Posts by seenitall

79

Chemicals buried at WT Farms (WT ruining the earth)

by doinmypart in

jw
friends

it seems that the wt is guilty of illegally dumping printing chemicals (or as they like to say "ruining the earth") in upstate new york.

read the full articles from the news sites below.. "state officials are investigating chemical pollution found buried at an upstate new york property owned by the jehovah's witnesses organization.

" http://www.therepublic.com/view/story/8e675d204fbf4352ab2cf65086b4b411/ny--buried-chemicals/.

seenitall

When I was there at WT Farm in the 70s I knew 2 brothers who were involved in the heavy equipment dept. They dug graves at the cemetary and I recall them saying they buried many other things including drums. In fact, the farm had their own junkyard where a brother who was demoted due to attitude was in charge. I also knew the brother in charge of the water reseviour and waste treatment plant. I even fished a couple of times in the lake (man-made). The watertower stored the water from the lake (warm in the summer). Just think about the cancer causing chemicals that were spread out and then leached into the soil and then into groundwater. They had to have kept records / samples for all those years. If they destroyed them or hide them it will be bigtime corruption. Everyone who has or had health problems needs to be screened and documented on cancer and other illness.

I can't believe how stupid this all is and shameful, just to save face and cash. Admit how you have wronged, repent and face the criminal consequences.

81

WT Mar 15th 2012 - 144,000 no longer a literal number?

by dozy in

reading idly through this magazine , i read the study article "rejoicing in our hope" which discusses the two "hopes" according to the wtbts ie heaven & earth.. a couple of points were of interest:.

(1) absolutely no mention at all of the 144,000 or rev 14. usually an article like this would be filled with references , but it isn't even mentioned.

it does discuss the "limited number" , but only in contrast with the "no man can number" great crowd.. (2) a much more laid back attitude towards the two hopes.

seenitall

Found another QFR that uses a few catch phrases:

? Why do Jehovah's witnesses take the number 144,000 at Revelation 7 literally and not symbolically as they do other numbers in the book of Revelation?-G. S., U.S.A.
Not all the numbers in the book of Revelation are to be understood symbolically. The seven seals and seven bowls were literally seven, as shown by Light, Books I and II. (Rev. 5:1; 16:1) The forty-two months and the 1,260 days had literal fulfillments, even as will the thousand years of Christ's reign. (Rev. 11:2; 12:6; 20:2, 3, 6, 7) As for the number 144,000 it is reasonable to take this number literally because of its being contrasted with the "great crowd" that no man was able to number. (Rev. 7:9) Further, at Revelation 14:1, 3, we read of Jesus Christ as standing upon the mount Zion together with 144,000 others. The 144,000 would logically be as literal as the 1, making a total of 144,001 standing upon the mount. Besides, why give such a large and specific number if it does not impart information?
Apparently those who have difficulty in accepting this number as being literal are those who believe that heaven is the destiny of all gaining salvation. However, when we realize that only the spiritual seed of Abraham, Christ and those who "belong to Christ," will receive the heavenly reward, whereas the vast majority of humankind will enjoy everlasting life on earth as members of all the nations that will bless themselves in Abraham's seed, then the number 144,000 presents no problem. (Gen. 22:17, 18; Gal. 3:16, 29) Further, did not Jesus state that the number of those gaining the heavenly reward would be small? "Have no fear, little flock, because your Father has approved of giving you the kingdom." Compared to the billions of mankind that will eventually fill the earth, the 144,000 are relatively few.-Luke 12:32.

Note the words - "reasonable", "logically", "apparently"

Other words often used are - "appears", "seems likely"

81

WT Mar 15th 2012 - 144,000 no longer a literal number?

by dozy in

reading idly through this magazine , i read the study article "rejoicing in our hope" which discusses the two "hopes" according to the wtbts ie heaven & earth.. a couple of points were of interest:.

(1) absolutely no mention at all of the 144,000 or rev 14. usually an article like this would be filled with references , but it isn't even mentioned.

it does discuss the "limited number" , but only in contrast with the "no man can number" great crowd.. (2) a much more laid back attitude towards the two hopes.

seenitall

Here is the answer in the QFR 1952:

Questions From Readers
? According to the article "Hated for His Name" in the September 1, 1951, Watchtower, hundreds of thousands of Christians died in the "ten persecutions" starting in Nero's time, 144,000 dying in Egypt alone during one of the persecutions. How can this be harmonized with the Scriptural limitation of 144,000 placed on the number being in Christ's body, and which position was the only one open to Christians during those centuries?-J.A., Dominican Republic.
The article did not class with any finality the individuals that died during these persecutions, but spoke of the results in a general way. Note that a key qualification was made in the case referred to in the question: "In the province of Egypt alone, 144,000 such professed Christians died by violence in the course of this persecution, in addition to another 700,000 who died as a result of fatigues encountered in banishment or under enforced public works." The victims are identified as "professed Christians", not Christians in fact. Many of those persons might have been caught in the wave of persecution, but may never have actually preached the truth or followed in Jesus' footsteps, being only professed Christians. They knew the world they lived in was rotten and they were listening to the message of the Christians and willing to die for it even though not in line for the high calling in Christ Jesus. Many professed Christians today might be willing to die for their faith, but still not be Jesus' footstep followers and meeting the Scriptural requirements for such.

