Posts by ABibleStudent

54

How do you overcome this JW excuse?

by EdenOne in

during one of those meetings that took place before my jc, one of the elders, who was a good friend of mine back then and used to come up with a few outlandish personal views about some teachings, attempted to counter one of my arguments like this:.

eden - "well, if the truth doesn't change, why is it that what we teach as 'truth' has changed over the years (several examples given)?

how can we dogmatically claim at any given moment that we have 'the truth' if our teachings keep changing?".

ABibleStudent

Hi EdenOne, How about mirroring back what your friend said to you so that he can listen to what he just said, and validating your friend's authentic persona's feelings when he says something that does not show blind obedience to the WTBTS?

What do you think of:

Are you saying that Jehovah has had to correct the coarse of the organization? If Jehovah has to correct the coarse of the organization and the organization says that the GB are imperfect men, then when do JWs know they are serving Jehovah or imperfect men?

In the November 2013 Watchtower Study Edition, the "Seven Shepherds, Eight Dukes - What They Mean for us Today", the Watchtower teaches, "All of us must be ready to obey any instructions we may receive, whether these appear sound from a strategic or human standpoint or not." How would you interpret that instruction? What if an elder came up to you pressuring you to do more or donate more to the Watchtower, would you, if it would reduce your family's welfare? Do you feel that Jehovah would want you to support the Watchtower at the expense of your family's welfare?

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

102

Should I attend Kingdom Hall meetings to discreetly "preach"?

by CrytoJesus in

jw
friends

christians, should i attend kingdom hall meetings to discreetly "preach" to jws about the real jesus and the lies of the watchtower?.

.

i plan to go undercover and plant seeds into them.. .

ABibleStudent

Hi CrytoJesus, You probably were "love-bombed" and most JWs are very nice people. JWs will usually behave like drones when defending/explaining their beliefs. JWs are indoctrinated to research WTBTS's practices and beliefs by visiting JW.org, and not other internet sources.

Non-WTBTS-approved internet sources are controlled by "Satan" (the opposer) and therefore are unreliable. If you asked, I doubt that any "Spiritual Strong" (i.e., non-thinking) JW would visit much less believe a non-WTBTS website in your presence. For fun ask a JW to compare what www.jw.org writes about cults versus what www.familiesagainstcultteachings.org writes about unsafe groups. Ten to one they will not read the information about unsafe groups in your presence.

If they do read information about unsafe groups in your presence, see if they would watch the following four videos: How Big is the Phenomenon of Undue Influence? (2:01), The BITE Model (Behavior Information Thought Emotion) (5:03), What is the Strategic Interactive Approach? (4:21), Strategic Interactive Approach explained 2003 (1:23:23) . Ten to one they would be running from you after watching the fourth one because of two words. Replace those two words with Mormon, Scientologist, Moonies, or another dangerous cult and they would totally agree with what Steven Hassan says.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

22

Tell me what they are thinking or planning to do.

by LogCon in

this is the situation.. ten years ago two fleshly brothers and their wives, [ all are jw's and one is an elder] defrauded an elderly couple [ she was a jw/ he was friendly]out of the possession of their home and property.

one year after that, they took the life savings of the elderly couple and parked it in an account, without their knowledge.

when the old couple found out what happened, the four co-conspirators refused to return anything.

ABibleStudent

Hi LogCon, If I were the JWs, I would try to shelter my money in off-shore account(s) that the Canadian government could not access, I would have my attorney investigate how seriously the local prosecutor's office pursues fraud cases, and research where and when I should move to another country.

If I were you, I would find out what ties the JWs have in B.C., what motivates the local prosecutor's office, what is the range of potential sentences for this type of fraud, and if convicted where would they serve their time. I would use all of the above information to pressure them to make restitution, as well as inform the police, local news media, and KH of their fraud.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

35

Looks like ABC New York got the okay.

by truthseekeriam in

jw
friends

http://appellatecases.courtinfo.ca.gov/search/case/dockets.cfm?dist=1&doc_id=2025979&doc_no=a136641.

