Quendi

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Posts by Quendi

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  19

  Happy Solstice !

  by talesin in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  a day of celebration -- happy solstice to all ,,, especially any pagan/wicca on the board!.

  http://www.nectareal.com/pagan-wicca-summer-solstice-is-here/.

  i miss my friends who have moved away,,, no one to celebrate with anymore.

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  Quendi

  For me, the real day to celebrate the Solstice is 24 June, what the ancients called "Midsummer's Day". While the June Solstice does indeed fall on the twenty-first, the sun rises over that same spot for four consecutive days, the twenty-first through the twenty-fourth. Then, on 25 June, the sun starts moving south again and the days begin to progressively grow shorter. So many ancient tribes had their big celebration on the twenty-fourth with their festivals, midsummer bonfires, and the like. The days continue to shorten until 24 December. For the ancients, the following day was when they could see the amount of daylight lengthening again. Most of us know how that fact figures into the celebration held on 25 December.

  The word "solstice" is derived from the Latin language and basically means "sun stands still". For four days--21-24 June and 21-24 December--the sun will rise over the same spot before reversing direction and moving either south or north and thus either shortening or lengthening the days. For our ancestors, marking these times was a matter of life and death as it told them how to figure their sowing, harvesting, and hunting cycles and rituals. The equinoxes were also noted, and so 20 March and 22/23 September also figured prominently in the lives of many ancient tribes and nations.

  It's rather unfortunate that modern society ignores these important days and others as well. I think it is wonderful to celebrate and keep track of yearly cycles and try to attune our lives to them. I'm happy there are some of us on this board who do so. While I won't make a bonfire on Friday and dance around it, I hope to do something special to observe the occasion.

  Quendi
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  27

  JW's are so hot on their views being respected but they do not respect anyone elses!

  by highdose in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  jw's face a tide of "no"s and "not interested"s everytime they go banging on the doors, surely it would have occurred to them by now that the vast majority of the public don't want to know and don't want them at their doors.

  but do they acknowledge or listen to this?

  regardless of wether they have priviously been told not to call or not still they come.. they claim that its because jesus has comanded them to do so.

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  Quendi

  I am very glad we are having this discussion. I want to thank Cherrypye and LongHairGal who have responded directly to my first post on this thread. I am not in disagreement with anyone. I only wanted to remind all of us that there are different angles to this question. I am reminded of the adage that there are three sides to every story: your side, my side, and the true side.

  I agree that most Witnesses are rather obtuse when it comes to observing etiquette and courtesy in the field ministry. They don't pay attention to their surroundings, either. So they will march right past clearly posted signs that should tell them not to call on this house or even leave any literature behind. Many don't care about the people in the territory either. They engage in the field ministry because it is required and not because they really care about the people they are preaching to.

  I don't want any of us to become like them. While some Witnesses are sincere and have true concern and even love for their neighbors, many, if not most, are apathetic, or even worse, self-righteous to a fault like Cherrypye's mother-in-law. Well, as Jesus said of the hypocritical Pharisees of his day, "Let them be." Having escaped from the clutches of this cult, we should know better than to imitate its attitudes. For my part, if and when Jehovah's Witnesses ever knock on my door, they will be welcome to come in and talk. I'm sure they will hastily take their leave once they learn I am disfellowshipped and have no intention of returning. But I hope that if we do talk, there can be a frank and respectful exchange of views. If there is, so much the better. If there isn't, the fault will rest with them, but my conscience will be clear.

  Quendi
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  27

  JW's are so hot on their views being respected but they do not respect anyone elses!

  by highdose in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  jw's face a tide of "no"s and "not interested"s everytime they go banging on the doors, surely it would have occurred to them by now that the vast majority of the public don't want to know and don't want them at their doors.

  but do they acknowledge or listen to this?

  regardless of wether they have priviously been told not to call or not still they come.. they claim that its because jesus has comanded them to do so.

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  Quendi

  I think it is important to retain some perspective here. I can't speak for the law elsewhere, but in the United States, Jehovah's Witnesses have the right to call uninvited at people's homes and places of business. This is a right guaranteed by the First Amendment to the American Constitution. It seems to me that some of us have forgotten this. That same First Amendment also guarantees the right of householders and business owners to refuse to listen to these callers as well as to request that they not be called upon again. How difficult is that to do?

  I was one of those Witnesses who always respected "No Jehovah's Witnesses", "No Trespassing" and "No Soliciting" signs posted on people's property. I felt that I could always take note of the address and write a letter to the householder if I really wanted to contact him or her. That was far less intrusive, and was a way of genuinely respecting the person's demand for privacy. I'm aware that many Witnesses have no idea how to handle these demands in written form. They have been trained to go to the door anyway because the work they are involved in is a "life-saving" one. And many Witnesses I worked with were moved by genuine concern for their neighbors.

  For those of us who have left the organization and have no intention of returning, we want to remember the mindset we had when we were zealous members. If we do that, we won't be so quick to condemn those who call upon us. It costs nothing to politely and firmly let these callers know that we are no longer interested in the message and request that our addresses be placed upon the "Do Not Call" list that every congregation maintains.

  Do Jehovah's Witnesses abuse their First Amendment rights? I don't doubt that some do. There are those who won't take "No" for an answer and leave when they hear it. They can be intrusive, rude, annoying, and persistent to the last degree. That doesn't mean that we should be the same. There are others who actually love the field service (I was one of those) and make every effort to share the "good news" with everyone they meet in the door-to-door work.

  One last thing to remember is the fact that Jehovah's Witnesses have fought for and strengthened the cause of civil liberties in many countries due to their work. And while it is sad that they don't practice what they preach in this regard inside the organization, many of us have benefited from their dogged persistence in exercising their rights to free speech and keeping government out of the practice of religion. It seems to me that tolerating the relatively minor nuisance of their calling on our homes is a very small price to pay for keeping our civil rights.

  Quendi
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  6

  The "Ten Toes"

  by Quendi in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i talked to my witness friend who attended the district convention over the weekend about the program.

  we have been in constant and close communication during these six years that have passed since my disfellowshipping.

  he enjoyed the program.

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  Quendi

  I think the only reason the Society didn't rail against "apostate" social networks or websites is that by drawing attention to them many Witnesses would want to see what the fuss is all about. And if they do that then that would create more problems for the WTS than it would solve. It is the same approach the organization takes with books like Crisis of Conscience, In Search of Christian Freedom, The Gentile Times Reconsidered, etc. If these things are never mentioned or given attention, the rank-and-file may not hear of them at all.

  As for the ten toes "flip flop", I think Mad Sweeney is right to say the organization is counting on very few people doing the research to see this is no new development but merely a reembracing of an older position. Besides, the whole idea is not to share anything informative or enlightening from the Scriptures anymore. The goal is to keep the membership drinking the kool-aid and coming back for more.

  Quendi
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  6

  The "Ten Toes"

  by Quendi in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i talked to my witness friend who attended the district convention over the weekend about the program.

  we have been in constant and close communication during these six years that have passed since my disfellowshipping.

  he enjoyed the program.

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  Quendi

  Hello All,

  I talked to my Witness friend who attended the district convention over the weekend about the program. We have been in constant and close communication during these six years that have passed since my disfellowshipping. He enjoyed the program. I expected him to say that. I asked what stood out to him. He said the talk about social networks was quite interesting. The speaker chose not to rail against how "evil" these things are, although he did mention the dangers of "sexting". Instead, he took the high road, telling the delegates that they should use caution in disclosing information on them. Anything put out into cyberspace cannot be taken back, so social network users should be circumspect about what they choose to reveal about themselves, their families, their friends, and other associates. I don't know if this topic was handled in this fashion at other district conventions, but this approach was a refreshing change. It is one I have always advocated.

  Then I asked him about the "ten toes" of the image in Daniel chapter 4 since I knew the Sunday afternoon talk would deal with that. His understanding is that the toes themselves were not particularly significant. Rather, the emphasis was put on the fragile mix of iron and clay. The Society thinks this indicates the politcal nature of the Anglo-American world power. It doesn't behave in as dictatorial a fashion as the Roman Empire did because it is constrained by the nature of the governments that control it. Evidently, a democratic system operates in a less harsh manner than an autocratic one. At least that is the understanding my friend got from the speaker's words.

  As for when the stone will strike the image and destroy it, the Society still maintains this will happen in the near future. Well, no surprise there. However, my friend said that the audience was told that the Anglo-American world power will work in close concert with the United Nations to destroy "false religion" and this development would take place very soon. Once again, everyone was warned to stay alert and keep on the watch for this momentous event. I thought it interesting that my friend didn't sound very excited about the talk. Maybe he is beginning to tire of the cry of "Wolf!" that he has been hearing for many years now. He does want to further discussion about the talk, however, and I am hoping this will give me an opportunity to turn his mind in a different direction.

  Quendi
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  23

  So It Begins...

  by TimothyT in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  all i can say is lol!!!.

  so... i have been outed... im gay, and at least one elder now knows!.

  while i was at bingo tonight with jack i recieved a call from him.

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  Quendi

  TimothyT:

  They can disfellowship you in absentia, but only if they have proof of your "gross sin". As bad as the WTS is about handling matters in a way that is fair and just, they do adhere to a few rules. So they will look for testimony from someone who will accuse you of sin. If they cannot find any, then more than likely they will let the matter drop. As of now, they cannot disfellowship anyone who refuses to appear before a judicial committee without corroborating testimony from other people.

