Posts by kes152

63

A Question To All on this Board

by kes152 in

jw
friends

hello,.

i have been reading this board for some time and would like to ask: why you come here and post?

what do you all hope to accomplish by being here?.

kes152

Hello Everyone,

I enjoyed reading your comments, some were quite insightful/touching while others were quite funny. :) I hope I didn't offend anyone by my first post in asking the question I did; that was not my intention. Honestly, when I was looking through the board, I became frustrated because there were a lot of bible debates and such going on. It seemed as if the board was getting away from the support aspect of helping exJWs. I felt sad when I saw some of the debates and although I also am guilty of doing this myself, I do not wish to continue to do it. When I asked the question, I guess I was also wondering if anyone else felt the same way. I'm not sure what the real purpose of this board is, but it seems like it was geared towards supporting exJWs coming out of the WT as opposed to debating theology. It is my hope that this board will be less focused on debates and more focused on supporting those having trouble coming out. When I first came out, I often felt lost, confused, and unsure about what to do. Many people use the internet to seek sources of support and guidance. I would hate for them to run across this site, searching for supprt, but findng instead rampant debating over religious issues. I also hope there are others who also feel the same way.

63

A Question To All on this Board

by kes152 in

jw
friends

hello,.

i have been reading this board for some time and would like to ask: why you come here and post?

what do you all hope to accomplish by being here?.

kes152

Hello,

I have been reading this board for some time and would like to ask: Why you come here and post? What do you all hope to accomplish by being here?

25

Which Translation of the Bible would you say is most accurate?

by researcher in

which translation of the bible would you say is most accurate and was not influenced by any 'religious group' in the translation?

kes152

Greetings researcher,

May the GREATEST of peace be with you.

There is, in truth, no accurate translation of the Bible that has not been influenced in some way or form by religious beliefs. The reason this is, researcher, is because when men translate words, they do so in such a way that agrees with their own understanding. Since religion carries so much power, not only now but also especially in the past, certain texts that spoke against religion would cause great turmoil in the accepted authority of the church. It is for this reason, and others, that every Bible that has been translated has in some way been influenced by the beliefs of the translators.

Men love to be right, researcher, and because many of the scriptures (the ones actually coming from God) do not feed into the pride of men; men have a GREAT deal of trouble reading and/or accepting anything that goes contrary to their beliefs. Men love to be right, and when this feeling of theirs is "threatened," they become desperate and perhaps irrational and fight to save their pride up to and including, altering the texts themselves (Jeremiah 8:8).

Not everything in the Bible is inspired, researcher. The Bible was put together by men who were not guided by the Spirit of God and they decided for themselves what "they" considered was inspired and what was not. All scripture is indeed inspired of God, but not all that is in the Bible are scripture. The Bible contains scripture (some altered, some unaltered), letters, personal opinions, history, testimonies (some false, others true), songs, etc.

The only way one can truly be able to discern the spirit of truth from the spirit of error in the Bible is for one to 'grow' in spirit and to have the perceptive powers of their SPIRIT "trained" to be able to distinguish between right and wrong. The way your perceptive powers are trained is by giving up many fleshly desires and ways of thinking and rather than doing what is physically comfortable, do what is beneficial for the SPIRIT and what is best for the LIFE of the SOUL. One must cease from living for themselves and do what is best for others. Many things of the spirit are foolishness to the flesh and one of the things that people must do that is very much considered "foolish" to the flesh is to forgive others and love others regardless of whether they love you. It means the doing of good to someone KNOWING you will profit nothing from it. It also means taking the lower seat and giving up things that others do not have to give up and always watching yourself although others do not watch themselves. It requires much discipline (which is hurtful to the flesh) and much time, for no one can 'change' overnight. It means being laughed at and mocked at by others for doing the right thing even if others do not notice it. It is a hard life for the flesh, especially in the beginning, and very diffult to do. But in time the flesh DOES become somewhat acclimated and the battle will not continue to be exasperating. It is a constant watch and a constant work. Many bad things will come out of you in the beginning, and many battles of the flesh await you, yet after your persistence, your spirit will get stronger and stronger (while your flesh gets weaker and weaker) and as you "grow," things you did not originally discern in the Bible you will be able to see. You will see many false beliefs that the world, as a whole, has accepted as truth and even in the smallest of beliefs, you will see the great harm it has caused.

