Listener

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  50

  Crisis of Conscience: December 12, 2015 - 50 weeks later

  by Jehalapeno in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  on december 12, 2015 this statement was made by the copyright holder:.

  i am presently considering three different routes to publishing crisis of conscience.

  i hope to make a decision within days and plan to publish within weeks.. it has now been 50 weeks since that statement.. has the book been published yet?

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  Listener

  For what it's worth, YouTuber 'The Unwitness'(Joel I think)said a few months ago that he was disappointed with the delay but had been told the reason why and it was legit. Also that it will be well worth the delay from what he had heard and to be patient. He said he couldn't say anymore.
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  30

  AUSTRALIAN ROYAL COMMISSION OF INQUIRY: MAIN CONCLUSIONS ON JW ORGANIZATION

  by steve2 in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  10 response of the jehovah’s witness organisation to the sexual abuse of children.

  having regard to the various matters we have discussed in this report, we have reached a number of general conclusions on the jehovah’s witness organisation’s response to the sexual abuse of children.

  we do not consider the jehovah’s witness organisation to be an organisation which responds adequately to child sexual abuse.

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  Listener

  As mentioned earlier, they are continuing to look at this matter and in the current Report just released they have said this (I’ll highlight some of the more interesting points) Also, note the heading –‘ Concealment Offences’, sounds like a big problem for them.
  
  Knowing that they will obey the law and being told that they are breaking the law, they would then be obliged to report all cases of criminal activities that fall under that legislation that the Org. becomes aware of. This may include things like rape, stealing, illegal immigrants and so on, depending on the requirements of the legislation. They get away with not reporting it in the USA and other countries because of either an exemption for religious institutions or the perceived idea that they have privilege under 'clergy confession.' The RC is about to tell them that they don't.

  Concealment offences The Royal Commission heard evidence that, before the public hearing of this case study, the Jehovah’s Witness organisation did not consider that concealment offences were independent of obligations under mandatory reporting laws to report child sexual abuse.562 Mr Toole said the Jehovah’s Witness organisation had not reported child sexual abuse in New South Wales because it believed that only the mandatory reporting laws applied.563 In New South Wales, section 316(1) of the Crimes Act 1900 (NSW) makes it a criminal offence for a person with knowledge or belief that a serious indictable offence has been committed not to report to authorities information that may materially assist in securing the apprehension or prosecution or conviction of the offender. Similarly, in Victoria, section 327(2) of the Crimes Act 1958 (Vic) makes it a criminal offence for a person to not disclose to a police officer information that leads the person to form a reasonable belief that a sexual offence has been committed. Both jurisdictions provide a defence of reasonable excuse for withholding information.564 In Victoria, a person will not contravene section 327(2) if that person is (or was at the relevant time) a member of the clergy of any church or religious denomination and they learnt the information in the course of hearing a religious confession.565 There is no equivalent provision in the Crimes Act 1900 (NSW). However, in New South Wales a prosecution under section 316(1) of a person who learnt the relevant information in the course of practising a prescribed vocation (and a person Royal Commission into Institutional Responses to Child Sexual Abuse childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au 63 practising a ‘prescribed vocation’ includes a ‘member of the clergy or any church or religious denomination’566) must not be commenced without the approval of the Attorney-General (section 316(4)).567 The Watchtower & Ors submitted that when a survivor of child sexual abuse discloses their abuse to an elder in New South Wales:568 the elder is not required to report the same to the authorities because of the application of the qualification in s.316(1) of ‘without reasonable excuse’ when those words are considered and understood in the light of the requirements of s.316(4) of the [Crimes Act 1900 (NSW)], s.127 of the Evidence Act 1995 (NSW) and the usages and rituals of the Jehovah’s Witnesses faith. First, section 316(4) of the Crimes Act 1900 (NSW) does not offer a defence to a charge of failure to report under section 316(1). Rather, it is relevant only to when a prosecution in relation to a specified class of person may be commenced. We do not consider that section 316(4) is relevant to the determination of whether an excuse is ‘reasonable’ within the meaning of section 316(1). Secondly, we disagree that section 127 of the Evidence Act 1995 (NSW), read together with section 316(1), will mean that an elder of the Jehovah’s Witness organisation will always have a ‘reasonable excuse’ for withholding from authorities his belief or knowledge that child sexual abuse has been committed. Section 127 provides that a member of the clergy is entitled to refuse to divulge the fact and/or content of a religious confession made to that member of the clergy. Whether information has been obtained in the course of receipt of a religious confession will depend upon the specific facts of any given case. It is not apparent to us how the example of a survivor disclosing their abuse to an elder in accordance with the documented policies of the Jehovah’s Witness organisation569 would constitute a ‘religious confession’ within the meaning of section 127 of the Evidence Act 1995 (NSW). On their face, those documented policies are directed primarily to the protection of the ‘spiritual and moral cleanness of the congregation’ from the threat of ‘such offenses as fornication, adultery, homosexuality, blasphemy’.570 The policies do not appear to be directed to encouraging a person to seek absolution for their sins. Even if the example given contemplated the disclosure of their crime to an elder by a perpetrator (rather than a survivor) of child sexual abuse, we are not satisfied, having regard to the evidence before the Royal Commission on the purpose and function of the internal disciplinary process of the Jehovah’s Witness organisation, that such a disclosure would on every occasion constitute a ‘religious confession’ within the meaning of section 127 of the Evidence Act 1995 (NSW). We do not accept that an elder of the Jehovah’s Witness organisation will never be obliged to report his knowledge or belief that child sexual abuse has been committed. Particularly where the abuser confesses to their crime, the obligation to report is compelling. 64 Report of Case Study No. 29 The Royal Commission will consider further the issue of the protection of the confessional in a later public hearing.
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  30

