I understand your pain.
Nickolas
JoinedPosts by Nickolas
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14
Cambridge: JW tries to entice 11 y. o. boy into having sex
by behemot ina jehovah's witness who tried to get an 11-year-old boy to have sex with him turned himself in to police after being told to by counsellors.. cambridge crown court heard kirk lefcovitch, 25, had repeatedly asked the child to perform sexual acts, as well as handing him pornography and sex toys.. despite his admissions, and previous convictions against a boy aged 8 in 2000, he was spared jail.. sara walker, prosecuting, said: in december last year mr lefcovitch asked the 11-year-old to expose himself, and the boy refused.. the defendant then offered to show the boy his privates, to which the boy replied that he didnt want to see it.. he then showed the victim some porn and told him he wanted to have sex with him.. there were occasions when the two spoke on the phone, and mr lefcovitch also made inappropriate comments then.. the court heard that lefcovitch had made a full confession to police, who were previously unaware of the incident, after being advised to do so by a counsellor at cambridges centre 33 an organisation which gives advice to young people aged up to 25.. georgina gibbs, mitigating, said: it is a very rare occurrence for an offender of this type to put themselves at risk and report themselves.. the defendant has been receiving help from centre 33 and his jehovahs witness group.. he is trying to go down a different course in his life.
he has thrown away all his porn and has been deliberately excluding himself from activities which could have him in close proximity to youngsters.. lefcovitch, of the brook, sutton, was described in a pre-sentence report as a serious risk to children.. he has a previous conviction from 2000 for a string of sexual assaults on an 8-year-old boy.. judge anthony bate said: there was clearly an intention for the offence with the 11-year-old to go further than it did, but the prison sentences suggested in my guidelines would not be long enough for you to complete a sex offenders course in prison.. judge bate instead ordered lefcovitch to take part in the thames valley programme, which is a community sex offender group work course.. lefcovitch was also made the subject of a 3-year community order with supervision requirements, and he must pay 400 court costs.. source: http://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/home/religious-man-tried-to-entice-boy-11-into-sex-24082011.htm.
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Cambridge: JW tries to entice 11 y. o. boy into having sex
by behemot ina jehovah's witness who tried to get an 11-year-old boy to have sex with him turned himself in to police after being told to by counsellors.. cambridge crown court heard kirk lefcovitch, 25, had repeatedly asked the child to perform sexual acts, as well as handing him pornography and sex toys.. despite his admissions, and previous convictions against a boy aged 8 in 2000, he was spared jail.. sara walker, prosecuting, said: in december last year mr lefcovitch asked the 11-year-old to expose himself, and the boy refused.. the defendant then offered to show the boy his privates, to which the boy replied that he didnt want to see it.. he then showed the victim some porn and told him he wanted to have sex with him.. there were occasions when the two spoke on the phone, and mr lefcovitch also made inappropriate comments then.. the court heard that lefcovitch had made a full confession to police, who were previously unaware of the incident, after being advised to do so by a counsellor at cambridges centre 33 an organisation which gives advice to young people aged up to 25.. georgina gibbs, mitigating, said: it is a very rare occurrence for an offender of this type to put themselves at risk and report themselves.. the defendant has been receiving help from centre 33 and his jehovahs witness group.. he is trying to go down a different course in his life.
he has thrown away all his porn and has been deliberately excluding himself from activities which could have him in close proximity to youngsters.. lefcovitch, of the brook, sutton, was described in a pre-sentence report as a serious risk to children.. he has a previous conviction from 2000 for a string of sexual assaults on an 8-year-old boy.. judge anthony bate said: there was clearly an intention for the offence with the 11-year-old to go further than it did, but the prison sentences suggested in my guidelines would not be long enough for you to complete a sex offenders course in prison.. judge bate instead ordered lefcovitch to take part in the thames valley programme, which is a community sex offender group work course.. lefcovitch was also made the subject of a 3-year community order with supervision requirements, and he must pay 400 court costs.. source: http://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/home/religious-man-tried-to-entice-boy-11-into-sex-24082011.htm.