Since many men will not do this, many are thus slaves to the Bible and slaves to what they believe. Men are also prone to badness and taking the 'easy, physically comfortable way out' and these very tendencies are the reason why so many are misled and cannot discern the truth from the lie in the Bible. Men like to be 'told' what to believe; they do not like to do the work themselves. Men do not like to search for answers and 'test' the things they are told, because their flesh doesn't want to. It finds it a cumbersome and grueling process and it rathers to be told the answer or use leverage and get other people to do the work for it. And in doing so, it has brought itself and others into error and confusion.

8

The Bible and divine revelation

by Narkissos in

in two recent threads eduardo (oroborus21) makes the following assertion:the bible is not itself the revelation about god to mankind.

the bible is a record of the revelation about god to mankind.. .

i find this nuance interesting, although problematic imo, and i think it might be worth its own thread (i hope eduardo doesn't mind).. what do you think?

kes152

Greetings to you all,

May peace be with all of you.

The Bible is not a revelation of God to mankind nor is it a record of the revelation of God to mankind. In truth, the Bible is a compilation of books that contain writings that are not from the spirit of God and writings that are from the spirit of God. All 'scripture' are writings that were written "in spirit" and directed by the Spirit to be written down as a 'witness' or 'testimony' to that which has occured in spirit.

Unfortunately, for many who believe contrary, the Bible is not the inspired Word of God and those who believe such have been enslaved to the Bible and to their religion who has told them such and thus because of their devotion to the Bible, have been misled from the Truth.. from the Christ. One cannot in any way know the Christ by reading the Bible.. for even the 'misled' read the Bible. The Bible in itself is a 'golden calf' that have been worshipped by many and have misled many into the spirit of error. One cannot know the truth by knowing the Bible. For the Bible contains true things, false things, distorted accounts, and false testimonies that those who are 'untrained' and think that all that was written in it was from God.. will be misled and confused by such inconsistencies and led away from the truth. In order for ones to be able to properly distinguish the 'truth' from the 'lie' and discern what in the Bible is "from the Spirit" and that which is not from the Spirit, one would need to be trained and built up in the spirit by God. Such training cannot be received from reading the Bible, but only by going to the One who is the Word of God and receiving such training from Him. By means of him and following closely to him in such training (such training is very uncomfortable to the flesh), ones can acquire the 'skill' and the means to strengthen their 'perceptive powers' of the spirit to be able to distinguish between all that is from 'the spirit of truth' and all that is from the 'spirit of error,' regardless of where such is written.

Ones who are 'slaves' to the Bible are consequently slaves to the consistencies and inconsistencies of the Bible and being a slave of inconsistencies, causes ones to fall away from the truth and give 'ear' to the lie.

11

What's Your Take on This Scripture? "The righteious themselves

by adelmaal in

..will possess the earth and they will reside forever upon it" (ps.

37:29 nwt sorry, that's the only bible i have at work .

i don't know what i believe in this area... earthly hope?

kes152

Dearest ade, May peace be with you. The earthly hope that Jehovah's Witnesses teach is not the true hope that God has called out to all mankind. In Psalms 37:29 it is true that "The righteous themselves will possess the earth, And they will reside forever upon it." Here is how it will happen: In Revelation 2:7 Jesus through holy spirit says, "Let the one who has an ear hear what the spirit says to the congregations: To him that conquers I will grant to eat of the tree of life, which is in the paradise of God.?" Here Jesus offers to anyone who conquers that they may eat of the tree of life which is in the Paradise of God. Now in Revelation 22:14 John hears, "Happy are those who wash their robes, that the authority [to go] to the trees of life may be theirs and that they may gain entrance into the city by its gates." Those who have 'washed their robes' have the authority to enter the heavenly city by its gates and eat of the tree of life that is in the Paradise of God. Now as regards this holy city, John says, "I saw also the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God and prepared as a bride adorned for her husband." This is the 'home' that God has prepared for us. It is the holy city, New Jerusalem, that will come down out of heaven from God. All those who have 'washed their robes' and made them white in the blood of the Lamb are "righteous." And to them it will be granted authority to enter the heavenly city by its gates. Then... the heavenly city, New Jerusalem, will "come down OUT of heaven" and it will 'reside FOREVER upon the earth.' And in this way "the righteous themselves will possess the earth" and they will reside forever upon it and find exquisite DELIGHT in the abundance of peace. Those "outside" the city will be the 'dogs and those who practice spiritism and the fornicators and the murderers, etc.' (Revelation 22:15)

