Posts by ABibleStudent

16

Crap trying to reason with a Mormon He is asking about the Sabath

by Found Sheep in

nice guy i worked with him for about a year.

he is mormon but every time we were in a place to talk he brought up religion, cult thinking.... he needs to come clean i think.... ripe for the vine of non cult thinking but not an ex-jw so i don't have the upper hand?

is there a coc for mormons?

ABibleStudent

Hi Found Sheep, Have you thought about talking about your JW experience with him? According to Steve Hassan a good way to help a member of a dangerous cult realise that they are in a dangerous cult is to talk about the characteristics of another dangerous cult (i.e., shunning, thought-stopping platitudes, etc.).

You can also read information about applying the BITE Model to Mormons on the freedomofmind website: https://freedomofmind.com//Info/infoDet.php?id=370 .

Have you asked him whether he has read one of Steve Hassan's books or visited his website www.freedomofmind.com? His reaction might be a good segue into how the WTBTS warns JWs to only believe in the WTBTS's propaganda.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

16

Can a marriage between a catholic and a jw work?

by roberto avon in

this topic was posted yesterday on an italian fb page.

i replied that my personal experience was very positive.

of course i have to admit that my.

ABibleStudent

Only if a JW is "Spiritually Weak" (still thinking) and loves their spouse more than the WTBTS.

Compromise and communiation are very important in a marriage. Being a JW married to a non-JW makes it more of a challange for both, espeically if the JW's family is considered "Spiritually Strong" (non-thinking) and either shuns the JW or constantly pressures them.

I know of a "Spiritually Strong" (non-thinking) JW who wanted to date me, but wouldn't only because I was a non-JW and her family would shun her if she did. Other than me being a non-JW, we shared many common interests and beliefs.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

48

Strike 3 for the elderette and me! (???) I never heard a JW talk SO much about Jesus!

by Faithful Witness in

miss k and her friend miss w arrived promptly today.

our scheduled topic of discussion: jesus' claim to be "the way, the truth and the life..." john 14:6 since she was basing this topic choice on the fact that i had quoted that verse, i'm not sure why... she spent what seemed like a very long time, hopping through scriptures that all said that jesus was the truth, the way, or the life.

ok, so we agreed... i kept waiting for her to get to a point, or sway from this principle.. of course, she summed up with scriptures that show how jesus submits to the father, and what does that mean we should do?

ABibleStudent

Faithful Witness - Robert: She asked me if I wanted to continue, and I said I had to think about it. I told her I have been tossing it around in my mind, since the only in-depth perspective I have taken on "the bible" was using that guide published by the Watchtower. I feel that I need a better bible foundation, before I can really discuss things with her fairly. Right now, we have left it open-ended. I told her I would get back to her, and she said she'd check with me later in the week.

HI Faithful Witness, You have been given a lot of great advice how to trip up Miss K and Miss W and increase their cognitive disonnance.

Unless you are able to convince Miss K (and Miss W) of not using unhealthy influence tactics (i.e., switching topics and saying derogatory things about your thinking) or empowering their authentic persona, IMHO continueing to meet with Miss K and Miss W will only increase your frustrations. Since Miss K and Miss W have an agenda to indoctrinate you, you need to take control away from them to keep them off balance.

IMHO limit your meetings preferably to 60 minutes and never to exceed 90 minutes, do not use the "What Does the Bible Really Teach?" book, and confront them on using unhealthy influence techniques. If you can convince them that they are using unhealthy influence techniques, that it is adversely affecting you from studying the Bible with them, and it is making you question what are their intentions in studying the Bible with you, it may throw them off balance and empower their authentic personas.

Faithful Witness - Blondie: Thanks for those references! Great points. I am learning a lot from this lady, and yesterday she told me she is enjoying the challenge, and the chance to defend her beliefs.

FYI the elder who conducted a Bible Study with me also used a similar phrase about how he felt strenghtened by my challenging his belief in an interpretation of a bible scripture. At the time I thought it was strange that the elder would say this to me, because I did not say anything that would challange his belief in Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit, or God. May be an exJW can explain if the WTBTS teaches JWs to say this to bible students as a control technique. If a JWs tells me that phrase again, I plan on asking them, "Did I challenge your belief in the Watchtower and its leaders, or in Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit, and God?"

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

61

CO is chasing me . Meeting him tomorrow.

by Ancientofdays in

this week is the "special week", co is back.. he phone called me this morning asking to meet together.. i replied "i don't refuse people who want talking to me, but my condition is that you must be alone, and we meet in public space.".

he agreed and we will meet tomorrow in a cafe.. .

this week he already met with my wife in the kh, and he told her "i believe your housband is apostate !!

ABibleStudent

Hi Ancientofdays, My suggestions would be to thank him for his concern. Ask him not to talk with your wife without you being present because you are the head of your household. Tell him not to contact you again. You will call him when you want to talk with him. Don''t say anything about how you feel or think.

You might ask him if the WTBTS pays for clergy insurance for him or does he pay for it himself encase he gets sued.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

48

Strike 3 for the elderette and me! (???) I never heard a JW talk SO much about Jesus!

by Faithful Witness in

miss k and her friend miss w arrived promptly today.

our scheduled topic of discussion: jesus' claim to be "the way, the truth and the life..." john 14:6 since she was basing this topic choice on the fact that i had quoted that verse, i'm not sure why... she spent what seemed like a very long time, hopping through scriptures that all said that jesus was the truth, the way, or the life.

ok, so we agreed... i kept waiting for her to get to a point, or sway from this principle.. of course, she summed up with scriptures that show how jesus submits to the father, and what does that mean we should do?

ABibleStudent

Hi Faithful Witness, Good job being assertive. The title for this thread states Strike 3, does that mean that Miss K and Miss W will not be returning?

Have you figured out how to stop a JW from hopping from scripture to scripture or not answering your questions?

It seems like you have gained a lot of experience with unhealthy influence techniques that JWs use.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

17

Hey There...An Introduction to a Married IN nonDub (unbaptised pub)

by HeyThere in

jw
friends

hey there all, i just wanted to take a moment to introduce myself and thank you all for this wonderful site and all the helpful discussions sich a loving arrangement .

my name may (or may not) be tracee.

i may (or may not) live in texas.

ABibleStudent

Hi HeyThere, Have you read Harville Hendrix's book Getting the Love You Want: A Guide for Couples? In his book he describes a technique that he recommends for couples that might also work when combined with Steve Hassan's methods. In Chapter 9 of his book he describes using mirroring, validating, and empathizing to improve communication between couples.

If you can get your husband's authentic persona to think before his cult persona says a thought-stopping platitude, it will help him to start to critically think for himself. How would your husband respond if you asked him the following in an inquisitive and sincere tone of voice when he uses a thought-stopping platitude:

"Well, I can see the positive change in my life and our family, so despite some things thats may be off this is what I believe..." ==> What are those positive changes in your life and in our family? . . . (wait for him to respond) . . . What are those things that you feel are off? . . . (wait for him to respond) . . . Repeat (mirror) back what he says to verify that you understand him correctly. Validate and empathize with his beliefs. Ask him specific questions that you have a difference of opinion and you feel are not a positive change in his life nor in your family. Ask him what the WTBTS would have to do for him to lose faith in it. Mirror what he says back to him and then ask him, "Has he done any independent research to justify his blind faith in the WTBTS?"
Something about how actions of a few imperfect men will not taint Jehovah or his beliefs ==> Ask him what acitions have a few imperfect men done to cause him doubts? . . . (wait for him to respond) . . . Repeat (mirror) back what he says to verify that you understand him correctly. Validate and empathize with his beliefs. Ask him what the WTBTS would have to do for him to lose faith in it. Mirror what he says back to him and then ask him, " Has he done any independent research to justify his blind faith in the WTBTS?"
He has also commented about how jw are the only ones out there preaching, etc. ==> Ask him for more details and why he feels it is so important? . . . (wait for him to respond) . . . Repeat (mirror) back what he says to verify that you understand him correctly. Validate and empathize with his beliefs. Question him about either why he gave you a WTBTS sells pitch or why he feels prosthelytizing is so important. How would he compare it to other volunteer organizations he respects (or you respect). Ask him why other religions that prosthelytize are less attractive than the WTBTS. Mirror what he says back to him and then ask him, "Has he done any independent research to justify his faith in the WTBTS?"

If he says the thought-stopping platitude "Where else shall we go?", correct him and ask him if he meant, " “Lord, to whom shall we go ? You have the words of eternal life." John 6:68. Ask him why he didn't know to follow the teachings and example of Jesus Christ instead of other men?

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

14

Breaking News! Azerbaijan to ban Watchtower Magazines

by raymond frantz in

police and other security services have been handed a list of banned books that they will seek to remove and destroy in raids planned for the future in azerbaijan.the list mostly contains muslim texts and books such as those by dr. said nursi a muslim theologian.

i addition , this list contains .... .

read the rest of the post here.

ABibleStudent

Cool picture! Is that in Azerbaijan?

Too bad about the authorities controlling information. I don't like the WTBTS, but banning WTBTS propaganda is not the solution.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

40

Hello!

by Beth Shan in

jw
friends

is this where i can introduce myself?.

nice to meet everyone.

thanks for your patience while i learn how to post on this new site.. <3 beth shan.

ABibleStudent

Beth Shan - My parents are scared to go out for dinner with me and be seen by the elders in the town they live, but they love to come to me and my husbands house and sleep over, shop with me or go for dinner, dances even in a neighbouring city. They admitted they had a problem with the blood fractions policy a few years ago. My dad said that you would have to be a doctor to figure it all out. And that he didn't understand it. I recently confronted my mother about the "mentally diseased apostate" hate speech and she told me that if it "wasn't on JW.org she wouldn't believe it" she had no idea what I was talking about. Accused me of being on an apostate site. I told her I saw it on Youtube, the whole District Assembly transcript. I directed her to the Watchtower that calls us mentally diseased and she sent me back a text that said that I should read from 1 Tim 6:3,4 and that the bible says much worse things about those who do not heed his word...so I left it alone.

Hi Beth Shan, You are very lucky that your parents are willing to associate with you as long as their elders don't see them being with you.

Have you read information by cult-exit counselors like Steve Hassan's books (i.e., "Combatting Cult Mind Control", "Releasing the Bonds: Empowering People to Think for Themselves", and (his latest book) "Freedom of Mind: Helping Loved Ones Leave Controlling People, Cults and Beliefs"), visited his website www.freedomofmind.com, and/or watched his FREE videos on his website?

You have many options to help your parents to critically think for themselves, such as:

Doing fun activities where they will meet more non-JWs who they share common interests. Reminding them of how much fun they had and who they met to empower their authentic persona to overcome their cult persona.
Overcoming the WTBTS's thought-stopping platitiudes to empower their authentic persona, such as "the bible says much worse things about those who o not heed his word". How would your mother have reacted to you saying "God's word or the Watchtower's word? Have you read Mt 22:37-40? God's word is to love him with "ALL" your heart, mind, and soul to him and nothing is left over for an organization." or "Where in the Bible did Jesus say anything bad about non-believers? But, he did say a lot of bad things about the Pharisees and Sadducees who victimized the Jews."
Learning how to ask simple questions to plant seeds of doubts in your parents.
Getting your parents involved in fun, interesting, and time consuming hobbies that will allow less time for the WTBTS.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

40

Hello!

by Beth Shan in

jw
friends

is this where i can introduce myself?.

nice to meet everyone.

thanks for your patience while i learn how to post on this new site.. <3 beth shan.

ABibleStudent

Welcome Beth Shan, How are your parents treating you now? Do they agree with some of your opinions about the WTBTS?

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

17

Hey There...An Introduction to a Married IN nonDub (unbaptised pub)

by HeyThere in

jw
friends

hey there all, i just wanted to take a moment to introduce myself and thank you all for this wonderful site and all the helpful discussions sich a loving arrangement .

my name may (or may not) be tracee.

i may (or may not) live in texas.

ABibleStudent

HeyThere - He is convinced tht the dubs have helped him become better. That will be very difficult and I will have to maintain that the principles of living in the bible are good - but the cult mentality and lies is not. I am trying to navigate how to do this...not fun!

Hi HeyThere, You are right it won't be fun. It may be tolerable if you think of your actions as empowering your husband's authentic persona to overcome his cult persona.

What though-stopping platitudes does your husband regularly use? If you can learn to overcome thought-stopping platitudes that your husband uses it may help his authentic persona to become stronger. The WTBTS teaches JWs to say thought-stopping platitudes like "Where else shall we go?", "Wait on Jehovah.", "JWs are the happiest (or most loving, most trust-worthy, most caring, most giving, etc.) people in the world.", "The end is soo soon.", etc.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert