Here the closest I can come to celebrating his coronation with the redeemed.
Vanderhoven7
JoinedPosts by Vanderhoven7
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69
Did Jesus COME with the clouds of heaven in 1914?
by Fisherman intake for example revelation 21: 10. .
“….and he showed me the holy city jerusalem coming down out of heaven from god.
here john sees something happening, action.
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At what point, does one become apostate to the religion of Jehovah's Witnesses?
by Vanderhoven7 inat what point does a jehovah’s witness cease to be a jehovah’s witness?
what if a witness doesn't believe some of the official teachings of the governing body but remains silent on these subjects to avoid being disfellowshipped?
is he or she an apostate to the faith?
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Vanderhoven7
"Just reporting, not supporting ", is a great turn of phrase.
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33
At what point, does one become apostate to the religion of Jehovah's Witnesses?
by Vanderhoven7 inat what point does a jehovah’s witness cease to be a jehovah’s witness?
what if a witness doesn't believe some of the official teachings of the governing body but remains silent on these subjects to avoid being disfellowshipped?
is he or she an apostate to the faith?
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Vanderhoven7
Thank you Blondie for the excellent quotes showing the Faithful Slave has the authority to judge who gets eternally destroyed.
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69
Did Jesus COME with the clouds of heaven in 1914?
by Fisherman intake for example revelation 21: 10. .
“….and he showed me the holy city jerusalem coming down out of heaven from god.
here john sees something happening, action.
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Vanderhoven7
As for the Parousia...
I can hardly wait for that day! And by faith imagination I visualize it often. Picture it with me if you will; imagine the trumpet of the Lord sounding - and all of humanity being summoned together to witness the most glorious occasion ever – the coronation of the Lord Jesus Christ. We will be so honored; that will be our glory day, our vindication day; For that will be your Saviour, Your Lord and Your God ascending to His rightful throne to be crowned King of Kings and Lord of Lords….to be finally and fully recognized and adored before all mankind.
And as He ascends, if we but turn our heads for a moment, we’ll realize that we’re surrounded by an innumerable company of people, from all nations, countries and languages; a multitude of the redeemed with gold crowns upon their heads, and wearing pure white robes washed in the blood of the lamb. And as Christ reaches the summit; He will stand before the throne of the universe and stretch forth His nail scarred hands to the multitude of saints He has purchased by His own blood.
And unable to contain ourselves we will shout:
“ALL HAIL THE POWER OF JESUS NAME, LET ANGELS PROSTRATE FALL. BRING FORTH THE ROYAL DIADIM AND CROWN HIM LORD OF ALL>
AND EVERY KNEE SHALL BOW…..
Oh that will be glory for me.
I look for that day; I long for that day; I rejoice and exult in its contemplation
And as sure as I am writing this to you, that day will come.
Rick Vanderhoven
For anyone interested: I'm giving a 15 minute talk tomorrow, Sunday, July 30th, live on-line on the issue of interpretation: Exegesis verses Eisegesis - starting at 9:30
You can zoom in at
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69
Did Jesus COME with the clouds of heaven in 1914?
by Fisherman intake for example revelation 21: 10. .
“….and he showed me the holy city jerusalem coming down out of heaven from god.
here john sees something happening, action.
-
-
-
69
Did Jesus COME with the clouds of heaven in 1914?
by Fisherman intake for example revelation 21: 10. .
“….and he showed me the holy city jerusalem coming down out of heaven from god.
here john sees something happening, action.
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Vanderhoven7
"Flee to the mountains" when you see the UN (the disgusting thing causing desolation) in the vicinity of "Jerusalem". Jehovah and Jesus are our "mountains" - they are our mountainlike refuge, our relationship with them is a stronghold for us.
Oh please....
You can add to scripture and spiritualize all you want. But the context proves that Jesus was warning his disciples when to flee literal Jerusalem, and literal Judaea and what to pray to mitigate the circumstances of their flight to the literal mountains around Pella. And after the onslaught Jerusalem's survivors would be carried off to the surrounding nations. And they were.
You are claiming that there is a secondary fulfillment to Matthew 24:1-35 which the text absolutely does not support. The temple stones are already removed; the Jews will not be shipped off again to other nations; Jerusalem's severe and literal tribulation would never be repeated (verse 21)
There is no duel fulfillment possible.
When is the last time you brought an extra jacket when working on your roof? When is the last time you prayed your flight would not be in winter or on a Sabbath day? Are you praying for nursing mothers because their mobility will be limited.
