Listener

Joined

• started 199 topics
• posted 4,919 times   see topics posted on
• send a message

Posts by Listener

• 
  30

  AUSTRALIAN ROYAL COMMISSION OF INQUIRY: MAIN CONCLUSIONS ON JW ORGANIZATION

  by steve2 in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  10 response of the jehovah’s witness organisation to the sexual abuse of children.

  having regard to the various matters we have discussed in this report, we have reached a number of general conclusions on the jehovah’s witness organisation’s response to the sexual abuse of children.

  we do not consider the jehovah’s witness organisation to be an organisation which responds adequately to child sexual abuse.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Listener

  Smiddy, it was noted in the Findings released by the RC a year ago. This is one thread where it is mentioned
  

  https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/6276815245017088/australian-royal-commission-findings-released
  
  Cofty's post has the quote from that 'Findings Report' and I'll requote it-

  F56 This report is referred to the Law Society of New South Wales in relation to the conduct of
  Mr Toole in having failed to advise congregational elders of their obligations to report their
  knowledge of the commission of certain criminal offences to the police.

  Compulsory reporting applies in 2 states in Australia. 1006 cases known to the branch and zero reported to the police, Therefore numerous serious crimes have been committed by elders and branch lawyers.

  Now we know why the Australian branch is searching for lawyers and accountants.
• 
  2

  Response to the recent "infallible" Governing Body propaganda

  by web-blog in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i am outraged by the recent "infallible" governing body propaganda.

  so, i posted a blog for anyone who might still be confused.

  http://faithfulslave.weebly.com/

  1. 
  2. 
• 

  Listener

  Thanks FS, that was a lovely sermon.
• 
  25

  Australian Royal Commission mentions that G. Jackson was inconsistent

  by Daniel1555 in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  it's great that the following is officially mentioned in the royal commission's report:.

  when asked if the governing body members saw themselves as ‘jehovah god’s spokespeople on earth’, mr geoffrey jackson answered that it ‘would seem to be quite presumptuous to say that we are the only spokesperson that god is using’.

  mr jackson’s response seems to be inconsistent with the documentary evidence before the royal commission, which shows that jehovah’s witnesses believe that the governing body is the ‘channel’ by which jehovah’s ‘will’ is communicated to them..

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Listener

  Then there was the question about the woman raped in the field. Jackson said they did not have the answer and would like to ask Jesus in the future. A few weeks later, they miraculously found an answer and forwarded it the Commission.
• 
  6

  Australian Royal Commission, March 2017 & the February 2017 Watchtower

  by Londo111 in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  the february 2017 watchtower says: “the governing body is neither inspired nor infallible.

  therefore, it can err in doctrinal matters or in organizational direction.”.

  could this frank admission be a prelude to any fallout to australian royal commission’s recommendations in march 2017?.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Listener

  The March 2017 Watchtower says that it is important to honor and respect Governments and that there may be benefits for doing so.
• 
  25

  Australian Royal Commission mentions that G. Jackson was inconsistent

  by Daniel1555 in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  it's great that the following is officially mentioned in the royal commission's report:.

  when asked if the governing body members saw themselves as ‘jehovah god’s spokespeople on earth’, mr geoffrey jackson answered that it ‘would seem to be quite presumptuous to say that we are the only spokesperson that god is using’.

  mr jackson’s response seems to be inconsistent with the documentary evidence before the royal commission, which shows that jehovah’s witnesses believe that the governing body is the ‘channel’ by which jehovah’s ‘will’ is communicated to them..

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Listener

  Jackson also said that he hopes to be a disciple of Jesus, they made mention of this in the report.
• 
  30

  AUSTRALIAN ROYAL COMMISSION OF INQUIRY: MAIN CONCLUSIONS ON JW ORGANIZATION

  by steve2 in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  10 response of the jehovah’s witness organisation to the sexual abuse of children.

  having regard to the various matters we have discussed in this report, we have reached a number of general conclusions on the jehovah’s witness organisation’s response to the sexual abuse of children.

  we do not consider the jehovah’s witness organisation to be an organisation which responds adequately to child sexual abuse.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Listener

  They may have until March 2017 to try to sort things out but it's not long enough for them, they cannot function in such a short time frame, they also worry about the 'domino' effect.

  Their other huge problem is that they already addressed these issues in their written response not that long ago and they either don't agree with the Commission or don't accept that they are wrong. If they now turn around and change anything major, they will have even more explaining to do.

