here:

  Is atheism the belief that there is no god (or are no gods)?

  Or is atheism specific non-belief that there is a god (or gods)?
• 
  243

  Let's settle this for once and for all...... is atheism a belief, a non-belief or an anti-belief?

  by Quillsky in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  my opinion is that atheism is not a belief.

  it is a belief in no belief..

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Quillsky

  I'm not taking a personal stand here, Essan - it's about terminology. On a forum about religion I think it's interesting that posters throw around the word "atheist" without having consensus on its meaning.

  So in terms of terminology I personally think the word should mean a belief in no belief, but am hugely grateful for other opinions and love grand debate!

  (PS Essan.... Yes I believe I'm agnostic, but that's beyond the scope of the topic!!)
• 
  243

  Let's settle this for once and for all...... is atheism a belief, a non-belief or an anti-belief?

  by Quillsky in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  my opinion is that atheism is not a belief.

  it is a belief in no belief..

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Quillsky
• 
  243

  Let's settle this for once and for all...... is atheism a belief, a non-belief or an anti-belief?

  by Quillsky in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  my opinion is that atheism is not a belief.

  it is a belief in no belief..

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Quillsky

  I don't understand your question. "Ultimate" in what respect?

  Ultimate in discussion terms, whether discussions on definitions of atheism are about god or about types of belief about god.

  To put it simply, I'm proposing that theism/atheism discussions are not so much about the existence of god/gods/no gods (since we'll never know and it's all academic anyway) but rather about belief itself, and the relevance of various states of belief (to a discussion on what "atheism" means.)

  This is a tangent :-) My original tri-part question remains, since I don't want to begin a mind-numbing thread about the nature of belief itself.

  My original question is about the term "atheist".
• 
  243

  Let's settle this for once and for all...... is atheism a belief, a non-belief or an anti-belief?

  by Quillsky in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  my opinion is that atheism is not a belief.

  it is a belief in no belief..

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Quillsky

  What the believer wants to extract from you in this argument is "faith". He knows he's a very silly boy for believing in things without having evidence, and he wants to argue that "see?, everyone believes by faith, even the atheist".

  So is the ultimate issue not whether god exists, but whether belief, in whatever, is futile or not?