Professed Christians?????

123

JW FAMOUS CLICHE SAYINGS

by strymeckirules in

what saying made it all around the country?.

the ones that were passed around, word of mouth.. for example.

"donations basis proves jehovah is behind the work!".

seenitall

"She's a COW - Circuit Overseer's Wife"

"SAD Speaker"

"Special Assembly Day"

"Speaking the Pure Language"

"We have done all the research for you - don't study anything but the publications"

"Trust the Slave"

"The Organization is our Mother"

"Jesus is the Archangel Michael"

36

Only JWs Can Understand The Bible

by leavingwt in

jw
friends

according to the july 1, 1973 watchtower magazine, only the watchtower organization can understand the deep meaning of the scriptures.

it remains a "sealed book" to everyone else.

as ex-members, it's easy to recognize such a statement for how ridiculous it truly is.

seenitall

Only they can understand deep meaning? Where else? Just look at commentaries, some as old as 1600. Most of the deep meaning of Matthew Henry blows away the current understandings and thought of the current WT scholars. Dunlap, Ray Franz and other old school scholars were pushed out and now lawyers and cut / paste writers have taken over.

9

"Thank God that the end did not come in 1914!

by wolfman85 in

"thank god that the end did not come in 1914!

yes, because if it had arrived in that year none of us would be here.

jehovah is giving more people time to come to his organization.".

seenitall

It is the great cop-out. Many old-timers who are facing death now are worried sick about not making it through alive. The belief that the marriage mate will become just a good friend or nothing in the paradise is very troubling. Depression is real and it is getting worse. Only a handful of talks, articles or brothers give the encouragement and comfort that are really Christian. Just a question - since 1914 what has Jesus been doing???? Oh, that's right gathering more sheep for Paradise - whoops forgot.

29

Telephone Hookup if You Can't be Physically Present at the KH

by Band on the Run in

i keep coming upon references dealing with a phone hookup if you must miss a kh meeting.

in my day, if you missed, you missed and celebrated the fact.

what is the procedure for the hookup?

seenitall

Many sick ones who can't attend are hooked up. But, if you suffer due to mental distress or just don't like seating with people - good luck getting hooked up. Most of the BOEs will not allow troublemakers, fakers or bad attitudes the access pin. Congs are instructed to change the pin and sometimes the dialup number each year. If it wasn't for the phone hookups the attendence in many congs would be 50% or less of the # of pubs.

105

The great unanswered question - WHO chose the Governing Body to serve as representatives?

by cedars in

who is the governing body?.

put simply, the governing body purports to be a small group of anointed men (currently numbering 7) who represent a much larger group (numbering the thousands) of anointed individuals living on earth today.

in nearly every reference to their position of oversight over the worldwide brotherhood, the governing body refer to themselves as being representatives.... .

seenitall

Great question and responses. My 2 cents based on seeing it all over the years:

Inner circle of leaders who groom, test out and appoint others to the group. Mostly branch overseers, District overseers and other longtime company yes men who kissed up to the right upper decisionmakers. They are groomed at HQ in responsible positions, rated, interviewed, wife analyzed and then the momment of decision. You have been invited to serve on the GB! Do you accept? Some have refused by turning down the invitation. Currently there is 1 brother back there at Patterson who is about to get the call! Holy spirit is only due to the act of prayer at the Wed meetings and they being partakers. Broad interpetation of scripture, principle of Acts 15 and other accounts where older men and apostles are mentioned in Jerusalem. They were the oldtime decisionmakers and the current GB has assumed the same position of authority over millions. What heavy responsiblity before Christ and might I add accountability! Welcome to the old boys club (the inner circle).

Similar to the leadership of the Mormons - 12 apostles (they use that term). Catholics in selecting the Pope, many other religions.

All the term governing body means is LEADERS / Decisionmakers. Using the term GB is a softer term to the flock.

165

Your most DISTURBING WATCHTOWER Bethel/Branch experience? (No full names please)

by Balaamsass in

ok.. you 70 plus bethelite members.... this is your chance to share stories!

inquiring minds want to know !no full names please..follow t.o.s.

to avoid borg libel lawsuits).. i will start the ball rolling with week one.

seenitall

Bethel thieves!!! The means used to catch them - endless threats from the morning worship table to setting up with left out wallets with cash exposed. They must use hidden cameras now. Any victims of the thieves?

64

JW Manhattan Project

by Red Piller in

i received this and am passing it on email.

(nyc) area by jehovah's witnesses.

god in this project, too.. .

seenitall

The Mormons even have a brochure they use to show the story of their religion. This year the Listen to God brochure is a copy of that. Comic book instruction manuals.

Love the part about permits, insurance and liability being the pubs own and that they are not representatives of Watchtower. Individual expression! Seems a bit bizarre, but still nothing surprises me anymore. Thought I had seen it all.