  AUSTRALIAN ROYAL COMMISSION OF INQUIRY: MAIN CONCLUSIONS ON JW ORGANIZATION

  by steve2 in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  10 response of the jehovah’s witness organisation to the sexual abuse of children.

  having regard to the various matters we have discussed in this report, we have reached a number of general conclusions on the jehovah’s witness organisation’s response to the sexual abuse of children.

  we do not consider the jehovah’s witness organisation to be an organisation which responds adequately to child sexual abuse.

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  Listener

  Smiddy, it was noted in the Findings released by the RC a year ago. This is one thread where it is mentioned
  

  https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/6276815245017088/australian-royal-commission-findings-released
  
  Cofty's post has the quote from that 'Findings Report' and I'll requote it-

  F56 This report is referred to the Law Society of New South Wales in relation to the conduct of
  Mr Toole in having failed to advise congregational elders of their obligations to report their
  knowledge of the commission of certain criminal offences to the police.

  Compulsory reporting applies in 2 states in Australia. 1006 cases known to the branch and zero reported to the police, Therefore numerous serious crimes have been committed by elders and branch lawyers.

  Now we know why the Australian branch is searching for lawyers and accountants.
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  2

  Response to the recent "infallible" Governing Body propaganda

  by web-blog in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i am outraged by the recent "infallible" governing body propaganda.

  so, i posted a blog for anyone who might still be confused.

  http://faithfulslave.weebly.com/

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  Listener

  Thanks FS, that was a lovely sermon.
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  25

  Australian Royal Commission mentions that G. Jackson was inconsistent

  by Daniel1555 in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  it's great that the following is officially mentioned in the royal commission's report:.

  when asked if the governing body members saw themselves as ‘jehovah god’s spokespeople on earth’, mr geoffrey jackson answered that it ‘would seem to be quite presumptuous to say that we are the only spokesperson that god is using’.

  mr jackson’s response seems to be inconsistent with the documentary evidence before the royal commission, which shows that jehovah’s witnesses believe that the governing body is the ‘channel’ by which jehovah’s ‘will’ is communicated to them..

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  Listener

  Then there was the question about the woman raped in the field. Jackson said they did not have the answer and would like to ask Jesus in the future. A few weeks later, they miraculously found an answer and forwarded it the Commission.
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  6

  Australian Royal Commission, March 2017 & the February 2017 Watchtower

  by Londo111 in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  the february 2017 watchtower says: “the governing body is neither inspired nor infallible.

  therefore, it can err in doctrinal matters or in organizational direction.”.

  could this frank admission be a prelude to any fallout to australian royal commission’s recommendations in march 2017?.

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  Listener

  The March 2017 Watchtower says that it is important to honor and respect Governments and that there may be benefits for doing so.
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  25

  Australian Royal Commission mentions that G. Jackson was inconsistent

  by Daniel1555 in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  it's great that the following is officially mentioned in the royal commission's report:.

  when asked if the governing body members saw themselves as ‘jehovah god’s spokespeople on earth’, mr geoffrey jackson answered that it ‘would seem to be quite presumptuous to say that we are the only spokesperson that god is using’.

  mr jackson’s response seems to be inconsistent with the documentary evidence before the royal commission, which shows that jehovah’s witnesses believe that the governing body is the ‘channel’ by which jehovah’s ‘will’ is communicated to them..

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  Listener

  Jackson also said that he hopes to be a disciple of Jesus, they made mention of this in the report.
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  30

  AUSTRALIAN ROYAL COMMISSION OF INQUIRY: MAIN CONCLUSIONS ON JW ORGANIZATION

  by steve2 in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  10 response of the jehovah’s witness organisation to the sexual abuse of children.

  having regard to the various matters we have discussed in this report, we have reached a number of general conclusions on the jehovah’s witness organisation’s response to the sexual abuse of children.

  we do not consider the jehovah’s witness organisation to be an organisation which responds adequately to child sexual abuse.

