Posts by ABibleStudent

9

CULT CONFERENCE AUSTRALIA - 9&10 March 2012 - by CIFS.org.au

by Fernando in

received the email below today.. http://www.cifs.org.au/conference.php#dl.

http://www.cifs.org.au/brochurecifs2012conference.pdf.

ABibleStudent

jwfacts - There is some great work starting in Australia in an attempt to address the question of what to do with cults. Pity the conference is $461.

To me the solution about what to do with cults is simple, politicians review/revise tax codes to prevent organizations, which can be classified as a dangerous cult, from qualifying for tax exempt status. People can still donate to cults, but those people will not be able to write it off from their taxes and organizations which collect donations must pay taxes on that income. The acid test to determine if an organization is a dangerous cult is to determine whether an organization promotes that members are not allowed to disagree with the organization's doctrines and practices, and that members must shun, mark, and/or not communicate with members, who no longer wish to be members. As long as charitable organizations annually promote that members freely discuss diverse opinions and freely communicate with former members and never promote using behavior control techniques, an organization could then qualify for tax exempt status and other government charitable programs. If the tax agency discovers that an organization is not obeying the rules then the organization is banned from tax exempt status for at least 5 years.

I wish all governments would actively try to remove any financial rewards for organizations that can be classified as dangerous cults.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

92

Febuary 21 2012 We could make a difference,if we want to. A World Wide Campaign sending letters to Govt. officials,newspapers, to Victoria Australia

by smiddy in

this is a sugestion i have to all members of this board ,members from all over the world, to let the victorian government in australia know that the world is concerned about protecting the children of victoria ,and theirby setting a precedent for the rest of the world, who are interested in the outcome of the criminal charges against the religion of jehovah`s witnesses in refusing to abide by the legislation to get "working with children checks"when required to do so.correct me if i`m wrong but i think if all of us sent letters to the newspapers here in australia ,the different members of parliment here,we would demonstate that the victorian judicial system here is under scrutiny to do the right thing in the eyes of the world.. we all complain that the wtb&ts/jehovahs witnesses is a cult religion that sucks,destroying family relationships,here is a chance to do something about it.

whether you agree with steven unthank or not,here is an opportunity to stick up for the children of jehovah`s witnesses and every other child that a witness calls on in their door to door ministry.. what do you think ?.

smiddy.

ABibleStudent

@ smiddy and Azazel do you feel that the following email to Neale Burgess is ok to send. According to what Steven Unthank wrote, I thought that the following email would be complimentary as well as offer a few additional ideas for future legislation.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

[email protected]
Mr Neale Burgess (and staff):
Thank you and your staff for working tirelessly to support Steven Unthank’s prosecution of the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society’s (WB&TS) leaders and organizations for not complying with Victoria’s child protection laws. Although I am not an Australian, many members of Jehovah Witness (exJWs) support forums like www.jehovahs-witness.net , www.jwsupportforum.com , and other forums are very interested in the outcome of these cases.
From my personal experience of being exposed to the WB&TS’s doctrines and practices, I hope that more politicians and government officials will learn about societal costs of dangerous cults like the WB&TS and enact/revise appropriate laws. The WB&TS is a dangerous cult that enslaves members to print and/or distribute literature and is not a religion, as WB&TS's public literature tries to convince potential converts. I hope that the Public Prosecutors Office of Victoria will use its full resources to prosecute the WB&TS leadership and organizations to the maximum extent of the Victorian child protection laws. I also hope that Steven Unthank’s cases will inspire revising (or creating) laws to strengthen compliance with child protection laws as well as revise tax laws to exclude dangerous cults like the WB&TS from receiving tax exemption status or qualifying for government programs for charitable organizations.
Thanks again for supporting Steven Unthank, and protecting children in Victoria.
Sincerely,
Robert

3

What can ex-JWs learn from Harvey Milk?

by zengalileo in

jw
friends

if you haven't seen the movie "milk" starring sean penn, or is you have not seen a documentary or read up on harvey milk, then it'll be hard for you to have an opinion on this.. this is not a "gay" thread.

the fact that harvey milk was gay and was a civil rights leadewr for the gay movement has nothing to do with the point i will make here.. harvey milk when he was campaingning for city supervisor for san francisco and fighting against prop 6 in the mid 70s came upon some marketing research that said, where a person actually knows a gay person, they vote favorably towards gay civil rights 2 to 1. this made him come up with his policy that everyone working on his campaign that had not come out as gay to their freinds and family, had to come out.

i'm not sure if there were any consequences if someone just refused to come out; the movie didn't say and neither did the documentary.. .

ABibleStudent

Hi zengalileo, I feel that your idea would impact many active JWs, however can you think of another idea that would not cause people to be shunned? How about develop a flyer to share with JWs every year (or more frequently) and JWs and exJWs would distribute that flyer to their JW family and friends with anoynomous emails like I wrote about in http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/211893/1/Youe28099ve-Got-Mail-TM. Another idea might be to schedule apostofests and for shunned exJWs to visit local KHs, assemblies, or conventions for half an hour or less every year, and then exit as a group (sort of like a flashmob exit dance).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YuIuOIcNpgA

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

92

Febuary 21 2012 We could make a difference,if we want to. A World Wide Campaign sending letters to Govt. officials,newspapers, to Victoria Australia

by smiddy in

this is a sugestion i have to all members of this board ,members from all over the world, to let the victorian government in australia know that the world is concerned about protecting the children of victoria ,and theirby setting a precedent for the rest of the world, who are interested in the outcome of the criminal charges against the religion of jehovah`s witnesses in refusing to abide by the legislation to get "working with children checks"when required to do so.correct me if i`m wrong but i think if all of us sent letters to the newspapers here in australia ,the different members of parliment here,we would demonstate that the victorian judicial system here is under scrutiny to do the right thing in the eyes of the world.. we all complain that the wtb&ts/jehovahs witnesses is a cult religion that sucks,destroying family relationships,here is a chance to do something about it.

whether you agree with steven unthank or not,here is an opportunity to stick up for the children of jehovah`s witnesses and every other child that a witness calls on in their door to door ministry.. what do you think ?.

smiddy.

ABibleStudent

Hi Smiddy. I don't feel that posting Steven's letter in another thread would interest other members of JWN. I feel that a lot of ex-JWs are very apathetic and burnt out about helping others. I sometimes wonder how people who were so passionate about helping people by going D2D to get into paradise for 10 to 20 hrs a month for years, will not spend 2 hrs to mail 5 to 20 short letters/emails to thank politicians/officials for helping Steven Unthank to prosecute the WTBTS. Steven Unthank spent about an hour typing his email to me in addition to working, prosecuting the WTBTS, updating www.jwNews.net, and writing to other people.

I would suggest that people continue to post who they write to and what they write to in this thread so that this thread is continually bumped to the top of the most active list. I feel showing others how easy it is to be involved, may inspire others to get involved.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

25

New Member-Enda 75-Confused

by enda75 in

jw
friends

i have only been on this site for few hours so i'm just learning how things work.

thank's zid for the advice of starting a new thread.

my sister is scary21.

ABibleStudent

Welcome ((((((((((enda75)))))))))) to JWN. Isn't it amazing how easy it was for you to recognize that you were raised in a cult and how difficult it would be for your mother to come to that same conclusion by watching the same video. You may noticed the affects of being raised in the WTBTS cult evern more over time.

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

56

Hi - I'm new here!

by Flicka in

jw
friends

i have been lurking on this site for the past 2 months.

for the past few years i have been going to the meetings and doing fieldservice out of guilt.. my husband (twisty) told me regularly i only do it out of guilt but i denied it and said it i want to do these things because i love jehovah and it is the right thing to do, but how can it be the right thing if you don't feel welcome and it feels like everyone is judging you the moment you walk into the kingdom hall.. it has taken a few years and a lot of tears to open my eyes.. over the past few years twisty spoke to me about the various things he didn't agree with but it just went over my head.

a few months ago we were lying in bed and he brought up his concerns again, and i'm not sure what was different this time but i understood and agreed with the points he was making.

ABibleStudent

Welcome (((((((Flicka)))))) to JWN and I am very glad that Twisty and you survived your awakening together. I wish you and Twisty the best in your fade from the WTBTS. If you want to read more about how to effectively communicate with your JW family and friends, I hope that you read Steve Hassan's books (i.e., "Combatting Cult Mind Control" and "Releasing the Bonds: Empowering People to Think for Themselves").