12/19/2014order filed.

upon due consideration, the media request of applicant abc news to make a video recording of oral argument in the above-referenced appeal is granted.

ABibleStudent

The appellate's (WTBTS's) attorney had previous commitments, so the oral arguments were re-scheduled from Dec. 10, 2014 to Jan. 14, 2015. If the appellate's attorney does not make another request to delay the oral arguments - which wouldn't suprise me -, I plan on attending.

I hope that more people will attend. If you want the address, directions, parking, and/or email information, please visit either APCM or http://www.courts.ca.gov/2969.htm#tab7341. The email information might be useful to determine availability of seating.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

102

Should I attend Kingdom Hall meetings to discreetly "preach"?

by CrytoJesus in

jw
friends

christians, should i attend kingdom hall meetings to discreetly "preach" to jws about the real jesus and the lies of the watchtower?.

.

i plan to go undercover and plant seeds into them.. .

ABibleStudent

CrytoJesus - The Watchtower is a stronghold to JWs. It's an idol. If I can present factual information to them that breaks their trust in the Watchtower or at least plant a seed of doubt then that's making progress.

Hi CrytoJesus, Presenting information/preaching is not the same as asking simple questions that help engage the brain of a JW to critically think for themselves. Learning how to overcome BITE control techniques would be more helpful than preaching to a JW.

Have you researched any information by cult-exit counselors like Steve Hassan's books (i.e., "Combatting Cult Mind Control", "Releasing the Bonds: Empowering People to Think for Themselves", and (his latest book) "Freedom of Mind: Helping Loved Ones Leave Controlling People, Cults and Beliefs"), visited his website at www.freedomofmind.com , and/or watched his FREE videos on his website?

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

35

Looks like ABC New York got the okay.

by truthseekeriam in

jw
friends

http://appellatecases.courtinfo.ca.gov/search/case/dockets.cfm?dist=1&doc_id=2025979&doc_no=a136641.

12/19/2014order filed.

upon due consideration, the media request of applicant abc news to make a video recording of oral argument in the above-referenced appeal is granted.

ABibleStudent

However you dissect it, it is GREAT NEWS!!! At least ABC News (New York) will be in attendance. I hope that they will post an unedited copy of the proceedings on their website or on youtube.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

P.S. - I wonder if the WTBTS will actually make an annoucement in a meeting not to watch the proceedings, because it would draw attention to the fact that the WTBTS did lose a pedophile lawsuit. It would be a Catch-22 situation for the WTBTS.

102

Should I attend Kingdom Hall meetings to discreetly "preach"?

by CrytoJesus in

jw
friends

christians, should i attend kingdom hall meetings to discreetly "preach" to jws about the real jesus and the lies of the watchtower?.

.

i plan to go undercover and plant seeds into them.. .

ABibleStudent

Welcome CrytoJesus, Preaching to JWs about Jesus and them preaching to you about having the "Truth" will probably result in frustration for both of you.

If you want to help JWs to critically think for themselves, you might have better luck engaging them in conversation at their propaganda carts by asking them simple questions like Billy the Ex-Bethelite did in the thread exJW Psychology 102--How to Ask a Question When Questions Aren't Allowed. If you can help JWs to critically think for themselves then they will be able to decide if believing in Jesus Christ or another religion is right for them.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

27

Steve Hassan's books

by tornapart in

at the moment i can't get these books, they are not available as ebooks and i can't risk having them in the house.

but i have heard so much about them and how helpful they are that i am just wondering if any who have read them can give some insights they have gained from them that would be useful to know.

thanks in advance.

ABibleStudent

For everyone who is looking for an e-book/audobook of Steven Hassan's "Combatting Cult Mind Control" your wait will soon be over. According to Steven Hassan " As of August 1st, 2014, the rights to my first book, Combating Cult Mind Control, are now mine. I am busily working on updating it and releasing it officially as an e-book, audiobook, and paperback, due out February 15th, 2015."