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  Listener

  They may have until March 2017 to try to sort things out but it's not long enough for them, they cannot function in such a short time frame, they also worry about the 'domino' effect.

  Their other huge problem is that they already addressed these issues in their written response not that long ago and they either don't agree with the Commission or don't accept that they are wrong. If they now turn around and change anything major, they will have even more explaining to do.

  They have been cornered. The report points out that the Commission believes they are breaking the law in the State of NSW. The JWs lawyer, Mr. Toole has already been challenged with this and the Commission is not going to let this lie.
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  23

  Washington Post is carrying the story: Australian Jehovah’s Witnesses protected over a thousand members accused of child abuse, report says

  by AndersonsInfo in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2016/11/28/australian-jehovahs-witnesses-protected-over-a-thousand-members-accused-of-child-abuse-report-says/.

  over the course of about six decades, more than 1,000 members of the jehovah’s witnesses were accused of sexually abusing australian children, according to a new report.

  victims were ordered to keep quiet.

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  Listener

  Who is he trying to kid when he says they are taking it seriously? Their written response to the first report was anything but serious when they denied, refuted and argued against just about everything.
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  21

  Royal Commission Australia - Report into Jehovah's Witnesses and the Watchtower Society has been released

  by OrphanCrow in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  link to pdf:.

  http://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/getattachment/c2d1f1f5-a1f2-4241-82fb-978d072734bd/report-of-case-study-no-29.

  reading it now...no comment yet.

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  Listener

  It is amusing that the Commission included the fact that the growth of the numbers of JWs in Australia was not keeping up with it's population growth

  Over the past 25 years, the active membership of the organisation in Australia has grown 29 per cent from approximately 53,000 members in 1990.51 In the same period Australia’s population growth has been approximately 38 per cent.52

  
  
  Their failure to report child abuse crimes in the State of New South Wales is being addressed and will be further addressed later on. This is what Angus Stuart was going to report the Watchtower's Lawyer, Mr Toole for failing to do.
  
  

  Evidence Act 1995 (NSW). We do not accept that an elder of the Jehovah’s Witness organisation will never be obliged to report his knowledge or belief that child sexual abuse has been committed. Particularly where the abuser confesses to their crime, the obligation to report is compelling. The Royal Commission will consider further the issue of the protection of the confessional in a later public hearing

  
  This again, will really put them in the hot seat because this Act goes way beyond the obligation to report Child Abuse, it is likely that it includes reporting many other crimes, such as rape. Ignorance of the law is no excuse in Australia and if the Org. accepts that they in fact do have an obligation then biblicly they would be required to report all past crimes as required under the legislation.
  
  Will the Watchtower be prepared to wait until they are charged with this failure so that it can be tested out in court or will they voluntarily obey the law? It's a big gamble because this Commission is telling them directly that they are failing in adhering to the Law.
  
  The Commission continues to explain why the two witness rule is not adequate
  
  

  Regardless of the biblical origins of the two-witness rule, the Jehovah’s Witness organisation’s retention of and continued application of the rule to a complaint of child sexual abuse is wrong. It fails to reflect the learning of the many people who have been involved in examining the behaviour of abusers and the circumstances of survivors. It shows a failure by the organisation to recognise that the rule will more often than not operate in favour of a perpetrator of child sexual abuse, who will not only avoid sanction but will also remain in the congregation and the community with their rights intact and with the capacity to interact with their victim.585

  
  This leaves the organization in a serious quandary and one that I expect the Commission might try to help them address. The Commission acknowledges the fact that the org. continues to be firm in it's resolve not to change the two witness rule.
  
  Although it sees it as archaic and in need of changing there may be other ways of working around this. The rule, in itself, does not prevent the organization from reporting accusations and this may be another reason why the Commission wants to further delve into 'confessional privileges'. As it is, the Commission points out that their internal processes fall short in a number of areas.
  
  The report indicates that they want the organization to take the initiative in reporting and the benefits of doing so.
  
  
  

  
  Reproval and disfellowshipping are not effective mechanisms for protecting children in the congregation and in the broader community.

  
  

  There is no evidence before the Royal Commission that the Jehovah’s Witness organisation has properly considered that risk in developing its precautionary measures for dealing with known or alleged perpetrators of child sexual abuse.

  
  If it wasn't clear enough for Watchtower to recognize how they are protecting the abuser throughout this report and proves it with factual information, it is clearly noted by this comment.
  
  

  A survivor of child sexual abuse may therefore be faced with the impossible choice between staying in an organisation which is protective of their abuser in order to retain their social and familial network and leaving the organisation and losing that entire network as a result.634

  
  How sad it is to remember Lett's words when he scoffed at the idea that some people are of the belief that they are permissive towards pedophiles.