Hi Dismiss, I definitely wont be doing that, lol. Thanks for your thought although off-topic. Hi Justmom, Thank you for sharing your story. I feel sympathy towards your situation. I cant say for sure if you are right or not as to your understanding of the bible, but it seems plausible to me. I was reading in the bible about this passover thing and its pretty simple. All he said was to eat the bread because its supposed to be his body that was given up, and drink the cup because its his blood that is poured out for forgiveness of sins. I guess if someone believes in his sacrifice, they do it by eating the bread and drinking the cup. Sounds pretty straight forward to me. I suspect that these JW people must have "made more" of it than it really is. I dont see anywhere where it says not everyone can do it. At any rate, i do believe you might have a good point here. Now if you told the elders in your church and they didnt believe you, thats pretty much their problem, lol. The church, however, i dont believe they know and relying on those elders to tell them might not be a good idea. Elders, like anyone else (especially if they are corrupt) will probably not tell the church or tell them, but not accurately so that you look bad and they look good in their eyes. You remember that time the guards ran and told their superiors that jesus left the tomb? And then they were told to lie? The elders in your church might have done the same thing (i wouldnt put it pass them, lol). Therefore, it would be better if you yourselves told the church people about what you know and let them make their own choice. You can show AND tell. That way they would know and can make their own informed decision. Just like how that Ezekiel character was to show and tell. You too can show them and tell them. |
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Re: Will you attend the Memorial this year? Why? Why not?
by check inyou all had some interesting thoughts on that jw memorial thread.
some of you mentioned that you are going so that you can set some sort of example.
i gather that some of you believe that by going and eating, you are somehow showing them they can (or should) do it too.. that really confuses me.
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Re: Will you attend the Memorial this year? Why? Why not?
by check inyou all had some interesting thoughts on that jw memorial thread.
some of you mentioned that you are going so that you can set some sort of example.
i gather that some of you believe that by going and eating, you are somehow showing them they can (or should) do it too.. that really confuses me.
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Hi everyone,
You all had some interesting comments, many of them i could understand as well.
Hi Justmom,
I am sorry to hear that happen to you. It must have been pretty tough to leave a religion you had all your lives and just because you found some inconsistencies in their teachings, you were kicked out even by some of your remaining family.
I think I can understand your desire to want to keep going back. It sounds like you want others to know what you know. When you go, do you announce to everyone there who you are and why you've come? Do you tell them that they all should partake and that they are "shutting up the kingdom" (as you mentioned)? Do you warn the visitors who are sitting in the audience that they also should partake?
I imagine if you said all this while you were there, they might ask you to leave. Then again, maybe for the sake of your family or others that you care about who dont know, you might think its worth the temporary embarassment. Would you agree that is the point in going, that you should tell them this while you are there?
I looked over that passage you cited in Ezekiel 3. It appears that he was told to go to the people and to speak. From what I can gather, supposedly God talked to him and gave him some words, and he was to go and deliver these words to all the people. I believe the goal was to inform/warn those who were doing wrong so that they can have the opportunity to do the right thing.
I suppose then, it would be pretty difficult for this Ezekiel person to accomplish this without explaining to them "in detail" how they were wrong so that they can make the choice do what is right. I noticed a similarity in your case. It appears that you also seem know in detail what they are doing wrong. I guess my question is, now that you know this will you go and tell them? Will you say in front of everyone who is there and explain it to them so that everyone can have the opportunity to make the right choice?
Thank you for the love, sending love back at cha' (smile)
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Re: Will you attend the Memorial this year? Why? Why not?
by check inyou all had some interesting thoughts on that jw memorial thread.
some of you mentioned that you are going so that you can set some sort of example.
i gather that some of you believe that by going and eating, you are somehow showing them they can (or should) do it too.. that really confuses me.
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Hi everyone,
You all had some interesting thoughts on that JW Memorial thread. Some of you mentioned that you are going so that you can set some sort of example. I gather that some of you believe that by going and eating, you are somehow showing them they can (or should) do it too.
That really confuses me. When you go, do you tell them who you are and why you came? If not, I dont understand how someone who isnt a JW and shows up once a year at this memorial thing, eats, then leaves and expects the JWs to just know (or have already figured out) that he/she came to set some example. I mean, if you were a JW and you saw someone once a year eating the bread and drinking the wine, would you automatically conclude that they must be setting an example?
Also, if it is so important that these JW guys know this, why do you only come once a year? They meet multiple times a week throughout the year. Is there a reason you dont confront them throughout the year? I mean, if this love you say you have for them "hasnt failed," why is it only around memorial time that it this love isnt failing? Where was this love all those non-memorial times they have been meeting together? Would not your love want you to set an example or speak or do something during those times? A friend once told me "repetition is the mother of retention." If what you have to say is so vital, shouldnt you be telling and re-telling and reminding them throughout the years up to and including memorial time?
I personally dont care to go. But if someone wants to go to set some sort of example, I just dont see how he/she can expect it to work or be effective if its done so rarely. If someone is doing something wrong, telling them (or doing something) one night a year isnt going to cut it.
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An Old Argument.... does it hold water?
by AK - Jeff inestimates range from 4 million to 15 million children die from starvation each year on this planet.
that's between 500 and 1700 children a day, depending on what numbers you accept.
still, no matter which numbers you use, doesn't this make you arrive at one of the following conclusions?.
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To be honest with you, AK-Jeff, it seems to be that no one on this board has the answer. This AGuest person and others seem to think they know, but as you can see their arguments (or rebuttals) cant hold water either.
Im not much of a god-follower type, but I can understand your frustration and the point of your post. Basically, if god is so powerful and great, etc. etc., why is he letting thousands of thousands of people suffer and die (an example being starvation)?