  But Honesty is right to say they have only the power you give them. Continue your course of refusing to engage in any kind of communication with them. Your silence will tell them they are wasting their time. Besides, they are not really concerned with your welfare no matter what they say to the contrary. They only want to 'keep the congregation clean', and that means dissidents like yourself are considered a real danger and so should be shunned. If you never show up at the Hall again, they would probably be quite happy. My advice to you is the same others are giving you: Enjoy your life and put as much distance between you and this cult as possible.

  Quendi
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  5

  New World Translation - regular edition PDF

  by Caminante in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  while browsing on jw.org, i suddenly spotted a new section under digital publications: bible!

  as of today, the english edition of the softcover regular new world translation of the holy scriptures (bi12-e) is available in one full 15 mb genuine pdf file, converted from the original meps-composed postscript files!

  take a look at it here: http://www.jw.org/index.html?option=qryqcsvrglvlyr.

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  Quendi

  I am glad to see the New World Translation available as a pdf file. I have downloaded it onto my computer's hard drive and will also transfer it to my NOOK e-Reader. While the NWT is not perfect, on the whole I regard it as a worthwhile rendering of the Scriptures into contemporary English. I own a number of other Bible translations, however. I think it is important for the serious Bible reader and student to examine different renderings to better understand what the original languages actually say. I'm not in a position yet to study koine Greek, Hebrew, or Aramaic, so I have to depend on the work of others. So having the Bible on my e-Reader will make it even easier to carry with me and read in different places. We have certainly come a long way from the days of unwieldy scrolls and codices!

  Quendi
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  14

  Did I throw these guys under the bus?

  by burnedout in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  over a year ago i knew i had to resign my position as elder because of many reasons.

  i was the youngest elder being 40ish... and there had already been some resistance to my wanting to cut back on the many responsiblities i had.

  i knew that to make it easier for me to resign, there had to be some replacement.

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  Quendi

  Your experience, burnedout, proves one thing. The elder arrangement certainly does not have divine approval and those who serve in it are not appointed by holy spirit. Those who believe otherwise are only deceiving themselves.

  Quendi
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  123

  An Open letter to the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses (Elders/ Ex-Elders)

  by stuckinamovement in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  if you are an elder or an ex-elder please add a comment.

  i hope that the governing body will see this.

  it is too bad it has to be on an anonymous forum.

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  Quendi

  I'm joining this discussion way late, but I had to give my support to SIAM and others in his position. At the very least, writing a letter like this will address the issues of conscience many have. Unfortunately, the Governing Body is totally immune to such appeals. These men are truly wolves in sheep's covering who have no intention of serving others but only to be served themselves. Well, they will reap what they sow.

  Quendi
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  62

  Br. Loesch - great tribulation, king of the north, generation overlap, new scrolls and more...

  by Bonnie_Clyde in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  just got this email...... .

  subject: zone report germany date: 5/17/11 2:02:57 am.

  we thought we would share one of our interesting experiences with you.

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  Quendi

  Journey-on: You're absolutely right about the effect the organization's teachings had on all of us. My first contact with Jehovah's Witnesses was back in 1968 when I was a boy of only twelve. I got baptized eight years later in 1976 after the disappointment of 1975 but during a time when enthusiasm was still great and most of us were confident that the End would surely come within a few short years.

  I think for me, as it was for many others, the thought never occurred that the Governing Body was either a) deliberately misleading the rank-and-file, or b) misled themselves as to their own understanding of the Bible, or even c) both of the foregoing. They were so good at pointing out the errors of other religions and churches that they made themselves look as pure as the driven snow in comparison. So I put my utmost faith and confidence in them, never wanting to believe that I was being hoodwinked. It wasn't until the November 1, 1995 Watchtower study on the meaning of a generation that the first seeds of doubt were sown.

  Even then, it took years more for me to make up my mind to leave. An elder whom I had known for a long time and who had served as a Gilead missionary and a circuit overseer, began to study on his own. He persuaded me to assist him in his research and gradually I began to draw away from the Society. But it took my being disfellowshipped and subsequent treatment at the hands of my judicial committee to make me resolve to leave. The elder who had put me on a different spiritual path was himself disfellowshipped for apostasy in absentia, on orders from Brooklyn. That strengthened my resolve to stay out; and it was finalized when my judicial committee made embracing the WTS as God's one, only, and exclusive organization as the condition for my reinstatement.

  It has been a long, arduous journey, but one I have not regretted and which I am still on. You are right, my friend, to say that while I was inside the "spiritual paradise", I was "high" on the new and exciting things I was being taught. Everything was geared to keep me wanting more: the meetings, the conventions, and even much of the association I enjoyed. I am working now to fill the void created by my departure, and JWN is one of the tools I am using to do this. I am continuing my independent Bible studies and am enjoying them very much. But I am especially happy to have recovered two things the WTS had taken away from me: my free will and power of reason. Those are God-given gifts that we should never surrender, and having regained them I am determined to hold on with all my strength. My friends, I wish the same for all of you.

  Quendi