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Nickolas
It's no secret that I loathe the Watchtower, so please don't take my comments as in any way defending it. I'd rejoice to see it destroyed and I will do whatever I can to help that along, just as you will. But if you and I want to be credible in our attacks against the Watchtower we should be careful that our positions are credible, too. As much as I condemn the Watchtower for its policies related to pedophilia in its organisation, I can't credibly hold this guy up as a shining example of what the Watchtower represents. There is no evidence presented here that the Watchtower made any attempt to protect this man, and there is no evidence that he represents the Watchtower in any official capacity, so there is no credible basis for me to associate the Watchtower with his actions. Show me otherwise and I will change my tune. Otherwise, all we have here is a sick puppy who also happens to be a Jehovah's Witness.
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RESCUE OPERATION: What did you do to help others Wake-Up?
by 00DAD inplease share anything--whatever facts, methods, ideas, etc.--that you found successful in helping other family members or friends to "wake-up" and leave jws.
also, include anythings that you found didn't work or even backfired.
i'm particularly interested in how you were able to reach family members that initially shunned you out of mis-guided loyalty due to wt indoctrination.
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Nickolas
I have come to that conclusion myself, wobble. As much as it sounds and feels like surrender, I still wonder about the possibility of tipping the balance with gently offered facts and observations that pose no immediately perceived threat (thereby not causing defenses to be raised and subsequent termination of thinking and listening) but nevertheless plant a small seed of doubt that may be subsequently nurtured into full blown uncertainty. It is that indelible certainty that the Watchtower is what it claims to be, that cognitive dissonance that blinds one to obvious fallacies, that holds Jehovah's Witnesses captive, especially those who love the Watchtower. But do you ever hear a tiny, tiny voice in the back of your mind telling you that you've forgotten something or that something, something is missing? Most of the time you shake it off, but some of the time you come to realise what it is. Patiently and lovingly planting a seed or two and watching to see what might sprout might be the best strategy of all.
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Past Organized Attempts to Level the Playing Field with WTBTS
by Band on the Run ini am new to jw dissidents.
a couple of weeks ago i created a post asking what attempts have been made in the past to organize some opposition.
personally, i don't feel it would be fruitful to challenge the wt first amendment benefits.
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Nickolas
What are the limitations to publicity BotR? What I mean is, if you rent billboard space on the Interstate singling out the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society for whatever perceived wrong (the pedophile scandal or shunning, for example) are you exposing yourself to civil litigation?
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RESCUE OPERATION: What did you do to help others Wake-Up?
by 00DAD inplease share anything--whatever facts, methods, ideas, etc.--that you found successful in helping other family members or friends to "wake-up" and leave jws.
also, include anythings that you found didn't work or even backfired.
i'm particularly interested in how you were able to reach family members that initially shunned you out of mis-guided loyalty due to wt indoctrination.
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Nickolas
This is a common theme, 00Dad. A similar thread was started several days ago.
http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/social/family/214448/1/need-advice-to-free-family
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Nickolas
Well, I digress a bit, but hey, you know.
A generous and enlightening digression, thank you. Sorry for what's happened in your family, though. The greatest problem I have with the Watchtower is the damage it does to families.
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Cambridge: JW tries to entice 11 y. o. boy into having sex
by behemot ina jehovah's witness who tried to get an 11-year-old boy to have sex with him turned himself in to police after being told to by counsellors.. cambridge crown court heard kirk lefcovitch, 25, had repeatedly asked the child to perform sexual acts, as well as handing him pornography and sex toys.. despite his admissions, and previous convictions against a boy aged 8 in 2000, he was spared jail.. sara walker, prosecuting, said: in december last year mr lefcovitch asked the 11-year-old to expose himself, and the boy refused.. the defendant then offered to show the boy his privates, to which the boy replied that he didnt want to see it.. he then showed the victim some porn and told him he wanted to have sex with him.. there were occasions when the two spoke on the phone, and mr lefcovitch also made inappropriate comments then.. the court heard that lefcovitch had made a full confession to police, who were previously unaware of the incident, after being advised to do so by a counsellor at cambridges centre 33 an organisation which gives advice to young people aged up to 25.. georgina gibbs, mitigating, said: it is a very rare occurrence for an offender of this type to put themselves at risk and report themselves.. the defendant has been receiving help from centre 33 and his jehovahs witness group.. he is trying to go down a different course in his life.
