Vanderhoven7

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Posts by Vanderhoven7

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  76

  Is Tony Morris a Nonce / Pedophile

  by MebyonKernow in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  this has just been posted on youtube regarding tony morris and the reason why he was removed as a gb member and 'relocated'.is tony morris a pedophile / nonce?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ahj9vxygkelet me know your thoughts down below.celtic.

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  Vanderhoven7

  I think their main interest is protecting Jehovah's Governing Body.

  Remember Sheba son of Bicri! (2 Sam,20:21)
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  7

  FACT: The "faithful slave" was personally selected in 1919......

  by BoogerMan in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  .........by the elite in the wtbts, who then became the self-proclaimed "faithful slave.

  " (sans divine interference!).

  as attested to countless times in decades worth of literature.. all succeeding members were then "personally selected" by existing "slave" members.

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  Vanderhoven7

  And none of the original appointees, who were proclaiming Pastor Russell as the Slave, ever claimed that office. It was only in 2012 that the GB realized who was appointed and when. Of course the truth is that Joseph Smith was appointed to restore the priesthood in 1831 when Jesus and Father God commissioned him in a vision.
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  28

  Could this be the end of JWs? What are the consequences if it is?

  by Teddnzo in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  multiple very serious allegations against tony and then huge efforts to remove him from all pictures and videos, have to admit it doesn’t look good.. once the pennsylvania investigation becomes public knowledge and front page news it will be very very hard for 8 million pimis.. is it possible that this could be the largest problem the branch has ever faced?

  larger than 1975, the overlapping generations or any other ‘test of faith’.

  many will feel heartbroken and betrayed.

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  Vanderhoven7

  https://youtu.be/Afo6-Iyj_mk?si=rXVTUQCT3liL4IZC
  
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  35

  Are Elders prepared to take the fall for WT/GB misdemeanor's / crime ??

  by smiddy3 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i have been thinking about this in relation to the directive given to elders to destroy any incriminating evidence they may have either on their pc`s ,e-mails , private notes in their possession, or notes in their witnessing bags ,etc.

  to do with child sexual abuse they may still have in their possession.. isn`t that encouraging the elders to interfere with the justice system ?.

  to break the law?.

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  Vanderhoven7

  Posted Grabt Davis' cautionary comments on the other thread as well...

  "Selena also said that Tony Morris’ match illustration was an instruction to burn her house down. Something she claims has happened to her twice.

  She also said that she was asked if she wanted to help cover up CSA.

  She also said that Watchtower regularly kills people and gets Google to cover it up.

  She says that Watchtower has tried to poison her numerous times.

  I really think that submitting anything speculative about TM3 when reporting the claims of someone who obviously has problems, hampers apostate moves in presenting verifiable facts.

  I have little doubt that this is a woman who might well have been abused, but looking at her weird videos and super extraordinary claims, puts an invaluable slant on the veracity of her claims.
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  76

  Is Tony Morris a Nonce / Pedophile

  by MebyonKernow in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  this has just been posted on youtube regarding tony morris and the reason why he was removed as a gb member and 'relocated'.is tony morris a pedophile / nonce?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ahj9vxygkelet me know your thoughts down below.celtic.

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  Vanderhoven7

  Grant Davis writes concerning Selena's credibility:

  "Selena also said that Tony Morris’ match illustration was an instruction to burn her house down. Something she claims has happened to her twice.

  She also said that she was asked if she wanted to help cover up CSA.

  She also said that Watchtower regularly kills people and gets Google to cover it up.

  She says that Watchtower has tried to poison her numerous times.

  I really think that submitting anything speculative about TM3 when reporting the claims of someone who obviously has problems, hampers apostate moves in presenting verifiable facts.

  I have little doubt that this is a woman who might well have been abused, but looking at her weird videos and super extraordinary claims, puts an invaluable slant on the veracity of her claims.
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  63

  Jerusalem will be trampled by the nations until the Gentile Times are Fulfilled. — Luke 21:24

  by Fisherman in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  jerusalem will be trampled by the nations until the gentile times are fulfilled.

  — luke 21:24 .

  the bible book of luke records jesus prophecy of the last day with his parousia including the verse about the gentile times.

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  Vanderhoven7

  Evidence for the early writing (Pre-70 AD)

  The preface comment to the Book of Revelation in the Aramaic Peshitta version has a comment which would place the writing of the Book of Revelation to the early date, a time prior to 70 AD. The title page of the Book of Revelation contains the following statement: "The revelation which God gave the evangelist John on the island of Patmos where he had been banned by Nero Caesar." The emperor Nero however died in 68 AD, and according to Roman rules those banned by a Caesar would be released after the Caesar's death ... thus, John would have been released from Patmos in 68 AD (or shortly thereafter) and the time when he received this revelation and wrote it down would have been prior to 70 AD. John himself mentions in the book that he was at Patmos, when he received this revelation.

  Internal evidence

  There are a number of points arising from the internal evidence, that is, from information given in the book itself, which all indicate the early date as not only probable but the only possible date for what is stated in the Book.

  Warnings to seven churches in Asia

  The Book of Revelation specifically mentions that this revelation was of special relevance to the seven churches in Asia and that John wrote it and had it sent to those churches by messengers (cp Rev 1:4). It is important to note that during Paul's ministry in the 50ies AD, there had been nine churches established in Asia. At about 60/61 AD there was a large earthquake in which, as we can read in secular sources, the cities of Colossae, Hierapolis and Laodicea were totally destroyed. Laodicea was the only city of these three which was rebuilt soon afterwards, which then left seven cities with churches in Asia. The period of time where there were only seven churches in Asia was only during the few years from the early 60ies AD to the time prior to the Jewish war.

  In order for the book to even be of benefit to the Christians in Asia, it must have been written prior to 66/67 AD, before Vespasian was coming through this area with his armies as they were getting in position for the war against the Jews. Once the war started, the Romans plundered and persecuted the Christians as well as the Jews wherever they came through.

  An interesting detail from the message to the church at Philadelphia (cp Rev 3:7ff) also sheds some light on the possible time of writing. The believers at Philadelphia are warned by Christ in this revelation that an "hour of temptation" was imminent and "about to come upon all the world [the Roman empire]" and that they should hold fast and remain faithful as he [Christ] was coming soon. This is important and significant in that it is addressed to believers of a church in the 1st century AD and in that the first persecution of Christians all over the Roman empire took place under Nero Caesar in 64 AD. If this warning to the believers in Asia about an imminent temptation and the encouragement to hold fast related to this persecution, then the book seems to have been written even prior to 64 AD.

  John's later activities

  Another internal evidence in the book itself is connected to a reference about certain activities which John was still to experience in his life afterwards. In Rev 10:11, John is told that he "must prophesy again before many peoples, and nations, and tongues, and kings". Now, if John would have received this revelation in 96AD and written it at that time, then these words which he was told did not come to pass, seeing that he was a very old man at that time and hardly able to walk and travel. But, if John did receive this revelation and write it down during the time of Nero approx 65-66 AD, then he could fulfill what he was told. He would have been able to prophesy and to teach during the reigns of Caeasars Galba, Otho, Vitellius, Vespasian, Titus and also Domitian (spanning the time from 68-96 AD).

  Destruction of city and temple at the end of the age

  There are a number of references in the book of Revelation with symbols that have reference to the temple, and in addition Rev 11,1-2 makes reference to the destruction of the temple and the city of Jerusalem. This event was also foretold by Jesus, when he prophesied about the judgment on Jerusalem which was to come by the Son of man at the end of the age.

  There is a parallel record in Zec 14:2 about this "day of the Lord" with its destruction of Jerusalem and the temple, and Zec 13:7ff places this shortly after the shepherd would have dispersed his sheep (Jesus did quote from this section in Mt 26,31). Rev 11,2 is also a parallel to Mal 4, where a day of the Lord is spoken about when the Lord would separate and burn the chaff (the evil ones). This also parallels what Jesus mentions in parables about the burning of the chaff, the burning of apostate Israel, "at the end of the world [age]" (cp Mt 13:40,49).

  Now, when is or was "the end of the age"? Other records in the NT scriptures provide some insight as they mention certain things which happen in connection with the end of the age. The writer of Hebrews speaks of Jesus as "now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself." (Heb 9:26), and we can see from this passage that "the end of the world [age]"is the time when the Messiah Jesus through his sacrifice put away sin; in other words, the "end of the age" was the time during which Jesus lived and fulfilled his ministry almost 2000 years ago.
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  63

  Jerusalem will be trampled by the nations until the Gentile Times are Fulfilled. — Luke 21:24

  by Fisherman in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  jerusalem will be trampled by the nations until the gentile times are fulfilled.

  — luke 21:24 .

  the bible book of luke records jesus prophecy of the last day with his parousia including the verse about the gentile times.

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  Vanderhoven7

  Re the literal nature of the 42 months, Barnes writes:
  
  Shall they tread under foot forty and two months - Literally, this would be three years and a half...Prof. Stuart, who adopts the opinion that it refers to the conquest of Jerusalem by the Romans, says, indeed, “It is certain that the invasion of the Romans lasted just about the length of the period named, until Jerusalem was taken.

  Clark writes:

  Rev 11:2 - But the court - is given unto the Gentiles - The measuring of the temple probably refers to its approaching destruction, and the termination of the whole Levitical service; and this we find was to be done by the Gentiles, (Romans), who were to tread it down forty-two months; i.e., just three years and a half, or twelve hundred and sixty days.

  Daniel 12:1-3

  And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book. And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.

  Dan.12:1 Our Lord, in Mat_24:21, has this passage in mind, and uses terms borrowed from it to describe the sufferings to be endured by the Jews at the hands of the Romans. when Jerusalem shall be besieged and taken. It is to be observed that while in Daniel the comparison is only with the past, in Matthew there is added a reference to the future, "No, nor ever shall be." Nothing, then, shall equal the appalling horrors of the siege and sack of Jerusalem. And at that time thy people shall be delivered. The mere fact of deliverance is mentioned, but the nature of the deliverance is not indicated there; cessation of persecution would not be deliverance, for only Israel was persecuted. The application of the phrases of our Lord have a totally different reference—the Jews perished, the Christians were delivered

  Daniel 12:1-4

  Michael signifies, “Who is like God,” and his name, with the title of “the great Prince,” points to the Divine Saviour. Christ stood for the children of our people in their stead as a sacrifice, bore the curse for them, to bear it from them. When God works deliverance from persecution for them, it is as life from the dead. Through the preaching of this gospel in the end the multitude that sleep in the dust shall awake; many shall arise to life, and many to shame. There is glory reserved for all the saints in the future state, for all that are wise, wise for their souls and eternity. Those who turn many to righteousness, who turn sinners from the errors of their ways, and help to save their souls from death, Jam_5:20, will share in the glory of those they have helped to heaven, which will add to their own glory.

  
  
  
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  63

  Jerusalem will be trampled by the nations until the Gentile Times are Fulfilled. — Luke 21:24

  by Fisherman in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  jerusalem will be trampled by the nations until the gentile times are fulfilled.

  — luke 21:24 .

  the bible book of luke records jesus prophecy of the last day with his parousia including the verse about the gentile times.

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  Vanderhoven7

  The Time Of The Gentiles

  Dan Delagrave

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  "And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled." (Luke 21:24)

  There has been much misunderstanding in the modern Church concerning "the times of the Gentiles." The correct interpretation must be consistent with both the immediate context and the greater weight of scripture.

  
  "Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled." (Luke 21:32)
  
  
  

  "And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh . . . and Jerusalem shall be trodden down (pateho) of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled." (Luke 21:20, 24)

  The times of the Gentiles referred to the treading down, or desolation, of first century Jerusalem, which Jesus called "the days of vengeance". In other words, it was God's mission for the Gentiles to bring judgment upon Jerusalem. This is consistent with past judgments upon Israel, when God brought Gentiles armies into their land to desolate it.

  The whole controversy centers on the duration of the treading down of Jerusalem. The Greek for "trodden" is pat-eh'-o (#3961 in Strong's Concordance), and it means "to trample down underfoot". The parallel to Lk.21:24 is seen in Revelation 11:2, which says:

  "But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot (pateho) forty and two months." Rev 11:2

  Could it be any plainer? The times of the Gentiles, or treading down of Jerusalem, entailed no more than a forty two month period of time, the exact duration of the Jewish-Roman War. This is in perfect harmony with Daniel 12:7, where the defining characteristic of "the time of the end" is said to be "the scattering of the power of the holy people", which we are told would be accomplished during "a time, times, and a half", or forty two months.

  Furthermore, when we consider the mountain of evidence for a pre-70 dating of Revelation, in addition to the statements of imminence in the book itself (1:1, 3; 22:6, 7, 10, 12), then the forced conclusion is that the forty two months was fulfilled in the 66-70 A.D. Jewish-Roman War.

  In the ancient Near East, the ultimate image of triumph over an enemy was the positioning of the enemy "under the feet" of the conqueror. Jerusalem's first century desolation represented the time when Christ put his enemies (see I Thessalonians 2:15-16)“ under his feet. This was accomplished during a forty two month period which Jesus called "the times of the Gentiles".
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  81

  Acts 15:29 - "keep abstaining from blood"

  by aqwsed12345 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  for a christian, only the moral commandments of the old testament are binding (as they cannot change), but the various liturgical, social, and other so-called casuistic laws no longer apply to them.

  this includes dietary habits, such as the prohibition of pork or fat, as well as the prohibition of blood.. take a look at the following verses: mt 15:11, mk 7:15-19, acts 11:7-9, 1 tim 4:3-5.. the jehovah's witnesses say that, yes, but in the acts of the apostles (15) the consumption of blood, idol meat, and strangled animals is also prohibited, meaning the new testament still forbids it.

  for catholics, the council of florence settled this issue, stating that this apostolic regulation was only a temporary measure to facilitate agreement between jews and gentiles in the early church.

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  Vanderhoven7

  Taking in blood products in any form is wrong in God's eyes.

  I wonder if Orthodox Jews would agree with you...especially those who store their own blood for later transfusions, or those who find cattle that have died in their fields overnight. Too late to bleed the animal so I guess they have to go through the ordeal of taking a shower in the evening.

  When the blood comes out of the body, it needs to be disposed of. End of story.

  Really, where did Peter say that in Acts 15???? I thought that was only for Jews who actually did the killing. You are adding to the word E.P.
  
  
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  27

  Selena Vertolomo "The Mower" and her sister Sherrie call into The Six Screens TIME STAMP 2:53

  by RESPECTFUL OBSERVER in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  selena vertolomo, former jehovah's witnesses who was sexually abused in watchtower, went to visit tony morris in north carolina.

  selena and her sister call in and explain their position.

  callers dial in from around the world and ask plenty of questions.

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  Vanderhoven7

  What I did not get from either sister was what exactly they are accusing Tony Morris of. He is directly and personally responsible for what? ignoring CSA??? promoting CSA??? participating in CSA??? covering up CSA??? all of the above???

  Was anything made clear to you?