I believe that verse 36 and "THAT DAY" signal a change in topic to the second coming (parousia) of Christ. Jesus has already explained what would happen to His own evil generation. Now He contrasts that which would relate to His second coming (parousia) or presence on earth. Notice the contrasts:
Notice the distinctions between
Section I (Matt 24:1-35) destruction of Jerusalem
Section II (Matt 24: 36 - end) Parousia or second coming
__________ __________________Section I Local, Jerusalem,Judea,Temple
Section II Worldwide: Lu.21:35
Section I Abnormal Times: calamities
Section II Normal Times: Marrying and giving in marriage, working in fields etc.
Section I Specific signs precede culminating in the surrounding armies around Jerusalem
Section II No Signs Given, it will come as a complete surprise as it did in Noah's day.
Section I Timing Anticipated Lu.24:33 , they knew exactly when to flee
Section II Anticipation of the time unknown 24:44 It comes as a surprize
Section I About vengeance on Jerusalem, Judaea and this people
Section II comes as a snare on the whole earth
Section I These Days Mt.24:22
Section II That Day Mt.24:36
Section I Flee
Section II No Running; Saints taken
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69
Did Jesus COME with the clouds of heaven in 1914?
by Fisherman intake for example revelation 21: 10. .
“….and he showed me the holy city jerusalem coming down out of heaven from god.
here john sees something happening, action.
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Vanderhoven7
@EP
The “abomination of desolation” refer to the Roman army surrounding Jerusalem that desolated Jerusalem and the temple
But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains: Mark 13:14
Christians were to flee Judaea to escape this onslaught, hoping and praying for favorable weather conditions and timing elements (not on a Sabbath) which would hinder escape.
Luke adds the detail of subsequent captivity and deportation of Jewish survivors.
Luke 21:20-24 KJV — And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh. Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto. For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled. But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people. And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
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69
Did Jesus COME with the clouds of heaven in 1914?
by Fisherman intake for example revelation 21: 10. .
“….and he showed me the holy city jerusalem coming down out of heaven from god.
here john sees something happening, action.
-
-
Vanderhoven7
Jesus knew the tribulation that would come upon His own generation (people then living). He actually explained that some in His audience would not taste of death till the Son of Man would come (in judgment against apostate Israel).
Mark 9:1 And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That there be some of them that stand here, which shall not taste of death, till they have seen the kingdom of God come with power.
He warned the high priest at His trial what he would see in his own lifetime.
Mat 26:62 And the high priest arose, and said unto him, Answerest thou nothing? what is it which these witness against thee?
Mat 26:63 But Jesus held his peace. And the high priest answered and said unto him, I adjure thee by the living God, that thou tell us whether thou be the Christ, the Son of God.
Mat 26:64 Jesus saith unto him, Thou hast said: nevertheless I say unto you, Hereafter shall ye see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven.
Barnes on verse 64 writes: Sitting on the right hand of power - That is, of God, called here the Power - equivalent to “the Mighty, or the Almighty.” It denotes dignity and majesty; for to sit at the right hand of a prince was the chief place of honor. See the notes at Mat_20:21.
Coming in the clouds of heaven - See the notes at Matt. 24; 25. The meaning of this is, You shall see “the sign from heaven” which you have so often demanded; even the Messiah returning himself “as the sign,” with great glory, to destroy your city....
He told the women in His audience on the way to the cross to weep for themselves and their children.
Luk 23:26 And as they led him away, they laid hold upon one Simon, a Cyrenian, coming out of the country, and on him they laid the cross, that he might bear it after Jesus.
Luk 23:27 And there followed him a great company of people, and of women, which also bewailed and lamented him.
Luk 23:28 But Jesus turning unto them said, Daughters of Jerusalem, weep not for me, but weep for yourselves, and for your children.
Luk 23:29 For, behold, the days are coming, in the which they shall say, Blessed are the barren, and the wombs that never bare, and the paps which never gave suck.
Luk 23:30 Then shall they begin to say to the mountains, Fall on us; and to the hills, Cover us.
Luk 23:31 For if they do these things in a green tree, what shall be done in the dry?
As for the time of the end, or the end of the age Clark writes:
End of the world - Του αιωνος; or, of the age, viz. the Jewish economy, which is a frequent accommodated meaning of the word Αιων
Regarding "the end of the world". Henry writes:
[1.] Some think, these questions do all point at one and the same thing - the destruction of the temple, and the period of the Jewish church and nation, which Christ had himself spoken of as his coming (Mat_16:28), and which would be the consummation of the age (for so it may be read), the finishing of that dispensation. Or, they thought the destruction of the temple must needs be the end of the world. If that house be laid waste, the world cannot stand; for the Rabbin used to say that the house of the sanctuary was one of the seven things for the sake of which the world was made; and they think, if so, the world will not survive the temple.
[2.] Others think their question, When shall these things be? refers to the destruction of Jerusalem, and the other two to the end of the world; or Christ's coming may refer to his setting up his gospel kingdom, and the end of the world to the day of judgment. I rather incline to think that their question looked no further than the event Christ now foretold; but it appears by other passages, that they had very confused thoughts of future events; so that perhaps it is not possible to put any certain construction upon this question of theirs.
I realize I'm on shaky ground re the literal nature of the 42 months. But in defense of the prior quoted material I site Barnes:
Shall they tread under foot forty and two months - Literally, this would be three years and a half... it is impossible to show, with any degree of probability, that the city of Jerusalem was “trampled under foot” by the Romans for the exact space of three years and a half. Prof. Stuart, who adopts the opinion that it refers to the conquest of Jerusalem by the Romans, says, indeed, “It is certain that the invasion of the Romans lasted just about the length of the period named, until Jerusalem was taken. And although the city itself was not besieged so long, yet the metropolis in this case, as in innumerable others in both Testaments, appears to stand for the country of Judaea.” -
69
Did Jesus COME with the clouds of heaven in 1914?
by Fisherman intake for example revelation 21: 10. .
“….and he showed me the holy city jerusalem coming down out of heaven from god.
here john sees something happening, action.
-
-
Vanderhoven7
@EP
The synoptics only support that the great tribulation Jesus spoke about would be an unrepeatable local event.
Matthew 24:15-21 The Sign to Flee Jerusalem’s Tribulation & Destruction:
15. When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)
16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:
17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:
18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.
19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the Sabbath day:
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
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Mark 13:14-19 The Sign to Flee Jerusalem’s Tribulation & Destruction:
14. But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains:
15 And let him that is on the housetop not go down into the house, neither enter therein, to take any thing out of his house:
16 And let him that is in the field not turn back again for to take up his garment.
17 But woe to them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
18 And pray ye that your flight be not in the winter.
19 For in those days shall be affliction, such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be.
Luke 21:20-24 The Sign to Flee Jerusalem’s Tribulation & Destruction:
20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.
21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto.
22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.
23 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people.
24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
According to Luke's gospel, the culmination of the great tribulation on Israel would find Jerusalem destroyed, many slaughtered and the survivors led away captive to all nations which happened in 70 AD and will not be repeated at or after Christ's Second coming.
Albert Barnes comments: "Standing in the holy place - Mark says, standing where it ought not,” meaning the same thing. All Jerusalem was esteemed “holy,” Mat_4:5. The meaning of this is, when you see the Roman armies standing in the holy city or encamped around the temple, or the Roman ensigns or standards in the temple." it is time to flee Jerusalem.
Very little is ascribed the word holy in the gospels. God, Jesus, the city and it's temple uniquely qualify. God's holy presence in the temple remained until the death of Christ, when the temple veil was ripped from top to bottom (i.e. from above) exposing the fact that God's holy presence was removed and the temple desolate as Jesus ominous prophetic pronouncement indicated. (see Matthew 23:38)This act of God symbolized the permanent removal of God's presence accompanying the nations rejection of their messiah; Israel's greatest loss made this the worst unrepeatabe disaster possible for Israel. The complete physical destruction of the holy temple (as a witness to the nations) ratified this divine rejection for the entire world to see for all time... to which the Dome of the Rock and the wailing wall continue to attest.
CONCLUSION: The great tribulation had to be a one-time,non-repeatable event in hisory; a fairly local event affecting the Jews in and around Jerusalem and leading to their death or dispersion among the nations. Jesus provided the Sign to Flee and escape Jerusalem’s Tribulation & Destruction: Matthew 24: 18-23 The plight of the Jews who didn't heed Jesus' instruction to flee is aptly described in Luke 21: 21-24. -
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Anthony Morris the III has been FOUND
by Terry innote: photos can be found on the blue envelope channelhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-nakezkhqbmtony and susan morris are living in lumberton, north carolina.
a real estate document on the robeson county website is filed:.
the religious order of jehovah's witnesses has provided a "life estate" for them.they can live in this townhouse until they are deceased or choose to move away and in either case the ownership becomes entirely the property of jehovah's witnesses.
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Vanderhoven7
Ten to one they eventually move him to a more private and secure gated community now that his address is out there.