he has thrown away all his porn and has been deliberately excluding himself from activities which could have him in close proximity to youngsters.. lefcovitch, of the brook, sutton, was described in a pre-sentence report as a serious risk to children.. he has a previous conviction from 2000 for a string of sexual assaults on an 8-year-old boy.. judge anthony bate said: there was clearly an intention for the offence with the 11-year-old to go further than it did, but the prison sentences suggested in my guidelines would not be long enough for you to complete a sex offenders course in prison.. judge bate instead ordered lefcovitch to take part in the thames valley programme, which is a community sex offender group work course.. lefcovitch was also made the subject of a 3-year community order with supervision requirements, and he must pay 400 court costs.. source: http://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/home/religious-man-tried-to-entice-boy-11-into-sex-24082011.htm.
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Nickolas
This creep is not going to change.
Likely not. There are many psychologists who maintain that pedophilia cannot be cured and this one has already failed to reform. Past behaviour of this kind is usually a good proxy for what will happen in the future. This particular individual was first apprehended when he was only 14, so it is apparent that his pedophilia started right out of the gate. Did the Watchtower influence it? Perhaps, if he was himself molested as a child by someone in the Kingdom Hall or otherwise by someone who was subsequently protected by the Society, but in the absense of evidence that is a long, long stretch. It is more likely than not that his status as a Jehovah's Witness is coincidental.
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Past Organized Attempts to Level the Playing Field with WTBTS
by Band on the Run ini am new to jw dissidents.
a couple of weeks ago i created a post asking what attempts have been made in the past to organize some opposition.
personally, i don't feel it would be fruitful to challenge the wt first amendment benefits.
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Nickolas
Another question, related to the above. Could some one challenge the disfellowshipping arrangement on the basis of being judged by a secret rules book they never saw? Kind of like being fired from a job due to a rule that was never disclosed to you.
Doubtful, because it goes to freedom of worship and belief, which has been upheld in the higher courts of several nations. That does not mean your question is irrelevant. Quite the contrary. All advanced societies espouse some sort of "age of majority" position with respect to what people are and are not allowed to do, whether that be voting, driving a car, serving in the military, having sex, drinking alcohol or what have you. But those same societies uphold a religious group's right to disfellowship and shun an individual who disagrees with it solely on the basis that the individual is contravening an earlier commitment he made through baptism, even if he was a minor child when he was baptised and could not possibly have understood the full implications of his commitment. Society might one day change or restrict that religious right, but we may have to wait awhile.
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Past Organized Attempts to Level the Playing Field with WTBTS
by Band on the Run ini am new to jw dissidents.
a couple of weeks ago i created a post asking what attempts have been made in the past to organize some opposition.
personally, i don't feel it would be fruitful to challenge the wt first amendment benefits.
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Nickolas
It may be a bit of a stretch to think it could be achieved through legal or legislated channels, in particular if the context is North America - I am not familiar with the long reach of religious freedoms in other areas of the world. A pertinent example is the deaths of infant boys in NYC in 2005 caused by a mohel infected with genital herpes. This 57-year-old man provided the service of orthodox circumcision in which he severed the foreskins of baby boys with a scalpel, placed their penises in his mouth, sucked off the amputated flaps then spat the bloody mess out into a pan. At least three infants died, dozens more infected. Horrified, the medical community (including several doctors who were Othrodox Jews) called out for the practice to be banned, but Mayor Bloomburg quashed any attempt to do so, citing the priority that the free expression of religious belief should not be infringed. This is the sort of mentality you are up against.
The playing field will be leveled but the mechanism will be populist or subversive. I agree with zid. We mustn't look to government, only to ourselves. I also agree with BotR, though. We need to push the envelope on what is legally allowed with respect to free expression, much like what the Brazilians did with their anti-Watchtower billboard campaigne.
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Nickolas
An interesting and potentially revealing question, LittleMac, that leads to a corollary question.
My observation of posts made by the people on this board who have left the WTBTS is that by and large theirs was an individual decision based upon some sort of individual distinction he or she has formed. That distinction could have had some grounds in the interpretation and application of biblical principles or could have been rooted in purely secular grounds, but there is always something that causes a light to come on for the individual. But here we have complete family groups, or complete segments within family groups, who have exited. Lots of lights came on. Was there a shared distinction of some kind? If so, what was it?