DesirousOfChange

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Posts by DesirousOfChange

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  109

  Why disfellowship must be eliminated for the survival of the WT itself

  by TheScientist in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  this topic i digress about why the watchtower relaxing the rules of disfellowship is essential for its survival.

  many things i'm going to say are not my ideas, some are, the point is, i'm condensing everything in a logical and concise way.. the first thing we have to keep in mind is that the wt's main objective in instituting disfellowship has always been not to lose members because of the damage that a dissident could do, or to avoid gaining new members because of the bad reputation of a confessed sinner in the his/her region.

  in the end, the more active members, the more money to the coffers.. in this case of disfellowship due to apostasy, to avoid any spark, texts were sought out of context that even prohibited saying "hi".

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  DesirousOfChange

  Who’s got the money to donate nowadays? Just living is expensive and add to the problem is uneducated low paid Jehovah’s Witnesses that aren’t allowed to work overtime to get ahead. There ain’t much left over at the end of the month.

  This speaks a different story than I see in our area. It's difficult to hire people. Much more difficult to hire honest, dependable people. When you find that kind of employee, you pay them well or they move on to someone who will. We have younger (30's) JWs who are doing quite well. Many taking cruises and international vacations. They have nice homes and nice cars. I am quite sure they are contributing regularly and I think there is a pride among some about how much they can contribute.
  

  
  

  I know of one single sister who was converted by studying in prison, so she has a felony on her record. She has had no trouble getting work and was recently hired by a larger industrial manufacturing firm here which is union and so she's making the best paychecks that she ever has. Even before that job, she was concerned about ONLY contributing $100/month.

  
  

  Many younger JWs are in the construction trades here and earning $50,000+ and good health & retirement benefits. Quite a few are self employed in service businesses, ie cleaning (those people earn good money here as an average home pays well over $100), dog grooming, hair styling, etc. All of these young couples are living well. And likely contributing well.

  
  

  Why are they still JWs? Because they don't care about doctrine. Hell, they don't even know JW doctrine. Being a JW is their social network. They are not interested in being involved in things that are objectionable to JWs, ie, screwing around, overdrinking, or drugs (if you want MJ you get a medical card). And, the men are all receiving "privileges" in the Cong and feel good about themselves for it (and they get to wear a suit and tie). They can keep the Borg in the black for another (overlapping) generation.

  
  

  
  
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  18

  Another kingdom hall up for sale

  by pepperheart in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  hi another kingsom hall is up for sale if you look in the rightmove property website and look for bradford in the uk you will see that its priced at £170,000.. but why should they need to be selling a kingdom hall off espically when they are not printing about 50 million magazines a month they vant be that short of money can they ?

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  DesirousOfChange

  Do you recall several years ago there was the discussion that 100s or 1000s of new Kingdom Halls were needed and the new commercial design was released.

  Where are all these new "look like a bank" Kingdom Halls?

  

  
  
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  266

  Where is Tony?

  by Athanasius in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  on february 22, 2023, anthony morris iii was officially removed from the governing body of jehovah's witnesses.

  a few months later it was revealed that the watchtower bought him a house in lumberton, north carolina.. however, and correct me if i am wrong, since leaving the gb nobody has reported seeing tony attending jw meetings or participating in field service.

  in fact nobody has reported seeing him anywhere, not even at a local liquor store.

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  DesirousOfChange

  Any good conversation starters anyone??

  Watcha doing later? I happen to have just picked up a bottle of Macallan 18.
  
  
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  109

  Why disfellowship must be eliminated for the survival of the WT itself

  by TheScientist in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  this topic i digress about why the watchtower relaxing the rules of disfellowship is essential for its survival.

  many things i'm going to say are not my ideas, some are, the point is, i'm condensing everything in a logical and concise way.. the first thing we have to keep in mind is that the wt's main objective in instituting disfellowship has always been not to lose members because of the damage that a dissident could do, or to avoid gaining new members because of the bad reputation of a confessed sinner in the his/her region.

  in the end, the more active members, the more money to the coffers.. in this case of disfellowship due to apostasy, to avoid any spark, texts were sought out of context that even prohibited saying "hi".

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  DesirousOfChange

  I believe there is a greater incentive for WT to cool it on disfellowshipping/shunning. They are being labeled as an "extremist" sect/cult/religion -- particularly in Russia at the moment. While no one really cares about what happens in Russia, as it can be spun as "persecution", but WT is getting lots of negative reviews/publicity in other more western nations too. The DF policy is seen as a violation of Human Rights and as political views lean more and more liberal on such matters, they realize they may face legal action by the State against them, ie, loss of charitable status. (OMG! Don't do anything to put the WT funds at risk!)

  WT has already backpedaled on taking DF action against anyone who accepts a blood transfusion in a life-or-death situation -- as long as they "repent" for their sin/weakness. I believe this all started with their compromise in 1998 on the "blood policy" with Bulgaria and the European Human Rights Commission when they promised that JWs could have "free choice to have transfusions without control or sanction" by WT. This is an issue that WT would like laid to rest.

