Posts by jws

69

What if the Watchtower Changed .......

by IslandWoman in

jw
friends

if the watchtower changed it's blood doctrine to one where publishers could do what their conscience dictated without fear of reprisals from the brothers, if they also quit using the two witness rule and said all criminal accusations must be reported to the police, if they stopped shunning, if they said all df and da'd could associate with their friends and family, if they apologized to ray franz and all others who were hurt by their policies; would exjws respect their dogma and refrain from putting down their religious beliefs to their faces?.

this is an important question, more important than you know.

iw

jws

Like others said, the issues you presented are not the whole picture. There are many doctrinal lies and twists they are guilty of. And there is a lot of behavioral conventions that are none too healthy either. Overall, those steps would make them a lot more mainstream. Sure, they would still have their idiotic beliefs about Bible interpretation, but so do other groups like Mormons, Catholics, etc.

Fact is, I have a problem with most of the beliefs of organized religion. If I knew more about those beliefs, I'd be able to ridicule them too. I just happen to know more about JWs because I was one for over 20 years. And while I respect people's right to believe what they will, for the most part, I don't ridicule them or put them down to their face. I may speak of how dumb some religious belief is, but in general, when speaking to a believer, I'm not going to try to make them feel dumb for believing what they do.

On the other hand, when somebody engages me, and tries to push that belief down my throat, then I am going to come out and point out how dumb their belief is. And, unlike most religions, JWs are trying to do that. My JW family members try to do it. They come to my door trying to do it.

For me, they not only need to clean up their extremist practices, but stop their preaching work. And, they'd need to stop giving off that elitist vibe that they have the one true faith and all other forms are invalid. They need to be accepting that more than one religion can lead to God. If they do those things, then I can accept them on equal footing with all the other religions out there.

18

Sword of Jah: Re:Omitted Scriptures - NWT has no footnote explanations.Why?

by AwakenedAndFree in

jw
friends

dear sword of jah:.

the watchtower society omitted the following scriptures from their new world translation bible without a footnote explanation to readers explaining the reason of omission.

here are the missing scriptures - i'am referring only to the ones i know - there may be more: .

jws

Yes, The Watchtower offers 2 versions of the Bible: The larger version NWT Bible has footnotes, and the smaller NWT version Bible, which is used mostly in your field service has no footnotes. That makes the smaller version an incomplete Bible. Is that hard to understand?

Not to defend JWs, but I think this argument is silly and IS hard to understand. "The Bible" is the originally penned ancient text (or translations of it), not extraneous materials. As long as it contains the Bible texts, it's a complete Bible. It may lack the fancy extras like footnotes, references, and other additional information, but that doesn't make it an incomplete Bible. That's like saying it's incomplete if it doesn't have a black leather cover. Or that a car isn't a complete car because it doesn't have a CD player and others do.

9

Number Trick "No calculators"

by JH in

jw
friends

jws

Tried it twice, got 4100 each time.

The second one is so simple. If you work it out in algebraic terms, it basically comes out to 100x + (2003 - year born), where x is the number you picked. And you either use 2002 or 2003 depending on whether you've had your birthday yet. So, 2003-year born is your age, obviously. Multiply some digit by 100 and add it to your age, you get a 3-digit number that starts with that digit and ends in your age. No magic here. Been seeing these for years. The 1752/1753 you add on keeps going up every year.

69

Did you know anyone who commited suicide in the org?

by JH in

jw
friends

back in 1991, a young brother maybe 18 years old living next to my place committed suicide.

his father expected him to be very zealous just like he was, but the son never wanted to be like that.

he was always controlled by his father.

jws

My sister's sister-in-law (her husband's bro's wife) committed suicide some time in the late '70's, leaving behind 2 young children (probably both under age 6). I think it was a drug overdose (as in too many sleeping pills, not like heroin or cocaine). I was probably around 10 at the time and I don't remember too many of the details. The official family story was that she had mental problems. Now that I'm older, I'm wondering whether they weren't JW and/or husband (or both) problems. She always seemed so nice and sweet and very pretty and I was very sad for her and sorry for her children.