  They have been cornered. The report points out that the Commission believes they are breaking the law in the State of NSW. The JWs lawyer, Mr. Toole has already been challenged with this and the Commission is not going to let this lie.
• 
  23

  Washington Post is carrying the story: Australian Jehovah’s Witnesses protected over a thousand members accused of child abuse, report says

  by AndersonsInfo in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2016/11/28/australian-jehovahs-witnesses-protected-over-a-thousand-members-accused-of-child-abuse-report-says/.

  over the course of about six decades, more than 1,000 members of the jehovah’s witnesses were accused of sexually abusing australian children, according to a new report.

  victims were ordered to keep quiet.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Listener

  Who is he trying to kid when he says they are taking it seriously? Their written response to the first report was anything but serious when they denied, refuted and argued against just about everything.
• 
  21

  Royal Commission Australia - Report into Jehovah's Witnesses and the Watchtower Society has been released

  by OrphanCrow in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  link to pdf:.

  http://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/getattachment/c2d1f1f5-a1f2-4241-82fb-978d072734bd/report-of-case-study-no-29.

  reading it now...no comment yet.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Listener

  It is amusing that the Commission included the fact that the growth of the numbers of JWs in Australia was not keeping up with it's population growth

  Over the past 25 years, the active membership of the organisation in Australia has grown 29 per cent from approximately 53,000 members in 1990.51 In the same period Australia’s population growth has been approximately 38 per cent.52

  
  
  Their failure to report child abuse crimes in the State of New South Wales is being addressed and will be further addressed later on. This is what Angus Stuart was going to report the Watchtower's Lawyer, Mr Toole for failing to do.
  
  

  Evidence Act 1995 (NSW). We do not accept that an elder of the Jehovah’s Witness organisation will never be obliged to report his knowledge or belief that child sexual abuse has been committed. Particularly where the abuser confesses to their crime, the obligation to report is compelling. The Royal Commission will consider further the issue of the protection of the confessional in a later public hearing

  
  This again, will really put them in the hot seat because this Act goes way beyond the obligation to report Child Abuse, it is likely that it includes reporting many other crimes, such as rape. Ignorance of the law is no excuse in Australia and if the Org. accepts that they in fact do have an obligation then biblicly they would be required to report all past crimes as required under the legislation.
  
  Will the Watchtower be prepared to wait until they are charged with this failure so that it can be tested out in court or will they voluntarily obey the law? It's a big gamble because this Commission is telling them directly that they are failing in adhering to the Law.
  
  The Commission continues to explain why the two witness rule is not adequate
  
  

  Regardless of the biblical origins of the two-witness rule, the Jehovah’s Witness organisation’s retention of and continued application of the rule to a complaint of child sexual abuse is wrong. It fails to reflect the learning of the many people who have been involved in examining the behaviour of abusers and the circumstances of survivors. It shows a failure by the organisation to recognise that the rule will more often than not operate in favour of a perpetrator of child sexual abuse, who will not only avoid sanction but will also remain in the congregation and the community with their rights intact and with the capacity to interact with their victim.585

  
  This leaves the organization in a serious quandary and one that I expect the Commission might try to help them address. The Commission acknowledges the fact that the org. continues to be firm in it's resolve not to change the two witness rule.
  
  Although it sees it as archaic and in need of changing there may be other ways of working around this. The rule, in itself, does not prevent the organization from reporting accusations and this may be another reason why the Commission wants to further delve into 'confessional privileges'. As it is, the Commission points out that their internal processes fall short in a number of areas.
  
  The report indicates that they want the organization to take the initiative in reporting and the benefits of doing so.
  
  
  

  
  Reproval and disfellowshipping are not effective mechanisms for protecting children in the congregation and in the broader community.

  
  

  There is no evidence before the Royal Commission that the Jehovah’s Witness organisation has properly considered that risk in developing its precautionary measures for dealing with known or alleged perpetrators of child sexual abuse.

  
  If it wasn't clear enough for Watchtower to recognize how they are protecting the abuser throughout this report and proves it with factual information, it is clearly noted by this comment.
  
  

  A survivor of child sexual abuse may therefore be faced with the impossible choice between staying in an organisation which is protective of their abuser in order to retain their social and familial network and leaving the organisation and losing that entire network as a result.634

  
  How sad it is to remember Lett's words when he scoffed at the idea that some people are of the belief that they are permissive towards pedophiles.
  
  
• 
  21

  Royal Commission Australia - Report into Jehovah's Witnesses and the Watchtower Society has been released

  by OrphanCrow in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  link to pdf:.

  http://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/getattachment/c2d1f1f5-a1f2-4241-82fb-978d072734bd/report-of-case-study-no-29.

  reading it now...no comment yet.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Listener

  Schnell, you might like to put this quote from the Watchtower just before the link.
  
  In reading this report the Organization should heed it's own advice.
  
  From the 2017 March Watchtower under the subject of "Give Honor to Whom it is Due"
  
  

  Government officials are expected to maintain law and order and to care for the needs of their citizens. This brings benefits to all. Accordingly, the apostle Paul advised Christians to view such human governmental authorities as“superior authorities” to whom Christians should be in subjection. ... our showing government officials due respect and honor can at times have positive, even unexpected,results.

  
  By listening and implementing the suggestions from this RC many improvements can be made. If they are sincerely interested in the victims and prevention they will wisely respect their advice and humbly make further changes.
  
  
  
• 
  11

  Blondie's Comments You Will Not Hear at the 11-27-2016 WT Study (CHILDREN FAITH)

  by blondie in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  blondie’s highlights from the november 27, 2016 wt study (september 2016) (parents build children faith).

  https://www.jw.org/en/publications/magazines/watchtower-study-september-2016/.

  excellent general website: www.jwfacts.com .

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Listener

  Thanks for your review Blondie, I've missed reading them.

  Use GOOD illustrations—not the lame ones the WTS provides or worse they ones other jws make up.

  
  

  Great advice