  Hopefully, their policy of shunning for any other "sins" will also become to be seen as a human rights issue to authorities. The only way to affect change at WT is to hit them where it hurts -- their pocketbook. Legal action lawsuits by governmental authorities and the risk of charitable status are a double whammy to them. The fact that it may not cause too much harm within the Congregation is merely a favorable byproduct for them.
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  26

  Jeffrey Jackson: Too much excitement got in the way for the ''false dates''

  by RULES & REGULATIONS in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  annual meeting 2019—talks and 2020 year textthe governing body members are nothing but a bunch of weasels.

  here is a talk by jeffrey jackson on how the governing body ''the slave class'' has remained spiritually awake over 100 years and alerted its members.. he looks back on the ''faithful and discreet slaves'' false dates over the 100 years: '' but at times, we look back over 100 years, and there were times they got excited about a certain year or time, and the end didn't come at that time.''.

  he makes the comparison between the ''slave class ( who disappointed others when the end didn't come ) to a barking watchdog ( who in his enthusiasm barks at nothing in the middle of the night and wakes up the owner).

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  DesirousOfChange

  

  
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  62

  So what happens next...

  by Farmer Jim1 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  with what is arguably the biggest change to jw life in recent decades (the scrapping of publishers counting hours) what does this lead to?.

  in my mind these are the results;.

  1) a massive decrease in 'preaching hours'.

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  DesirousOfChange

  I kind of doubt they have any concerns about the ones that are leaving. Most were not likely contributing anything for some time. WT is more concerned about losing contributing members, vs losing hanger-on's that were (if anything) just a drain on resources.

  We know of a young couple who were awakened to TTATT who gradually went from PIMO to POMO. As long as their regular continuing monthly contribution was made via the website, no one noticed their "fade". When they canceled their long time contribution, the elders were immediately calling to attempt a shepherding call.

  
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  266

  Where is Tony?

  by Athanasius in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  on february 22, 2023, anthony morris iii was officially removed from the governing body of jehovah's witnesses.

  a few months later it was revealed that the watchtower bought him a house in lumberton, north carolina.. however, and correct me if i am wrong, since leaving the gb nobody has reported seeing tony attending jw meetings or participating in field service.

  in fact nobody has reported seeing him anywhere, not even at a local liquor store.

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  DesirousOfChange

  You can buy cameras designed just for this they can be as small as and in the shape of dice from a board game. Just drive past in the early hours and set them facing the houses. They are motion capture so only start recording when someone comes in or out of the door. Battery lasts for days.

  Likely they and/or the neighbors have a Ring doorbell that will catch you in the act.
  
  
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  87

  Lines you would never hear from a Jehovah's Witness

  by Ron.W. in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  a slightly tongue in cheek, but also serious roundup of jw speak and why trying to reason with them is like trying to chip through concrete with a plastic spoon.. how many can you think of??.

  elder: 'yes.

  i read through the material you asked me to at your judicial meeting - you're right we're both in a cult!

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  DesirousOfChange

  "Do you think the guys up there in New York have made a mistake [in their predictions about The End Times]"?

  Years ago you would have never heard such a thing. More recently, I think it's being heard, though in a whisper. I do know of one longtime elderly JW who asked that on his/her deathbed. Faithful until death. Sad. A life wasted.

  Another one having to enter the Paradise via "The Underground".

  
  
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  34

  Next change?

  by JW_Rogue in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  so, first the turning in time got axed, now beards are okay, what is up next?

  women wearing dress slacks to the meeting?

  birthdays becoming acceptable?

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  DesirousOfChange

  I do not see any further watering down of the Blood Doctrine. It is already at the point that if a person agrees to a transfusion in a life threatening situation (weakness) all they must do is say "I'm sinned and I'm sorry." and does not become a matter for a judicial committee. And if a person will not do that, then they are considered as someone who no longer desires to be considered one of Jehovah's Witnesses (DAd). Only speaking against the doctrine (apostacy) will get you DF.

  They do not want any claims of violating human rights.
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  124

  JWLITE

  by Teddnzo in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  even elders can be part of the new jw lite brigade these days.

  they don’t need to go on door to door anymore and there is no requirement for anything really.. taking meeting parts is all dead easy you could turn up on the day with zero preparation because it’s all in the meeting workbook.. quarterly elders meetings are just old men having a good old natter just like old men do down the pub.. congregations could be likened to pubs or bars these days just without the drinks, those come at other times.. no need for territory maps, these almost went away with covid letter writing now they are extremely slow getting finished as those who still go door to door only do ten mins.. you could even voice your questions these days about things the gb say and then just say “we can’t be dogmatic we just don’t know”.

  i predict they will say this about 1914 soon..

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  DesirousOfChange

  No more shunning, birthdays are a borderline just call them happy days ~ Jehovaxx

  They just had a WT article about using a birthday event to "witness" about why they do not celebrate them. Still, I think a lot of R&F do exactly what you suggest -- kinda "don't ask, don't tell".

  But on shunning I see no softening EXCEPT in their public statements. The policy of shunning is causing them a lot of grief in many countries, so they are trying to "have it both ways". In public they proclaim that they do NOT shun, but in reality we all know "the truth" of the matter. Many in a very personal way. WT is going to try to spin it as a "personal decision" of each member. They no longer want to be seen as instigating or promoting or even requiring any family member to be shunned. It's Bad Publicity for them, and more and more often causing legal issues.