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

28

I am going to pioneer after the holidays!

by snakeface in

jw
friends

yes, you heard right.. as you know, most christian organizations publish and distribute little tracts with their gospel message.

well they also make some that expose the lies of the wt, and explain how it is a cult.

even if people are not interested in the "gospel message" in these tracts, the tracts do a good job exposing the wt as a cult.. now, those of you who are now agnostic or athiests or just non-religious, please keep reading, to understand what i plan to do.... i am expecting to receive $$ for christmas.

ABibleStudent

Hi snakeface, I applaud your enthusiasm. Since most JWs like to do a knock, drop off literature, and run, your time might be better spent enjoying your new car.

If you feel that you must reverse witness, there are cheaper alternatives then buying religious tracts like printing business cards and labels with website names and QR codes such as www.jwfacts.com, www.watchtowerdocuments.com, www.freedomofmind.com, and www.familiesagainstcultteachings.com. Just place the labels on WTBTS propaganda.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

24

Can anyone tell me any narrative of having successfully avoided Baptism while being raised JW?

by SonoftheTrinity in

i just worry for my stepkids about their future that way..

ABibleStudent

Hi SonoftheTrinity, I would recommend helping your stepchildren to critically think for themselves and encourage them to make reputable non-JW friends. Also, your step-children can always say it is a very important decision to them and that they are waiting on Jehovah to guide them.

I would recommend trying some of the following:

Read information by cult-exit counselors like Steve Hassan's books (i.e., "Combatting Cult Mind Control", "Releasing the Bonds: Empowering People to Think for Themselves", and (his latest book) "Freedom of Mind: Helping Loved Ones Leave Controlling People, Cults and Beliefs"), visit his website at www.freedomofmind.com, and/or watch his FREE videos on his website. Except for the first edition of CCMC (printed in 1989), I would not recommend reading the aforementioned books in front of JWs. CCMC is ok because it doesn't mention that the Watchtower is a dangerous cult. You can either checkout these books from a local library, or purchase them in e-book formats or paperback.
I recommend that you watch the following four videos to convince yourself that Steve Hassan's ideas can help you before buying his books: How Big is the Phenomenon of Undue Influence? (2:01), The BITE Model (Behavior Information Thought Emotion) (5:03), What is the Strategic Interactive Approach? (4:21), Strategic Interactive Approach explained 2003 (1:23:23).
If you are financially well off, I would also recommend talking with Steve Hassan or one of his coaches by calling 617-396-4638 about specific ideas to help your wife and step-children.
Learn how to ask simple questions like Billy the Ex-Bethelite did in the thread exJW Psychology 102--How to Ask a Question When Questions Aren't Allowed. You can ask JWs difficult questions by pretending that you did not know how to respond to a question that someone asked you about JWs. Also, ask simple questions to learn more about what a JW's authentic persona loves to do.
Read the threads by Aussie Oz about his son like Thankyou dad, for making me think... .
Learn how to turn-off a JW's cult persona and empower a JW's authentic persona.
Learn how to overcome thought-stopping platitudes that JWs use, like why does a JW feel that the Watchtower has the "Truth". Does that mean that other religions are teaching falsehoods? What proof do JW's have that the Watchtower is teaching the "Truth"? Don't accept general answers. Ask for specific proof in a curious tone of voice and demeanor. Or, when JWs say "Where else shall we go?, ask them "Don't you mean to whom shall you go? According to John 6:68-69, Simon Peter said to Jesus Christ. Listen to JWs to learn what platitudes or cult-speak (i.e., "Worldly", "Apostate", etc.) that they use, and then afterwards think how you can overcome it and practise you delivery.
Encourage JWs to independently research subjects they are interested in by using the internet (like making hotel and travel reservations). Once JWs learn how to search the internet and feel comfortable doing it, they may start searching the internet about Watchtower or Jehovah topics.
If your wife attends conventions that are out of town, help her to make arrangements to stay at a nicer hotel away from JWs, so that her authentic persona can decompress after the convention by having fun with you and away from JWs.
Encourage JWs to do fun, time-consuming, non-Watchtower activities/hobbies that they love and where they can meet more non-JWs.

Best of wishes to you.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert