the jehovah`s witnesses have been saying this for decades .do you beleive it to be true ?
/ false ?.
what do the facts show.
Is the phrase “spiritual paradise” in current usage among Jehovah’s Witnesses anymore? Or has it gone the way of such expressions as “pure language”, “theocracy” and other words which characterized the exclusivity the WTS wanted its followers to believe they possessed? Whatever the case, we all know that “spiritual police state” more accurately describes the conditions inside the cult now.
Quendi
this subject came up with a friend of mine on facebook the other day.
he was never officially baptized as a witness and i believe he is now a born again christian.. does crooklyn consider someone an 'apostate' if you were never actually a full-fledged member but ended up leaving?
or are you just considered 'bad association'??
Two years ago, I got together with a man who had been my best friend. We had not seen each other in six years prior to this and I was hoping for a joyful reunion. What I initially got, however, were accusations of apostasy from his mother whom I also counted as a close friend. The reason? I told both of them that I was no longer seeking reinstatement because I had become convinced that the WTS was not “God’s organization.”
Their initial reaction was that of anger, but as we talked that gave way to the “palpable fear” BOTR has noted. It tore at my heart to see two people whom I deeply loved refuse to even consider the points I raised because of that. What made the situation even stranger from my perspective was the fact that my friend was disfellowshipped himself. However, he wanted to be reinstated and I suppose my stance was one he could not embrace.
The fear he suffered was especially apparent when I challenged him to find the number 2520 anywhere in the Bible to support the WTS belief of the length of the Gentile Times. The other mind-shaking dare I posed was to show where the judicial committee arrangement was spelled out or even outlined in the New Testament. Naturally, he was unable to pass either test.
We have not spoken to each other since then despite efforts on my part to keep in touch. Ah well! I have only faint hope that my words will help him break free but I can take some satisfaction in the fact that I tried my best to help him.
Quendi
the very first legal governing body of (jehovah's witnesses) bible students were seven persons which included pastor c.t.russell, his wife maria, and his controversial ward, rose ball.. five men and two women.
these seven persons were also the directors of the watchtower bible and tract society.
this group set policies and practices for the rest of the religious followers of pastor russell.
Many thanks for this excellent synopsis of the history of the Governing Body, Terry. Compared to the whitewash version the WTS has published in different books, it is a refreshing read. I will be recommending it to my other friends and correspondents.
Quendi
watch out for armageddon it is going to be numbing to human sensibilities:.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=micq4iqrklm.
i guess he's thinkin jehovah's gonna roast them like a hot dogs burned to a charred ruination over a fire.
Considering the background, lack of education and contact with reality which characterizes the Governing Body as a whole and Anthony Morris in particular, none of us should be surprised by this kind of outrageous talk.
Quendi
this is rough draft of a letter that i was thinking of sending to various human rights organizations.
i am interested in your thoughts.
i will not include anyone's website without their permission.
One change I would suggest is to say that members are strongly discouraged from pursuing higher education rather than not allowed to have one. The WTS has never imposed an outright ban on this (indeed the Society has on rare occasions paid for headquarters staff’s college educations) and nobody who has earned a college degree has ever been disfellowshipped. You might say that higher education has been condemned, denounced and ridiculed both orally and in print by WTS leaders and in that way most publishers conclude that they should not think about getting it for themselves.
Otherwise, DATA-DOG, you have written an excellent letter. The human rights abuses the WTS has practiced and perpetuated should be exposed. I wish you every success in this project. Please keep us informed.
Quendi
in the october 1919 golden age magazine on page 8 under "negro education in cincinnati" said the following " a wise segregation is probably an advantage to all concerned" the article is about a school for african americans.
my computer would not let me cut and paste the article here for some reason.
can someone help me and paste the article.
bttt
another thread on this board recalled to my mind the various thoughts and ideas in this organization that are still very prevelant among many.. .
for instance i already mentioned the late 70's to early 80's segregation in the kingdom halls, but in the 90's clear through to now for instance:.
at bethel in the mid 90's if you listened to or were found with rap music you were gone, no questions asked.
Like mrsjones5, I am not surprised by the experiences others have related here. I saw the same thing while living in the Deep South. There was not just the black/white issue, but as has been noted, even among black Witnesses color mattered. Those who were lighter in color discriminated against and were discriminated against by those who were darker. That is a legacy handed down from the days of slavery in the United States and sadly still exists.