19

Not part of the world

by sun_dae in

what is actually meant by "not part of the world".

jws claim they are no part of the world.

in joining here, am i guilty of being a "part of this world"?

kes152

Dearest SecretA, May you have peace. You said: "we are no part of it meaning we don't associate with out schoolmates and workmates. We talk with them but when it comes to being friends with them that's a no no. " Do you honestly believe that is what Jesus meant when he was telling his Father that he and his disciples were no part of the world? Do you really think that while he was praying to his Father on the night he was to be betrayed he was telling his Father that his disciples don't "associate with schoolmates and workmates and are not friends with them?" Jesus taught his disciples to LOVE their schoolmates and workmates.. for he taught them to love all peoples. He gave an illustration about the Samaritan who took care of the Jew who was beat up. Now if you remember... the Jews had DISFELLOWSHIPPED the Samaritans for 'apostasy' (John 4:9). This is also why the disciples as well as the woman were 'bothered' when they saw their Master talking to a "disfellowshipped woman".. a Samaritan (John 4:9, 27). Yet Jesus showed... by example.. how to truly LOVE your neighbor and not 'outcast' others like the world does (John 9:34). Jesus had many friends.. many loved ones.. and those, who although were sinners, invited him to be their friend or guest; he accepted. If we are not of the world we would have great love for all people, whether they are in religion or not, whether they are an enemy or not. It is by LOVE that we, who belong to the Christ, are separated from the world. If we have love "among ourselves".. all will know that we are his disciples. If we have that SAME love also for people in the world, even those who hate us.. all will know that we are not of the world.

54

I can't get to grips with being shunned

by chuckyy in

my wife and i have been disassociated for about 2 months now.

every day in our small town we are being shunned by former friends.

one in particular annoyed me today.

kes152

Dearest chuckyy,

May you have peace.

The best way to deal with your anger is to confess it. Be open and honest with yourself and genuinely admit to yourself that you are still angry. Also admit to yourself that you are angry because you are hurt and one of the ways that you personally handle your pain is with anger. Being disfellowshipped and the way you are being treated by former members is not the only hurt you experience. There are also other things in your life that have hurt you deeply and such pain has caused you to 'lash out' on many occasions. you should take some time and look at these. These things are very hurtful to you and you would want to grieve, but your anger prevents you from grieving. you are a very hurt man and you don't like to be shunned. You hate being ignored and you 'desire' the love that your friends used to give you.. but because they have stopped and are now ignoring you.. you have been hurt very deeply and you miss them very much.

Don't hide these things from yourself but be honest to yourself about them. There is no reason to hide, we all feel this way. Some of us to not 'handle' it correctly and subsequently make matters worse for ourselves. I know you do not wish for this to happen to you, so it is best for you to look at yourself and learn to accept yourself for who you 'really' are. Men like to think they are strong and can handle many things.. but the truth is they are weak and sensitive. When you come to realize this, and understand that you DO in fact... HAVE feelings.. and that your feelings DO in fact... get HURT.. and that you do in fact... want kindness.. you will grow and become a stronger person. Don't think that you can 'shake' this off and 'toughen it out' as many will tell you because this is a 'healing' time for you. If you desire to be healed, you must look at your pain. When you begin to 'accept' yourself, you can then learn to 'accept' others.. even those who shunned you. This will not happen for you overnight.. but it will happen for you if you allow it to and you want it to. Then, as you grow you will have more meaningful relationships and your happiness will be greatly increased. You must be patient with yourself and don't immediately seek better relationships now. Look at your pain first and these things. Then, as you get better, you will be able to 'handle' better relationships.

8

Have any of you experienced a spiritual 'dead end'?

by truth_about_the_truth in

let's face it...most of us were or still are a part of this org.

because we felt a need to bring some meaning or purpose into our lives.. at the beginning there are lot of things that catch our attention, seem to make sense and feel ourselves progressing as individuals.. upon studying, meditating, pioneering, reaching out for privileges, etc.

(doing everything the society pushes).

kes152

Greetings truth,

May you have peace.

Everyone who joins the organization of Jehovah's witnesses will always experience a spiritual 'dead end.' The reason this is because Jehovah's witnesses do not have the truth, nor do they have the One by means of whom truth comes from. They do not know him, and they do not know his Father either. When witnesses of Jehovah are baptized in the organization, they do not receive the free gift of holy spirit. Instead they receive more 'books' and more 'meeting attendance' requirements and their service in the door to door work should increase.

The problem with this is.. none of these things are what what Christ did for those who followed him. Anyone, including Jehovah's witnesses, who reads the Bible knows this; but rarely will anyone openly talk about it for fear they have been misled into the "wrong religion." When the Christ was raised from the dead, he gave to those who loved him the free gift of holy spirit. Holy spirit came upon them and brought peace to them such that thier spirits became 'stronger' and more peaceful. Then, as the Father had sent him forth, he also sent them forth with the free gift of holy spirit to give to anyone asking, anyone seeking, anyone wishing, anyone knocking (John 20:19-23). It was by means of the holy spirit that they had a real spirituality and through such spirit their spirits bore fruit of love, joy, peace, long-suffering, goodness, kindness, faith, and self-control. Such became so fulfilling and so rewarding that they went out and shared this free gift with others... forgiving the sins of others, releasing ones from bondage to sin and sicknesses, raising the dead ones, making the weak ones strong, and letting them know that all these things were made possible by the name of the Son of God who was raised from the dead.

The witnesses as well as the rest of religion does not 'preach' this way, neither do they have the free gift of holy spirit. That is why they are a "religion" and that is why they take money from their members under the guise of serving God only to use such money to pay wages that they think they deserve for the work they do. They do not know him who is in the heavens and because they do not know him; all those who join religion will always come to a spiritual dead end. All who come to the Christ and receive from him the free gift of holy spirit and come to know him will always "grow" in their spirituality as often and as fast as they 'wish it.' Christ has no need for anyone's money, anyone's "attendance" nor anyone's appearance. He has all things and it is actually "he" who wants to give to US. He would like for us to learn from him.. and give what he gives to us... to others. no religion, no building, no preachers.. just you and him.

19

Not part of the world

by sun_dae in

what is actually meant by "not part of the world".

jws claim they are no part of the world.

in joining here, am i guilty of being a "part of this world"?

kes152

Dearest sun_dae,

May you have peace.

Jehovah's witness will always claim they are no part of the world, but truthfully, they are very much part of the world. They look at things on the "outside" saying, "we do this.. and this.. and this.. and this.." and they believe that by their "works" they show themselves not to be part of the world. The truth is, one is not part of the world based on what they do on the outside, but rather how they are on the INSIDE.

In Luke 11:37, 38 it says, "When he had spoken this, a Pharisee requested him to dine with him. So he went in and reclined at the table. However, the Pharisee was surprised at seeing that he did not first wash before the dinner."

Here the Pharisee was looking at the "outside." Jesus consequently said to him: ?Now you Pharisees, you cleanse the outside of the cup and dish, but the inside of you is full of plunder and wickedness." (Luke 11:39) Then he goes on to say, " He that made the outside made also the inside, did he not? Nevertheless, give as gifts of mercy the things that are inside, and, look! all [other] things are clean about you." (Luke 11:40-41) If they would be 'honest' and give gifts of MERCY... from the heart... then all things on the outside would likewise be clean about them on the inside. Unfortunately, many Pharisees did not believe that by doing the simple "little" things and by being honest and caring would be enough for them to 'look righteous' before men. They loved looking righteous by being wicked "in secret" so that they can at least "stand out" from the rest of the world and thus appear to be "no part of the world." This however, is not true and the Christ made this manifest to them many times. This is one of the reasons they hated him so much and desired to kill him, because he was exposing them for the frauds that they were.

Jesus said if any one of us desires to be 'no part of the world' we should love one another even as he has loved us. If we are kind to our neighbors and love our brothers and even have great love for our enemies and do kindness to them, it is by our love... that we are no part of the world. For if we LOVE our neighbors and do kindness to them we are doing a 'great' work. For the world is only fond of what is their own. If you love even those who are NOT of your own.. then you really are no part of the world. The witnesses "claim" to love their neighbors, but notice the great lack of love and even HATE they have for their "former members." They hate ones whom they deem as 'apostates' and avoid them on the streets. However, Jesus said "if you greet your brothers only, what extraordinary thing are you doing? Are not also the people of the nations doing the same thing?" (Matthew 5:47, 48) Witnesses will greet other witnesses (their brothers) but say NO greeting to their 'former brothers.' Thus, they are no different from the world. If we greet all, even those who make themselves our enemy, we are striving to become away from the world.

Jehovah's witnesses are not the only ones who fail in this. All religion has fallen victim to this lack of love and that is why they all are part of the world. If ones desire to be no part of the world, they must come to the Christ who can heal them and if they allow him... take the world OUT of them.

4

MarkAnthony Re: Becoming a witness...

by kes152 in

jw
friends

greetings to you, mark, may you have peace.. before you decide to become a witness, dear brother, may i share this with you perhaps for your consideration.. you seem to have a 'desire' for truth which has led you to consider becoming one of jehovah's witnesses.

if this is true, i would like to share the follwonig with you and if you have a bible... you may look them up and 'listen' to what the spirit says to you as you read them:.

" (john 14:6).

kes152

Greetings to you, Mark, may you have peace.

Before you decide to become a witness, dear brother, may I share this with you perhaps for your consideration.

You seem to have a 'desire' for truth which has led you to consider becoming one of Jehovah's witnesses. If this is true, I would like to share the follwonig with you and if you have a Bible... you may look them up and 'listen' to what the Spirit says to you as you read them:

He says, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no man can come to the Father except through me." (John 14:6)

"He that has seen me has seen the Father." (John 14:9)

If you believe in him, and you come to "see" him.. you will by means of him see the Father also.

?If you love me, you will observe my commandments; and I will request the Father and he will give you another helper to be with you forever, the spirit of the truth, which the world cannot receive, because it neither beholds him nor knows him. You know him, because he remains with you and he shall be in you." (John 14:15-17)

If it is your 'desire' to come to know 'him'.. he will send to you another "helper" to be with you forever... the spirit of the truth. Therefore, when you receive this spirit, what need will you have of any religion when you have the spirit of the truth with you FOREVER?

"I am the bread of life. He that comes to me will not get hungry at all, and he that exercises faith in me will never get thirsty at all. " (John 6:35)

If you decide to 'come' to him, you will not go hungry and if you put faith in 'him'.. you will not get thirsty. He will take care of you.

He says, " Look, I am standing at the door and knocking. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come into his [house] and take the evening meal with him and he with me. " (Revelation 3:20)

If you 'believe' this and would like for him to come to you.. pray and ask for him to come 'knock' on your door.. and when he does and you open the door, he will come in and take the supper with you and you with him. If you would really 'like' to have this, you may ask it of him and he will come. If you 'lack' the faith that he will come, you may ask for such faith to be increased to you and he will come and sup with you.

In this way.. if you so desire it... you may avoid religion and come to the TRUE God by coming to his Son and coming to 'know' him and then by means of him.. coming to be 'known' by his Father in the heavens. You may have this if you desire this to be so.