Posts by InterestedOne

80

Is there one Bible Prophecy.....

by Phizzy in

in the form of a prediction, that can be proven to truly be a prediction,i.e written before the event, and it came true ?.

it would be good not to have time wasters on this thread in the form of the common ones that are brought up to demonstrate the bible's prophetic prowess, like cyrus being named , these have been debunked already.. but does there seem to be a genuine prophecy in there somewhere ?.

InterestedOne

tornapart wrote:

Bible prophecy takes faith to believe in. It's easy for it to be pulled apart by 'experts' and claimed to be untrue. A non-believer wants it to be proved beyond all doubt and claims anyone believing in it is delusional. If this is the case then there are billions of people in this category.

First, I am tired of seeing scare quotes as in the above with the term 'experts.' Real experts do exist, and they do pull apart the subject of their expertise. It's their job. Legitimate scholarly work does exist. Those who engage in it strive to adhere to standards of academic honesty. They are not 'experts' (in quotes). They are actually experts (no quote marks needed). As for pseudo-experts or the 'experts' (in quotes) you refer to, why bother mentioning them? I don't think anyone cares about the opinions of illegitimate 'experts' in a thread asking for rigorous examination of any supposed prophecy in the bible.

Second, regarding your comment about non-believers, I consider belief to mean thinking a claim is likely to be true. One's level of belief in a claim should be proportional to how likely the claim is to be true. If a claim seems unlikely to be true, I am less inclined to believe it. If a claim seems more likely to be true, I am more inclined to believe it. I do not demand proof beyond all doubt, but I do demand evidence or rational support to demonstrate the likelihood of the claim being true. I would be a fool to believe something without evidence or rational support.

21

God: The Abusive Boyfriend

by baltar447 in

jw
friends

http://conversationalatheist.com/general-essays/god-the-abusive-boyfriend/.

ways the christian god is like the most extreme version of an abusive (and possibly psychotic) boyfriend:needs constant praise and makes you feel guilty for just being human.has severe jealousy issues.he lets painful experiences happen to you that he could easily prevent, just to test your devotion to him.claims credit for everything good in your life; claims nothing bad in your life comes from him.threatens you with eternal torture if you ever leave him.he is constantly swearing that he loves you and you need him.

(thanks richard collins).ways to tell if you are in danger of being taken advantage of in a relationship with this abusive god:you are highly defensive of him from even the slightest criticism of his flaws.you talk to him every night, and he never responds yet still expects unwavering devotion.

InterestedOne

I wonder how a person who believes/loves/serves the god of the bible would respond to this. When I was a born-again evangelical, I had no answer for this sort of thing. It's probably one of the reasons I am no longer one.

28

Should we attend our first Birthday Party?

by Flicka in

so we have only been fading for the past few months but already made up our minds that we are completely out.

we never managed to make any friends in our cong but we befriended our neighbours.. so our neighbour invited us to her b-day party in a few weeks time.

she knows that we are/were witnesses and that we are fading.. i don't see a b-day celebration as being wrong anymore.

InterestedOne

Marked.

16

Proof versus stories...how important is it to you?

by Aussie Oz in

jw
friends

many of us have had our say (often) regarding rick and six screens.. i don't know why, but i just need to say this...and it is only my opinion but i think its spot on or i wouldn't write it.. the problem is not ricks story's, goodness knows we all like new story's, gossip, predictions, rumours or whatever regarding the watchtower and jehovah's witnesses.. its the way its done.

we all know there is not tangible proof of many things we like to talk about, we all speculate about what is or will go on.

but we recognize that.

InterestedOne

LOL - "Watchtower-approved apostate website" - So true! It perfectly fits into the picture. Cartoonish like the mags & brochures.

23

The WT, the Millerites and Orson Wells

by Aussie Oz in

it is well known of course that ct russell was a fan of william miller and the mans teachings.

indeed his colaboration with millerite nelson barbour cemented russells love of all that was millerism.. i recall some time ago a thread wherin it was mentioned that fred franz had a library stuffed full of millerite books and so on, and that he himself modeled his own style of address and writing after william miller himself.. with that sort of impact on the doctrines and teaching methods adopted by the society at that time, i am also wondering about orson wells book 1984.. could it be plausable that this book also has its place on the shelves of some locked away private library?

published in 1949, the wt leadership has had plenty of time to study the methods of the novel and try them out.

InterestedOne

cofty wrote: "I must read 1984." Yes, I agree. I read it once in middle school for English class, but I will understand it much better as an adult.

42

"We needed to use the library"... and other wacky Watchtower excuses.

by cedars in

i'm sure we're all familiar with the crazy excuse that the watch tower society leadership came up with to justify their nine year period as a un ngo (non governmental organization).

amazingly, this seems to make perfect sense with watch tower apologists, who don't stop for a moment to ponder the following:.

you don't need to be a un ngo to use the un libraryif it was so innocent for them to hold un ngo status just to use the library, why did they withdraw their status when the issue received media attention?that aside, we are now witnessing the unravelling of fresh scandals to hit the society, most notably:.

InterestedOne

Here is a link where some WT apologists contribute to the toxic chemical discussion. It's so interesting to feel their vibe, even if it is that sick weasly vibe I get from the WT:

http://www.topix.com/forum/religion/jehovahs-witness/TILEP67BCSEEHC8S7

42

"We needed to use the library"... and other wacky Watchtower excuses.

by cedars in

i'm sure we're all familiar with the crazy excuse that the watch tower society leadership came up with to justify their nine year period as a un ngo (non governmental organization).

amazingly, this seems to make perfect sense with watch tower apologists, who don't stop for a moment to ponder the following:.

you don't need to be a un ngo to use the un libraryif it was so innocent for them to hold un ngo status just to use the library, why did they withdraw their status when the issue received media attention?that aside, we are now witnessing the unravelling of fresh scandals to hit the society, most notably:.

InterestedOne

Wow cedars, excellent point about "since when?" Also, thank you for pointing out the 11/22/1980 Awake article condemning burying chemical drums in the ground. I could see a loyal JW saying maybe the writer of that Awake article didn't know about the society's practice of such burial, and the burial might have occurred a long time prior. It would take some detective work to try to figure out what time period the barrels came from.

42

"We needed to use the library"... and other wacky Watchtower excuses.

by cedars in

i'm sure we're all familiar with the crazy excuse that the watch tower society leadership came up with to justify their nine year period as a un ngo (non governmental organization).

amazingly, this seems to make perfect sense with watch tower apologists, who don't stop for a moment to ponder the following:.

you don't need to be a un ngo to use the un libraryif it was so innocent for them to hold un ngo status just to use the library, why did they withdraw their status when the issue received media attention?that aside, we are now witnessing the unravelling of fresh scandals to hit the society, most notably:.

InterestedOne

Regarding the toxic waste, here is what one news article said:

"They found some drums while digging the foundation for one of their residential facilities," Hubicki said. The group immediately reported the drums to the DEC.

The WT might use this to defend themselves by making the following points:

Look how honest we were in reporting when we discovered the barrels.
We are in a new era of better understanding the environment and more comprehensive regulations. We are doing our part to conform to a new era of cleaner practices.

65

The Science Thread

by EntirelyPossible in

i am starting this thread because so many others have taken such interesting turns and, on some ocassions, been threadjacked, sometimes by me.

i hesitate to post it in "personal experiences" because it is most certainly not a personal experience, but i don't know what would be a better area.. the purpose here is to clear up a lot of confusion about what science and the scientific method are and are not.

science is a method for investigating observations, gaining knowledge, correcting knowledge.

InterestedOne

Here's something important about falsifiability. It has to do with how a statement is worded. For example, the claim "white swans exist" is not falsifiable. There is no possible counterexample - you cannot demonstrate that white swans do not exist.

On the other hand, consider the claim "white swans do not exist." This is falsifiable because all you need to do is demonstrate one example of a white swan to disprove the claim.

65

The Science Thread

by EntirelyPossible in

i am starting this thread because so many others have taken such interesting turns and, on some ocassions, been threadjacked, sometimes by me.

i hesitate to post it in "personal experiences" because it is most certainly not a personal experience, but i don't know what would be a better area.. the purpose here is to clear up a lot of confusion about what science and the scientific method are and are not.

science is a method for investigating observations, gaining knowledge, correcting knowledge.

InterestedOne

As you can see from that wiki article though, the concept of falsifiability as well as others in the philosophy of science can get pretty deep. The scientific method is something many great minds have been contributing to. I like how scientists speak of "rolling up their sleeves and getting to work." Still, there are plenty of introductory articles on the basics of the scientific method and how it applies to daily life.