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

92

Febuary 21 2012 We could make a difference,if we want to. A World Wide Campaign sending letters to Govt. officials,newspapers, to Victoria Australia

by smiddy in

this is a sugestion i have to all members of this board ,members from all over the world, to let the victorian government in australia know that the world is concerned about protecting the children of victoria ,and theirby setting a precedent for the rest of the world, who are interested in the outcome of the criminal charges against the religion of jehovah`s witnesses in refusing to abide by the legislation to get "working with children checks"when required to do so.correct me if i`m wrong but i think if all of us sent letters to the newspapers here in australia ,the different members of parliment here,we would demonstate that the victorian judicial system here is under scrutiny to do the right thing in the eyes of the world.. we all complain that the wtb&ts/jehovahs witnesses is a cult religion that sucks,destroying family relationships,here is a chance to do something about it.

whether you agree with steven unthank or not,here is an opportunity to stick up for the children of jehovah`s witnesses and every other child that a witness calls on in their door to door ministry.. what do you think ?.

smiddy.

ABibleStudent

I sent an email to Steven Unthank asking him what politicians he would recommend contacting and how to write to them. I thought that it would be a good idea to ask an expert in the case who were the best people to contact and how to phrase the emails. It appears that Steven Unthank is in agreement with recent posts by smiddy and Azazel about thanking politicians/prosecutors for the work that they have done. Here is my email to Steven Unthank:

From: Robert
To: Steven Unthank <[email protected]>
Sent: Sunday, January 1, 2012 12:30 PM
Subject: Happy 2012 New Year!! Hi Steven, Happy 2012 New Year and I hope that you are successful in prosecuting your cases against the Watchtower in 2012. I was wondering which Victorian politicians you would recommend writing to about either enforcing Victorian child protection laws, about the Public Prosecutor of Victoria taking over your cases and retaining you as a subject matter expert, about reviewing how effective the current laws are, and how to strengthen those laws by requiring all organizations to immediately notify the police when laws are broken. I am asking you because of your knowledge and experience with the Victorian government and because some members on a forum that I visit requested that everyone start writing news organizations, politicians, and prosecutors about exposing the Watchtower's abuses in the thread: http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/219999/1/Febuary-21-2012-We-could-make-a-difference-if-we-want-to-A-World-Wide-Campaign-sending-letters-to-Govt-officials-newspapers-to-Victoria-Australia. May you and the children in Victoria, Australia have a very Happy 2012,
Robert

Here is Steven's response to my email that I'm posting. I replied to Steven's email and I obtained his permission to post his email on JWN. Steven is very concerned about not jeopardizing the cases, so I want to make it very clear that I asked for his help to insure that any letter writing to promote prosecution of the WTBTS does not backfire and hurt those cases.

From: Steven Unthank <[email protected]>
To: robert
Sent: Monday, January 2, 2012 7:29 PM
Subject: Re: writing to politicians Robert,

I followed the link you sent me and read through the forum posts on writing to politicians about the current court case and I understand the interest that many people have in the case.

Firstly, politicians are prevented from commenting on cases before the courts and protocol prevents them from getting involved once a court case commences. Also keep in mind that Victorian politicians represent Victorian citizens only.

Secondly, the Office of Public Prosecutions and the Director of Public Prosecutions have a strict code of conduct and practice (and laws) that prohibit them from entering into discussion about cases they are prosecuting. At present they are officially acting as "facilitator" in relation to the cases and are not yet actually prosecuting them so they can not make any comments in relation to cases they are not prosecuting. Either way they rarely comment, except through their media office.

I have received emails from people informing me that they have contacted the following people and shared their thoughts:
Someone suggested that residents of Australia who have concerns about what is going on in their community should write (not email) to all of their State Senators and request that the senate hold a public inquiry into [the cause of their concern] and that they would like to make a submission to such a senate inquiry.

http://www.aph.gov.au/senate/senators/homepages/index.asp?sort=state Some people have suggested that Victorian citizens personally written to the Victorian Child Safety Commissioner, Bernie Geary, and have asked him why he did nothing to protect the children within the religion of Jehovah's Witnesses, as it was his responsibility and he has fully known about the situation since late 2008.

http://www.kids.vic.gov.au/contact.htm A few people have left comments on Derryn Hinch's web site or written to him.

http://www.humanheadline.com.au/

http://www.humanheadline.com.au/Your-Say/Question-2#reply Some have written to the Herald Sun newspaper which first covered the story.

[email protected] On the other hand, I do have a list of politicians and officials who have helped out, even if in a small way, in relation to my campaign or case. It would be nice to send these people a thank you email for their tireless work and in trying to protect the children in the Victorian community.