Here's my question back to you. Since we all know now that there are lots of people dying of starvation, what are we going to do about it? Why dont we all stop talking about it and get out there and do something about it? We could sell our things, donate our stuff, and give all the proceeds we make toward that cause. Why dont we put our money where our mouth is and instead of complaining about it (not to say that you dont have a valid point in what you're arguing), we do something to lessen the amount of people who are suffering and dying in this world?
On another note, why dont we ask God why he doesnt force all of us and everyone else (atheist or not) who has money to donate (as much as God sees fit) to lessen the amount of hungry people suffering and dying in this world? -
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To myelaine (and Jerry)
by Inkie ininkie keep shining on with the spirit of your lord... .
google_ad_section_end myelaine: (regarding one of your posts elsewhere.
just as a helpful fyi, my moniker here is spelled with an initial majuscule, not a miniscule.
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Hi inkie,
I hope you dont mind me posting on your thread, there was something you said that sorta caught my eye. You said that your lord (I am assuming you mean God) made some sarcastic remarks. From reading your post, your vocabulary seems quite extensive and it seems that there are people on this board are into definitions. So I decided to look up sarcasm and this is what I found. It said something like
"a sharp and often satirical or ironic utterance designed to cut or give pain."
and another definition from dictionary.com said,
1. harsh or bitter derision or irony. 2 . a sharply ironical taunt; sneering or cutting remark: a review full of sarcasms. I can't imagine a god of love making such remarks if his intentions are supposed to be good all the time. What love is there in speaking in a way that is designed to give someone pain? I don't remember god in the bible taunting, sneering, or making cutting remarks against even the devil. i read job, the one you mentioned. god did tell him when he was wrong, but god didnt make sneering taunting or cutting remarks at him.
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S.O.S.
by AGuest inthis is totally out of my usual realm of posting but i really would like some input, please (may you all have peace!).
i have supervised many employees over the years and have dealt with all kinds of issues, except this one... although i know it's not uncommon.
i have a staff member who has the worst halitosis.
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Dear Ms/Mrs (?) aguest,
Why do you have to be so mean? Why do you have to be so sarcastic and passive-aggressive in your response to me? Is this the way you act when someone challenges or disputes something you say or did your lord give you the "okay" to respond to me that way? Is this the way one, who has a position like the one you claim to have, is allowed to act towards people who disagree with them? I don't know if your lord talks to you this way, but if he does or doesn't, would you like him to? Would that be a loving thing to do to someone whom he claims to love?
Just askin...
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S.O.S.
by AGuest inthis is totally out of my usual realm of posting but i really would like some input, please (may you all have peace!).
i have supervised many employees over the years and have dealt with all kinds of issues, except this one... although i know it's not uncommon.
i have a staff member who has the worst halitosis.
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Dear aguest,
Thank you for responding to my post, but it seems like you did not answer my question. I hope you aren't being offended but when I read your posts, it looks like your lord supports you deceiving this guy. What I mean by this is first, you had a problem with his breath (makes sense). Then, instead of telling him the truth of how you feel, you decide to hide that from him (basically deceive him) by offering him candy (I am assuming you were not doing an early trick or treating and happen to come across him). Then, on this board you post your question asking for assistance. People said maybe you should tell him the truth in a constructive way. You go to him and instead of addressing your concerns (his breath and also, now, his illness) you avoid the one and discuss the other. It seems like for some reason you really want to avoid telling him "your truth." Then when you talk to him on the phone, instead of mentioning your truth to him your lord, at some point, had intervened and advised you to not tell him the truth (your issue with him), but instead to see a doctor. I agree (if what you are saying is true) that maybe he should go see a doctor, but I find it disturbing (or even convenient) that not only did you avoid telling him the truth for a few weeks (which is understandable, who wants to tell people that?) but now your lord gets involved and instead of telling you to be honest with this guy in a kind way and tell him to see a doctor, he helps you continue your deceit (hiding your problem with him from him) and gives you a scapegoat to only go see a doctor. My question again is, why would he do this? I don't know the lord to be deceitful, especially for something that could really help someone. Now if you are considering that maybe it wasn't your lord who spoke to you, that too could be a possibility. But I think only you could answer that.
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S.O.S.
by AGuest inthis is totally out of my usual realm of posting but i really would like some input, please (may you all have peace!).
i have supervised many employees over the years and have dealt with all kinds of issues, except this one... although i know it's not uncommon.
i have a staff member who has the worst halitosis.
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Dear aguest,
I am sorry you had to go through that and hope you are okay. I understand that you did not want to hurt this guys feelings by telling him how you felt, but what I do not understand is how you can say your "lord" handled it for you by basically having you deceive him? Why didn't your lord handle the problem for you by you telling this guy the truth? Why did you have to deceive him by telling him you were concerned about his having a sinus problem when the real problem is you have an issue with his bad breath? If this guy comes back fully recovered with bad breath, you will again have a problem with him. And I do not understand how your lord who advocates honesty would advise deception? why can't your lord just tell the truth? In the long-run it will help the guy out because he will know to give attention to his breath (should he hopefully recover) so that he doesn't have to unnecessarily offend his co-workers.
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He Forgives and Forgets!
by wannabe in"{matthew 3:8 niv}.
" {romans 7:15-23 nlt}.
" {psalm 40:12 nlt}.
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Wannabe - If I may upon reading the evidence you presented, your own evidence disproves the point you are trying to make. In the parable/passage you stated above regarding the king canceling a debt, he did not forget the debt. That can be seen in his later statement to the servant in v. 32. Had he forgotten the debt, not only would he not have been able to recall it, but also he would not have been able to use that as an additional reason for putting him in jail (v. 34).