Being black myself, I know that many white Witnesses felt intimidated around me. I was the complete opposite of what they expected and may very well have wanted me to be. I was educated, well-traveled, a voracious reader and accomplished writer, not interested in playing football or basketball, was articulate, the best public speaker in the congregation, and spoke my mind. I still believe this played a big role in my never being appointed a ministerial servant let alone an elder. I did serve as a pioneer, however, and enjoyed that for two years before stepping down.
As for racism being tolerated and practiced at world headquarters, I have heard that for years. It goes all the way back to Russell’s day. People of color were not wanted at either the Pittsburgh or Brooklyn establishments. Some were invited in the latter part of Rutherford’s reign, but were always assigned to menial positions. Knorr was more liberal in that respect, but again, men of color were seldom used in high profile positions or entrusted with important responsibilities.
Sam Herd’s elevation to the Governing Body was a complete surprise to me and I still wonder how he managed it. As it is, no other men of color have been elected and I don’t expect that to change. And don’t even get me started on the intense misogyny and racism the ruling elite has toward women of color.
Quendi
in the october 1919 golden age magazine on page 8 under "negro education in cincinnati" said the following " a wise segregation is probably an advantage to all concerned" the article is about a school for african americans.
my computer would not let me cut and paste the article here for some reason.
can someone help me and paste the article.
When I studied with the Witnesses, it was back in 1974 in Tuscaloosa, Alabama. The congregation I associated with had only integrated that year, having been composed entirely of black people before that. Integration was done by the WTS sending white publishers to attend meetings with the black congregation there. The Witnesses I talked to told me about the segregated congregations and circuits the WTS had in the Deep South and how that arrangement had ended only a few years prior to my study.
Mind you, the Jim Crow laws which mandated segregation in the South had been repealed back in the 1960s, but the WTS dragged its feet in following suit. The only integrated meetings Witnesses had were the district and international conventions back then. Strangely enough, many (though not all) Witnesses on both sides of the color line were content with the arrangement. I think the only reason changes were made was because of the rapid influx of new people—this was the pre-1975 period when hundreds of thousands were getting baptized—and these new converts demanded an end to the racist arrangement.
There was some resistance, especially from old-timers who liked things the way they had been. But once the decision was made to integrate, the rank-and-file fell in line and there was very little friction or trouble. After all, the proof of the pudding is in the eating, and Witnesses realized they couldn’t preach a new world of peace and harmony if they weren’t willing to live that way themselves. They were going to have to practice what they preached if their message was to ring true.
But even with integrated circuits many congregations remained segregated. Much of that was due to the housing patterns in the South which remained largely unchanged. So local congregations tended to reflect the demographics of the communities that composed their territories. That also reinforced many cultural differences and stereotypes. From what I could see when I lived in Alabama in 2012, most Witness congregations are still segregated.
Quendi
as the information age is apon us and it doesn't take that much information to easily prove this new light by the governing body granting them absolute loyalty and power is a blatant power grab by a bunch of over the hill ego maniacs i see a revolt in the making..
Like Gromit, it took being disfellowshipped for me to finally realize this was not “Jehovah’s organization.” I had gone back to college and earned my diploma before being put out, and that has served me well. I wonder how matters would stand if I had no degree to fall back on.
As for the possibility of a revolt, I think for many, if not most, Witnesses this old Caribbean proverb applies: “Not to know is bad; not to want to know is worse.” I still repeat this to my students and it applies with even more force to rank-and-file Witnesses. Many are deliberately and blissfully ignorant and choose to remain that way. When they detect even a whiff of TTATT, they run away, letting their fear overwhelm their thinking.
Steve2 is right to say that there are some thoughtful people in the cult who know it is completely false and are quietly making their way to the exits. I’m sure they have shared their feelings and findings with some, but most know that very few Witnesses will listen to them. The best thing they can do is get out and follow their own life path. That’s the course I’ve taken and am much better off for doing so.
Quendi
is that for real?
i swear i read it in a magazine article directed towards teenagers.
it was a while back, maybe a year or two.
You don’t even have to take a close look at the ranks of Jehovah’s Witnesses to see that their “worldwide unity” has indeed led to the “stifling of individuality” and the “crushing of initiative.” Their cult does not foster, nurture or promote either of these things. The organization intrudes into every aspect of a person’s life, even the most intimate and private ones. Upon presenting themselves for baptism, candidates are required to pledge fealty to the “spirit-directed” organization. That says all anyone needs to know about how individuality is viewed by the leadership. They don’t want it.
Quendi