These are members of parliament are:

Neale Burgess and staff (helping regularly since 2008)
http://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/members/id/1629

Premier Ted Baillieu (helping since Dec. 2009 following his election win. Also set up the Protecting Victoria's Vulnerable Children inquiry in which Steven Unthank made his public verbal submission on breaches of the law by Jehovah's Witness) http://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/members/id/58

Attorney-General Robert Clark (wrote letter confirming that the Jehovah's Witnesses were notified of their obligations under the Working with Children law by the Department of Justice)
http://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/members/id/75

Colleen Hartland and staff (made official complaint to the police over the failure of the Jehovah's Witnesses to comply with the laws and questioned government officials over what measures they are taking to protect the Jehovah's Witness children)
http://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/members/id/1682

Frank McGuire (recommended that Steven Unthank make a submission to the Protecting Victoria's Vulnerable Children inquiry )
http://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/members/id/1728

Andrew Katos (offered continual support)
http://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/members/id/1713

James Merlino (offered continual support and spoke to government department heads over why nothing is being done to enforce to child protection laws.)
http://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/members/id/1579

Russell Northe (ongoing support which included letter writing to members of parliament over child protection.)
http://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/members/id/1693

Steven Unthank

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

35

New here, need support: I wrote an open letter regarding my issues with JWs

by exjehovah in

jw
friends

i'm new, but i have been acquainted with your site before.

i'm a 40 year old female with a family knee deep in the jw religion.

i left when i was 18 and never looked back, but the majority of my family is still in.

ABibleStudent

exjehovah - This site is bookmarked and I will post in this thread and others. I am also trying to create an arsenal of facts just for my own reference regarding the UN, blood, 144,000, 1914, disfellowshipping, the founding members of the organization, etc

Hi exjehovah, Have you read Raymond Franz's books (i.e., "Crisis of Conscience" and "In Search of Christian Freedom")? I can also recommend visiting www.jwfacts.com, www.watchtowerdocuments.com, and www.freeminds.org and many others for morte information about the WTBTS. Here is a video of Raymond Franz:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6c6I0fjiYNU

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

35

New here, need support: I wrote an open letter regarding my issues with JWs

by exjehovah in

jw
friends

i'm new, but i have been acquainted with your site before.

i'm a 40 year old female with a family knee deep in the jw religion.

i left when i was 18 and never looked back, but the majority of my family is still in.

ABibleStudent

Welcome ((((((((exjehovah))))))))) and ((((((((((((enda75))))))))))) to JWN. I hope and pray that you keep on posting anoynmously on JWN and under no circumstances disagree with WTBTS doctrines with JW friends and family, unless you want to be shunned (Watchtower, Study Edition, July 15, 2011).

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert

92

Febuary 21 2012 We could make a difference,if we want to. A World Wide Campaign sending letters to Govt. officials,newspapers, to Victoria Australia

by smiddy in

this is a sugestion i have to all members of this board ,members from all over the world, to let the victorian government in australia know that the world is concerned about protecting the children of victoria ,and theirby setting a precedent for the rest of the world, who are interested in the outcome of the criminal charges against the religion of jehovah`s witnesses in refusing to abide by the legislation to get "working with children checks"when required to do so.correct me if i`m wrong but i think if all of us sent letters to the newspapers here in australia ,the different members of parliment here,we would demonstate that the victorian judicial system here is under scrutiny to do the right thing in the eyes of the world.. we all complain that the wtb&ts/jehovahs witnesses is a cult religion that sucks,destroying family relationships,here is a chance to do something about it.

whether you agree with steven unthank or not,here is an opportunity to stick up for the children of jehovah`s witnesses and every other child that a witness calls on in their door to door ministry.. what do you think ?.

smiddy.

ABibleStudent

Hi Azazel. Please post your letter to help others to write their own. Also, how should a foreigner (me) politely ask a Victorian politician/official to influence the Public Prosecutors Office of Victoria to take over cases from Steven Unthank. I was thinking of writing something like:

Dear politician/official:
I respectfully request that you influence John Champion SC, Director of Public Prosecution of Victoria to have the Public Prosecutors Office of Victoria to take over prosecution of 5 cases from Steven Unthank versus the Watchtower Bible & Track Society (WB&TS) in the Latrobe Valley Magistrates' Court of Victoria in Gippsland, Australia and retain Steven Unthank as a subject matter expert. Although I am an American citizen and do not wish to adversely influence Australian politics and prosecutions, I feel compelled as a Christian to respectfully request Australian Authorities to expose the WB&TS as the dangerous international cult that it is.
Two years ago I was almost deceived into believing that the WB&TS was a religion, but now I believe that the WB&TS is a dangerous publishing and distribution cult that enslaves its members with thought reform techniques to almost completely control their thoughts and behaviors. . . .

Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

Robert