According to my neice (the children's cousin), the older one, the boy, wound up at bethel. The other, in the words of my cousin, wound up a slut and slept with half the guys her age in town.

25

Is heavy metal demonized? YOUR vote counts!

by czarofmischief in

hyah!.

so, since i left the borg, i've been exploring all kinds a cool stuff that i wasn't allowed to do.

rated r movies, blood sausages, rap music, wearing my hat backwards, patriotism, sex.. so, you know how the society and other fundies are always saying that heavy metal is the tool of the devil?

jws

Heavy metal is merely an art form, consisting of electric guitars and drums. That's just sound. Nothing about that is demonic as far as I'm concerned.

But, with any music, it all depends on the lyrics and possibly what the bands performing the music are into. I've seen heavy metal albums with incredible amounts of pagan or satanic imagery. And that goes for more than cover art, it's also be in the songs.

I personally believe in a God and a Satan. Who's to say what could be "satanic"? Is encouraging non-biblical values satanic? I know I'm probably going to come off sounding pretty "fundie" here - and I'm really not - but, lots of things could be considered demonic. If you assume there is a Satan, does he need to turn you into an all-out worshiper of evil, or just turn you away from God? Could an ad for an SUV or some other luxury be used to make you lust after material things and turn away from spiritual things? Could credit card debt be a tool to make you worry and stressed and work more hours? Does Harry Potter condition you to be OK with witches and spells?

Hey, I'm not saying you're going to turn into a satan worshipper and hurt people for doing any of these things. It's all in how it affects you and how you view these things. I think it's a matter of conscience. And I do listen to old heavy metal (not too into speed metal), I do get caught up by advertising for luxuries, and I did enjoy Harry Potter and Lord of the Rings. And I've even been to things at a Pagan community center where many people are into spiritism (though I'll admit it did make me feel uncomfortable). Yet I still believe in God and don't feel those things have altered my faith..

36

What do you think of Baha'i Faith?

by Eyebrow2 in

just a little curious....i had gone to one of the websites i found by searching baha'i faith online.. i found a site that wrote on 9/12/01 saying:.

the destruction of the trade towers and the attack on the pentagon and its related events should be considered a terrible warning for the safety, security and salvation of humankind.. the second international baha'i council condemns the use of terrorism and violence as a means of change, but we have tried to warn the people of new york for years of these coming disasters, accurately predicting on national television the first act of terrorism against the trade towers in february of 1993. these acts of horrific destruction are only the beginning if the governments and peoples of the world do not submit to the authority of god and his messengers and their clear and evident proofs.. what is up with that???

i know nothing really about it so i figured i would pose the question on this board: is this religion a bit fanatical?

jws

I knew 2 Baha'i followers. Strangely enough, both with the same first name, Tahirih. When I met the second one and pronounced her name correctly, she was surprised and I told her I knew another Tahirih. She gave me 2 choices, Tahirih XXX or Tahirih YYY. Turns out they knew each other from the Baha'i faith.

I don't remember whether it was in talking to them or elsewhere (if elsewhere, I can't imagine where). But the impression I got was that whenever the Baha'i faith had a new leader, he basically defined or redefined the religion. So, one day you could believe one thing and then some new spiritual leader takes over, decides something else and you have to start following that. I suppose that's no different than the Pope or the Governing Body. But, I got the impression things tended to change more drastically from leader to leader in the Baha'i faith.

I also know they do a fast once a year that lasts several days. Just another tidbit.

By the way, both were very nice people. I caught no hint of extremism. They seemed peaceful.

6

Structure of the Society

by kgfreeperson in

can anyone direct me to a source for understanding how the organization is structured?

how is the president selected, the governing board?

what is the relationship of the congregations to brooklyn.

jws

I am getting the impression that the rank and file have little knowledge or interest in the society except as a sort of amorphous "they." Is this true?

It was for me. We heard stories about bethel workers and printing presses, but aside from that, I never really had a clue as to who was on the governing body. I didn't know who wrote the books, how the magazine topics were selected, what interaction the governing body had with the publications, etc. None of it. Didn't really care either. Now that's not true of everyone. Some were very into it all. Knew all the governing body members, sometimes even knew when they were ill. Personally, those people seemed to be the type who wanted to impress you, as if they were part of some "in crowd". To me, the rank and file wasn't supposed to be concerned with men. In retrospect, I should have been more concerned. When I finally read Crisis of Conscience, it was fascinating on the one hand, just to see how all of it works. Some of it shocked me that it was so "human". I don't know what I had in mind, but I was a faithful JW. Had some vague picture of a group of men in perfect harmony, doing lots of studying and praying and agreeing with each other. HA!

16

?I NEVER , ever, thought I would say this....

by azaria in

jw
friends

mb: .

for the past week or so my mind has been going a mile a minute.

ill be at work, in bed, wherever, things come into my head, and i have to write it down that very moment.

jws

I too have thought about this. I do believe in creation, but what defines a species? DNA. But, everyone and everything's DNA is slightly different. When are the DNA structures of two different things unlike enough to call it a different species? Since science seems to say the code to produce an organism is in it's DNA, the facts seem to say that DNA can change and mutate. We see it all the time. Organisms that are more resilient to the things we try to kill them with, plants that can live on less water, etc. That, to me, is evolution. To some, it may still be a cockroach or a tomato, but it does not have the same blueprint as those before it.

Did God create species and then let them evolve from there? Perhaps. Did he create man? I tend to think so.

But there's so much of the Genesis story that doesn't seem to jive - at least not with the remnants of my JW upbringing. What about dinosaurs? Did God create them to die off? A friend of mine was involved with a religion that believes that dinosaurs were part of a past world on this planet, that God wiped clean and started over, creating the creatures we know today - and that's where Genesis starts. Then too, the Genesis account of the Flood also doesn't seem plausible. Can every species possibly fit into one vessel of those dimensions? And if they could, then what happened afterwards? Why are there species limited to only certain areas of the world, like koala bears? What, after the flood, they swam over to australia, leaving none behind to inhabit other areas? If the ark story is true, then it would seem that not all species could have been aboard and that our great varieties of life have evolved since.

By the way, I don't know the exact percentage, but from what I remember hearing, most life as we know it is shares a high percentage of DNA that is identical. Maybe not all 99%, but from what I remember, it's a pretty high 90's percentage. So if we are 99.4% identical to chimps, that .6% must still leave room for a LOT of differences.

12

Did anyone else think that Sept 11 was Armageddon?

by Freedomrules in

jw
friends

i was in washington at the time (i work for the govt) when the attack occurred.

i had a massive panic attack at first and then steeled myself and worked through the night as part of our emergency response team.. i was embarassed by my reaction.

did anyone else have a similar experience?

jws

Not for a moment. Even as a JW, I thought it would be more of an attack from God, not a few planes that were obviously a terrorist attack by men. Armageddon was supposed to be God or Jesus destroying the wicked. And I remember something about it being over "in the twinkling of an eye". A few planes can hardly be mistaken for an event of such "biblical" proportions.

17

They lost 7 bible studies

by caballoSentado in

jw
friends

hi friends, .

i just found out that one of the persons i talked to about the un scandal and .

the wtbs hypocrisy, a very good & loving person, a real christian, has cancelled .

jws

I hope she has not simply abandoned these people and excused herself from this study. I hope she explained her reasons for discontinuing the study and helped her students to see what she does.. Otherwise they may still be ripe to be taken in by the next JW who knocks on their door. Or by the elders might simply assign somebody else to take over the study. Since their names and addresses should be on the study record, the congregation knows about these people.